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Post by kcatthedog on Dec 16, 2019 6:22:47 GMT -6
JohnKen pull this if you find it too implicitly political.
When we talk about sales and trying save a few bucks, I talk about my Myusaddress and short drive to Ogdensburg but which requires crossing the border.
Over the last year, the border crossing experience for a simple retail purchase of American goods is becoming more and more difficult up to including life time bans , without really requiring a reason or the breaking of any law: just an arbitrary decision by a low level staff member.
Here is some commentary about some recent info from a Rutger’s PHD student:
“A Ph. D. candidate at Rutgers University is sounding the alarm about a new Canada U.S. Preclearance Agreement at border crossings.
H.M. Jocelyn tells the CBC, Canadians need to pay attention to their "withering" rights.
Jocelyn says under the deal, U-S border guards operating in preclearance zones on Canadian soil can now carry guns, conduct strip searches, keep passenger information, and detain Canadian citizens.
She notes, even if a Canadian border agent is unwilling to conduct a search or has determined detainment is unnecessary, a U.S. official can override the call.
The agreement also ends our right of withdrawal.
Up until now if we were uncomfortable with a line of questioning, we could opt to return to Canada, but that option is no longer available under the terms of the preclearance agreement.“
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Post by svart on Dec 16, 2019 8:47:40 GMT -6
While I don't condone this, I can explain the tactic of no longer allowing withdrawal.
If someone wants to find a weakness in a defense, you "probe" it. In this case, you can move from checkpoint to checkpoint and find lazy border security by engaging the guards and then withdrawing once you've found the limit of their abilities. Say you want to get a bunch of drugs/people/money through but most checkpoints are very good at finding hidden items in vehicles, but you find the one checkpoint where the guards are short-staffed and doing less-than-stellar inspections by probing it a few times with small things like prohibited plants/fruits or things that won't really land you in jail, but will turn you around at the border.
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Post by kcatthedog on Dec 16, 2019 9:24:13 GMT -6
I am fine with due diligence, but it’s getting out of hand and a number of Canadians have received life time travel bans for essentially nothing, no trial, no charge , nuthin, really just a pissy border guard: silly.
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Post by svart on Dec 16, 2019 9:29:13 GMT -6
I am fine with due diligence, but it’s getting out of hand and a number of Canadians have received life time travel bans for essentially nothing, no trial, no charge , nuthin, really just a pissy border guard: silly. Yeah it's a shame. However, as an american, we've always had it rough coming back from Canada. Going over is no sweat. Coming back even we get grilled about everything. Mostly it's the guards trying to figure out if you're dodging taxes, etc. It's a lot cheaper to fly to a place like Burlington and drive over to Montreal than it is to fly there, so I've done that a few times for work (nice scenery too) and I get stopped and searched and questioned every single time coming back.
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Post by kcatthedog on Dec 16, 2019 10:47:29 GMT -6
Yes.unfortunate both ways.
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Post by drbill on Dec 16, 2019 11:36:35 GMT -6
Border crossings are getting more difficult worldwide. Not as easy as it used to be. That's the cost of terrorism, and illegal goods coming in from other parts of the world. (As a side note, Canada has made it VERY difficult for me to get into the country with my gear in the past.... I got back into the US with no problems. Ha! Go figure.)
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Post by Tbone81 on Dec 16, 2019 13:51:59 GMT -6
I know quite a few people (US Citizens) who have been turned away at the Canada border for having past DUI’s so it goes both ways...but generally, yeah...US Border Patrol has always been rough.
When I got stopped by Border Patrol in Germany they very politely searched my bags, apologized for wrinkling my clothes and wished me a good day.
When I got stopped coming back into the US from Mexico, they emptied my bags onto dirty the pavement, had some dogs sniff through stuff (literally spread out in the street) and then told me, “grab your shit and get the fuck out of here”.
So yeah, they could stand to be a little nicer all around.
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Post by Bat Lanyard on Dec 16, 2019 20:10:50 GMT -6
Border crossings are getting more difficult worldwide. Not as easy as it used to be. That's the cost of terrorism, and illegal goods coming in from other parts of the world. (As a side note, Canada has made it VERY difficult for me to get into the country with my gear in the past.... I got back into the US with no problems. Ha! Go figure.) Had the exact opposite going to Toronto earlier this year with a 3-space rack. Leaving US was normal, coming back I got the "everything but your prostate" search and then got detained for a bit. Evidently a Burl B2 and Chandler Cassette set off the alarms.
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Post by drbill on Dec 16, 2019 21:02:12 GMT -6
Heh Heh.... Yup, gone are the easy times. I have vivid memories of pulling up to most any hub airport in the US, usually running late, and flagging down a skycap - I got to know a lot of em over the years - slipping them a hundie and the all band's tickets, tell them to watch out : there was 5 more scruffy musicians coming with another 20+ pieces of heavy cases - and let them know another hundred was coming their way when I got back. Then I'd leave. There were very rarely any problems, hassles or holdups. Only "thank you sir!!!" And when I did get back from parking the car, all the overweight luggage was checked, baggage tags neatly organized via band member, the band and I were already checked in, and set up to go. Those days are gone forever. Now....musician? Gear? Yeah, please step out of line for a......... Strip Search!!!! Hahaaaa!!
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Post by mcirish on Dec 17, 2019 9:16:41 GMT -6
Border crossings are getting more difficult worldwide. Not as easy as it used to be. That's the cost of terrorism, and illegal goods coming in from other parts of the world. (As a side note, Canada has made it VERY difficult for me to get into the country with my gear in the past.... I got back into the US with no problems. Ha! Go figure.) Agreed on this! We got stopped while on a tour, where we were going to visit friends in Canada and then head to Rochester, NY. The border guard in Canada kept us there an hour and nearly made us empty the trailer. They wanted to confiscate all merch because they thought we might try to sell it in Canada. Tough times to cross borders.
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Post by keymod on Dec 17, 2019 9:47:02 GMT -6
1987 My very pregnant (ex) wife and I decided to take a drive up to Prince Edward's Island. Canadian guards detained us for several hours, made us get out of the car while they dismantled a large portion of it, emptied and searched our luggage and even had a female guard examine my wife's belly to make sure it wasn't a fake place to hide something. A few days later, while we were driving around up there, we got pulled over by police for no reason except to search our car and question us as to why we were there, etc.... I vowed never to go back again.
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Post by kcatthedog on Dec 17, 2019 10:14:12 GMT -6
That’s terrible , sorry that happened, the maritime are normally known for friendliness and down home hospitality.
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Post by mcirish on Dec 17, 2019 12:15:53 GMT -6
I love Canadians and have many wonderful friends there. The border guards are another story. Never had trouble getting back into the US, but getting into Canada was such a problem last time that we avoided it on our last two tours. That's a shame because I'd love to spend time with friends there.
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Post by Bender on Dec 17, 2019 13:10:56 GMT -6
But, Canadians are so nice lol. In anycase. Perhaps this should be moved to "off topic"?
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Post by kcatthedog on Dec 17, 2019 13:36:55 GMT -6
Omg, did I post in the wrong thread, please allow me to apologize: I’m so sorry , no, really, sorry!
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Post by Guitar on Dec 17, 2019 14:01:20 GMT -6
I vote kcatthedog as moderator of the RGO "Canada Connection" sub forum!
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Post by jcoutu1 on Dec 17, 2019 14:05:12 GMT -6
I vote kcatthedog as moderator of the RGO "Canada Connection" sub forum! I wanna be moderator of RGO Missed Connections sub.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 17, 2019 14:14:19 GMT -6
First time I went with my band, it was a pain in the ass. They held us for a couple hours and searched the car very overzealously. All I brought was a guitar and 2 pedals that I can't live without. We left everything else at home and planned ahead to borrow gear at the show. I had to lie to them about why the guitar was in the trunk. They grilled all of us about it. Good cop, bad cop routine. So ridiculous.
The second time I went with my band (2 bands actually), we brought ALL of our gear with an itemized manifest full of serial #'s and all that. We were there for like 1/2 hour, no questioning (one of us didn't have a passport or enhanced license, just a birth cert), didn't even open the car doors to look inside.
I don't think there's much rhyme or reason to it other than some boarder guards are assholes. I live just south of the Adirondack park and there is sometimes a sort of pop-up a "border crossing" like 5 exits SOUTH of the Canadian border (close to Plattsburgh) where they (Americans) will stop and grill you about whatever they feel like. That is totally unacceptable.
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Post by Quint on Dec 17, 2019 15:54:14 GMT -6
I vote kcatthedog as moderator of the RGO "Canada Connection" sub forum! I wanna be moderator of RGO Missed Connections sub. I'll volunteer to moderate RGO Casual Encounters.
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Post by kcatthedog on Dec 17, 2019 19:55:31 GMT -6
Orange is next to red=commies!!
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Post by sirthought on Dec 17, 2019 21:43:06 GMT -6
Bands crossing from USA into Canada, remember the #1 border guard trigger: Orange Amps Bad 😂 I'm guessing there is a joke I'm not clued into.
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