grantb
Junior Member
Posts: 97
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Post by grantb on Jun 30, 2020 14:35:20 GMT -6
I recently built a Bumblebee RM-5 kit, my first ribbon mic. Wow, I love the sound of this thing!
Problem is, I'm recording (mostly hand drums/percussion) at home and my rooms all sound like trash cans of various sizes. I'd like to reduce the room sound I'm picking up.
Obvious solutions: 1. Treat the room or don't record in crap rooms. This is clearly the best choice as we can hear on all the lovely demos of the RM mics. Unfortunately I have to work with what I've got right now. 2. Use a more directional mic. I don't have many choices currently and other than the room sound I love the RM-5 sound, hence this post. Next purchase will probably be a 441 (any way to get a better price on a new one of these in the US?).
So I'm all ears for any other tips and techniques. I've read that blocking the rear vents won't work, and I haven't tried that yet. One of those stand mounted semi-cylinder mic isolator thingies?
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Post by indiehouse on Jun 30, 2020 14:45:01 GMT -6
Build some gobos.
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Post by jamiesego on Jun 30, 2020 14:51:37 GMT -6
Get an M160. Or you could try putting heavy blankets draped over a mic stand, or build some gobos. A mic isolator thing might work but I've never tried them.
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Post by EmRR on Jun 30, 2020 14:52:26 GMT -6
Remember that a figure 8 is exactly the same as a cardioid in terms of critical distance. It's a matter of which direction you get off-axis pickup from. Note it shows a figure 8 with an absorber panel on the back as having the furthest critical distance (excluding shotguns), so try it. Obviously the panel composition will have a minimum working frequency based on size and thickness, but it can help.
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Post by Guitar on Jun 30, 2020 15:50:17 GMT -6
Point the side nulls at the ugliest reflections in the room, the null in a figure 8 is very deep. Try making the room "longer" by picking up the longer stretches of the room and ignoring the shorter ones, if the room is shaped that way.
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grantb
Junior Member
Posts: 97
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Post by grantb on Jun 30, 2020 16:12:57 GMT -6
Thanks everyone for some good suggestions. I will try some more positions and try to rig up some sort of blocking.
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Post by hadaja on Jun 30, 2020 18:02:10 GMT -6
Remember that a figure 8 is exactly the same as a cardioid in terms of critical distance. It's a matter of which direction you get off-axis pickup from. Note it shows a figure 8 with an absorber panel on the back as having the furthest critical distance (excluding shotguns), so try it. Obviously the panel composition will have a minimum working frequency based on size and thickness, but it can help. So what does the So what does the 2.4 actually mean of the fig 8 with the absorber? i am not sure what the horizontal line is suppose to represent? Is it distance from source? thanks
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Post by EmRR on Jun 30, 2020 18:12:58 GMT -6
Remember that a figure 8 is exactly the same as a cardioid in terms of critical distance. It's a matter of which direction you get off-axis pickup from. Note it shows a figure 8 with an absorber panel on the back as having the furthest critical distance (excluding shotguns), so try it. Obviously the panel composition will have a minimum working frequency based on size and thickness, but it can help. So what does the 2.4 actually mean of the fig 8 with the absorber? i am not sure what the horizontal line is suppose to represent? Is it distance from source? thanks Distance. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Critical_distanceOmni is x1 distance, no pattern is less than x1. The others can be that x factor further away for same direct to reverberant as the omni. Of course pattern with respect to frequency comes into play.
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Post by bluegrassdan on Jun 30, 2020 18:32:46 GMT -6
Work on your room with some broadband absorption. All of your recordings will start sounding better.
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Post by bluegrassdan on Jun 30, 2020 18:36:26 GMT -6
Or...
Build a second RM-5, put them in Blumlein, and make the funky room sound a "thing."
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grantb
Junior Member
Posts: 97
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Post by grantb on Jun 30, 2020 19:57:18 GMT -6
Or... Build a second RM-5, put them in Blumlein, and make the funky room sound a "thing." I might just do that. I've just walked around with my claves and found a spot in one corner that sounds pretty good.
Love your demos of these mics BTW!
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Post by drumsound on Jun 30, 2020 22:59:21 GMT -6
Along with using the nulls packing blankets on mic stands until you get some proper treatment.
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Post by sirthought on Jul 1, 2020 6:55:12 GMT -6
Funny how so many of you choose to suggest a different mic. Doesn't help him now and he likes his mic. LOL
You obviously need to soften the room's reverb. Gobos, wall treatment, a mattress, blankets anything to soften the room sound. The placement advice is also essential.
But there are different plugins too that can remove room reverb in an audio track. iZotope Rx, Acon Digital Acoustica and DeVerberate, SPL De-Verb, and UAD Precision Stereo K are ones that come to mind. Sometimes the results can work wonders.
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Post by Ward on Jul 1, 2020 7:19:43 GMT -6
Too many folks doing it on their own (DIY audio recordists) put most their money into gear and not nearly enough into room treatment.
A good room makes everything sound better.
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Post by EmRR on Jul 1, 2020 8:49:24 GMT -6
Hand drums in a small room will definitely have saturating transients that create obvious reverberant intrusions. Much tougher than many other sources.
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grantb
Junior Member
Posts: 97
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Post by grantb on Jul 1, 2020 9:40:13 GMT -6
Too many folks doing it on their own (DIY audio recordists) put most their money into gear and not nearly enough into room treatment. A good room makes everything sound better. You're not wrong. Unfortunately, effectively treating any of my rooms isn't really an option if I want to preserve matrimonial integrity. I have one office/studio/electronics workbench room that's so crammed with gear and stuff there's no wall space left. The other rooms are family living spaces which would require a lot of modification to sound good. I need to focus on solutions which can be set up and torn down quickly and don't take up too much storage space. I think hanging up some heavy blankets will be about as far as I can go short of adding on to the house.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2020 9:40:23 GMT -6
Along with using the nulls packing blankets on mic stands until you get some proper treatment. This. I've recorded in a lot (a lot) of shitty sounding spaces. Always had a pile of packing blankets in my trunk. Works pretty well. Just hang them on everything. Are your rooms empty? Put stuff in it. In lieu of professional absorption and diffusion, it will be better than an empty un-treated space. Way back when, I used to flip my futon mattress agains the wall and point the instrument, singer, amp, or whatever it was toward it.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2020 9:45:35 GMT -6
Too many folks doing it on their own (DIY audio recordists) put most their money into gear and not nearly enough into room treatment. A good room makes everything sound better. You're not wrong. Unfortunately, effectively treating any of my rooms isn't really an option if I want to preserve matrimonial integrity. I have one office/studio/electronics workbench room that's so crammed with gear and stuff there's no wall space left. The other rooms are family living spaces which would require a lot of modification to sound good. I need to focus on solutions which can be set up and torn down quickly and don't take up too much storage space. I think hanging up some heavy blankets will be about as far as I can go short of adding on to the house. You could get some 2x4 panels and put them on legs so that you can move them around and store them somewhere when not in use. You'd be surprised how much difference even just a couple of them makes. Especially if you put them in close proximity to the back side of the fig8 and set up the source you're recording near them.
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grantb
Junior Member
Posts: 97
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Post by grantb on Jul 1, 2020 9:48:44 GMT -6
Hand drums in a small room will definitely have saturating transients that create obvious reverberant intrusions. Much tougher than many other sources. Yes, this is the heart of the problem right here. I have recorded quieter sounds in the house before and got decent results. Drums really need a good room or a surround of big gobos. It's funny, last night I watched a random video about hand drums where the presenter referred to them as "outdoor instruments".
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Post by Ward on Jul 1, 2020 10:02:07 GMT -6
Too many folks doing it on their own (DIY audio recordists) put most their money into gear and not nearly enough into room treatment. A good room makes everything sound better. You're not wrong. Unfortunately, effectively treating any of my rooms isn't really an option if I want to preserve matrimonial integrity. I have one office/studio/electronics workbench room that's so crammed with gear and stuff there's no wall space left. The other rooms are family living spaces which would require a lot of modification to sound good. I need to focus on solutions which can be set up and torn down quickly and don't take up too much storage space. I think hanging up some heavy blankets will be about as far as I can go short of adding on to the house. email me some pictures and I'll find some cost-effective treatments that won't break the bank or cause marital distress. I've had a series of high maintenance partners and know how careful a person has to be, financially. Not saying that's your situation . . . but offering help just in case.
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Post by christopher on Jul 1, 2020 11:10:23 GMT -6
In addition to all the advice, My experience is if you don’t want a ton of room bleed, don’t use like a normal overhead with higher distance and capsule aimed down at the drums. you’ll get a massive amount of reflection from the ceiling. Your gonna have to get up close to the source, and keep the capsule somewhat vertical so the nulls are aimed toward floor and ceiling. I might use it as a close mic, side of rim with maybe a slight angle? (Maybe not too close, depends how fragile the mic is /how loud the source )Lots of ideas. Also... you’ll learn this the hard way, like I did: always watch where the rear side of the mic is facing, if you don’t want that instrument mixed into your track.
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Post by the other mark williams on Jul 1, 2020 15:51:19 GMT -6
Hand drums in a small room will definitely have saturating transients that create obvious reverberant intrusions. Much tougher than many other sources. Totally. And I think recording acoustic guitars in such a room is just about as difficult.
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grantb
Junior Member
Posts: 97
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Post by grantb on Jul 1, 2020 16:24:21 GMT -6
Thanks for your suggestions everyone. Today I hung two heavy blankets from the curtain rod in the deadest corner of the biggest room and backed the mic up against that, similar to the diagram Doug posted. Sounds totally decent! Turns out I just needed to put my dunce cap on and sit on a stool facing the corner.
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Post by Ward on Jul 1, 2020 18:45:25 GMT -6
grantb = put down an area rug! There must be an inexpensive outlet store in your area where you can get one. Doesn't have to be pretty or thick, but just enough to absorb early reflections off the floor. it was one of the earliest remedies.
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Post by jsteiger on Jul 1, 2020 18:53:30 GMT -6
Thanks for your suggestions everyone. Today I hung two heavy blankets from the curtain rod in the deadest corner of the biggest room and backed the mic up against that, similar to the diagram Doug posted. Sounds totally decent! Turns out I just needed to put my dunce cap on and sit on a stool facing the corner. I see a Mogaine!! \m/
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