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Post by jeromemason on Jun 1, 2014 20:15:57 GMT -6
I'm hitting it pretty hard.... when I originally gain staged everything I could start to hear clipping with a 1khz tone at about -6, but when I'm mixing I go well above that..... that's where I'm finding that point where things start to feel really good. I think I mistook harmonic goodness for clipping honestly.... yeah I'm a dumbass like that sometimes. Pretty much what tonycamphd said though.... just bang the hell out of it until you start to feel it sounding good. I don't use an actual master fader that PT calls a master fader though I should say. I use an Aux as my master because that's the return for my summing rig. I usually set it to be like -0.2db and I just watch my buss comp and I've always got an L2 on there. I'm only "using" the L2, to just to keep it from actually clipping, that let's me hit it hard, it might be taking like a 1-2db off. I use to mix with a lot of head room in PT but these days I'm up at the top, which I'm sure would piss off the mastering guys, but I must confess, before I send anything I'll usually put an actual master fader in and pull it down so it prints like I mixed at around -8  |
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Post by scumbum on Jun 1, 2014 21:52:35 GMT -6
I'm hitting it pretty hard.... when I originally gain staged everything I could start to hear clipping with a 1khz tone at about -6, but when I'm mixing I go well above that..... that's where I'm finding that point where things start to feel really good. I think I mistook harmonic goodness for clipping honestly.... yeah I'm a dumbass like that sometimes. Pretty much what tonycamphd said though.... just bang the hell out of it until you start to feel it sounding good. I don't use an actual master fader that PT calls a master fader though I should say. I use an Aux as my master because that's the return for my summing rig. I usually set it to be like -0.2db and I just watch my buss comp and I've always got an L2 on there. I'm only "using" the L2, to just to keep it from actually clipping, that let's me hit it hard, it might be taking like a 1-2db off. I use to mix with a lot of head room in PT but these days I'm up at the top, which I'm sure would piss off the mastering guys, but I must confess, before I send anything I'll usually put an actual master fader in and pull it down so it prints like I mixed at around -8 haha.....pulls down the master fader to fool the Mastering guy.... Ok I'm confused . I thought we had to gain stage (run EVERYTHING) at -20 . Record at -20 , then when you put a comp plugin on that track make sure the plugin output is -20 before it hits the next plugin EQ.....and so on .....keep the chain at around -20 , because thats what the original analog equipment was made to run at . I learned all this from that thread on the Devil Purple site , heres a quote from that thread : "The Reason Most ITB mixes don’t Sound as good as Analog mixes (restored)" "Now to ITB. Lets pretend we have the same setup as we did on the SSL. Client hands you a session that’s recorded hot as hell. Now most folks mixing ITB don't understand reference levels when relating it to Digital. To have the same amount of "headroom" as we do on the SSL we must create a reference of 0VU or 1.23 volts at -20 from 0DBFS or the top of the Digital scale. So if you simply place the good old trim plugin as the very first plugin, you now have the ability to adjust your tracks to our Mixing (+4/1.23 volt) reference IE -20. Just like you did on the SSL. You have have the same amount of headroom. Now with your tracks properly gain staged, you can add EQ/dynamic plugins and not run out of headroom. You can also insert hardware and they will operate much better as they are operating at the level they were designed to operate at. Plugins use the same reference at real equipment. Never try and drive them to the top of the Digital scale. Don't try and make your mix look like a master. You don't do that on an analog console, so why do we do it ITB? The answer is simple. DAW meters suck Butt. There should be a meter mode in all DAW's that makes the meter at 3/4 scale equal -20 at 1.23 volts. Just like the old VU. This way, novices will quit corn-holeing their levels. Something to think about. The noise floor of an analog desk is about -75 DB from our +4 reference. Our equivalent "problem level" below our -20 reference in digital is well over 100 DB. So please don't let people tell you analog has more "headroom" than digital. This is simply not true. Headroom is only relative to your noise floor below your reference. Remember if the volume is to low, turn up the darn speaker volume. Running a Digital mix right to the top of the scale is like running your SSL mix buss where the VU meters are slammed all the way to the right and you are constantly hitting it at +25. No one will get a good sounding running the desk like that. You won’t get a good sounding mix in digital either. So what does all this mean? Put simply, proper gain staging is essential to both analog and digital mixing. You just need to correlate the references between the two. Once you figure this out, I'll Guarantee your mixes will start to sound open and wide, just like the good old analog days." |
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Post by tonycamphd on Jun 1, 2014 23:58:21 GMT -6
scumbum according to jim williams my modded delta 200 has a 120db dynamic range and a 90db cross talk spec at 10K(the real mans testing ground lol) due to the discrete balanced summing design, it's unbelievably quiet, that said, it's still a little noisier than top of the line digital conversion, but specs better than an SSL console, yes, i said it specs better than an SSL 8) Comparing a stock channel to a modded channel is laughable when it comes to noise, focus or any other adjective you can think of. I feel I have one seriously nice console, i'm going to be building one of capi's aca summing busses into this rig so i can switch back n forth between super clean and punchy to API old school chewy punch. fun stuff!
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Post by scumbum on Jun 5, 2014 11:05:36 GMT -6
scumbum according to jim williams my modded delta 200 has a 120db dynamic range and a 90db cross talk spec at 10K(the real mans testing ground lol) due to the discrete balanced summing design, it's unbelievably quiet, that said, it's still a little noisier than top of the line digital conversion, but specs better than an SSL console, yes, i said it specs better than an SSL 8) Comparing a stock channel to a modded channel is laughable when it comes to noise, focus or any other adjective you can think of. I feel I have one seriously nice console, i'm going to be building one of capi's aca summing busses into this rig so i can switch back n forth between super clean and punchy to API old school chewy punch. fun stuff! That sounds crazy ! I've never heard of a console being able to have two different sounds built in like that . With the capi's aca summing buss will you pretty much have the sound of an api console ? |
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Post by scumbum on Jun 5, 2014 11:07:14 GMT -6
Here I found a video explaining digital gain staging .
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