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Post by Johnkenn on Nov 23, 2019 20:23:47 GMT -6
You didn't like my approach? Sometimes I don’t notice peeps with no avatars. Hint hint
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Post by saltyjames on Nov 23, 2019 20:27:44 GMT -6
..I'm on it.
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Post by Johnkenn on Nov 23, 2019 20:28:52 GMT -6
Honestly, there seems to be a sweet spot in pricing...high enough to weed out the complete novices/paranoids (you’re trying to screw them) and the uber high end client that expects it to sound like the latest Pink record regardless of the material.
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Post by saltyjames on Nov 23, 2019 20:29:25 GMT -6
I had a client who hired a session bass player and then insisted he take out all the high end from the bass while tracking. I explained this was not a good idea as the bass would be inaudible when playing back on many portable devices with limited bass response and advised to leave any major EQ decisions until mixing. Anyway I was overruled by the client who insisted I didn't know what I was talking about. So we provide the roughs and then a week later she comes back into the studio asks why there is no bass on the mix. I said there was and asked her what she was playing the track on. She said her iPhone and iPad speakers - not headphones. She then held up her iPhone with the track playing and says "See. There's no bass!" I then got her to Bluetooth her phone through our control monitors and "Voila! Bass!" However she kept arguing why she couldn't hear it on her iPhone speakers and asked me what I was going to do about it and I pointed out that she got exactly what she asked for. ie Inaudible bass playback on cellphone speakers! Those are the PITA clients I don't miss! Sorry... I have to According to Guiness: The farthest distance that a mobile phone has been thrown in competition is 110.42 m (362 ft 3 in) – the length of a soccer pitch – by javelin thrower Dries Feremans (Belgium) at the National Mobile Phone Throwing Championships in Kessel-Lo, Belgium, on 27 August 2014. Carry on.
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Post by Johnkenn on Nov 23, 2019 20:29:57 GMT -6
A pic of a pissed off Rick James would be the bomb lol
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Post by saltyjames on Nov 23, 2019 20:55:33 GMT -6
Meow!
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Post by Ward on Nov 26, 2019 10:13:08 GMT -6
I'm certain you've all experienced similar nightmares to some of mine, where you get the grocery list of changes and things needing to be done . . . and you get through all that after cursing under your breath, and then another list magically appears, and i jus doesn't stop. Some folks are so dissatisfied with their own work that someone or something else must be to blame, so they keep going and going trying to reshape things so that the real problems are covered up.
Or so it would seem . . .
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Post by christopher on Nov 26, 2019 12:30:56 GMT -6
I don’t know man, I think I’d just tell them i might not be their guy. It’s too bad because it’s basically done, he put you in charge, now he’s getting stupid. Every time I walk away from an artist or project, then I hear the final result where they went somewhere else I feel kind of sorry. I mean the results usually sound decent audio quality but like a complete newbie was in charge of the mix. Then I always kick myself a tiny bit, and think.. why couldn’t I get them over that hurdle? As a producer I’m the manager, I’m supposed to steer these children. Damn it! But I hear ya, don’t blame you at all if you walk! Not at all! There’s an interview on YouTube with George Martin in the 80s. He was hanging out with John Lennon after the Beatles broke up and Lennon told him he wanted to re-record all the Beatles songs, that he hated the sound of all of them. It was a constant thing with Lennon I guess.. the Beatles may never been have released if it were up to him!
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Post by theshea on Nov 26, 2019 13:20:04 GMT -6
the shea, Is that you playing Every tears a hit album? It's great!!! thanks. yeah, that's me and my "solobandproject". all done by myself: writing, playing, recording, producing ... thanks for listening.
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Post by saltyjames on Nov 26, 2019 14:27:58 GMT -6
Wow..
Now I don't like you anymore.
I keed, I keed. Great work!!!!!
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Post by jeremygillespie on Nov 26, 2019 16:30:51 GMT -6
I'm certain you've all experienced similar nightmares to some of mine, where you get the grocery list of changes and things needing to be done . . . and you get through all that after cursing under your breath, and then another list magically appears, and i jus doesn't stop. Some folks are so dissatisfied with their own work that someone or something else must be to blame, so they keep going and going trying to reshape things so that the real problems are covered up. Or so it would seem . . . Yes Yes And yes
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Post by jampa on Nov 26, 2019 17:39:48 GMT -6
Great post Chad. I know my production work has helped my job and vice versa, they're both project based
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Post by spindrift on Nov 26, 2019 17:48:33 GMT -6
I'm certain you've all experienced similar nightmares to some of mine, where you get the grocery list of changes and things needing to be done . . . and you get through all that after cursing under your breath, and then another list magically appears, and i jus doesn't stop. Some folks are so dissatisfied with their own work that someone or something else must be to blame, so they keep going and going trying to reshape things so that the real problems are covered up. Or so it would seem . . . My only "bad" experience working with an artist came down to this type of scenario. After the 4th set of mix revisions, I gave him a full refund. He ended up re-tracking all his self-recorded work and mixing at a different place in a bigger market....and it STILL sounded the same. I heard the mixes, recognized important pieces that I had tracked and still got stiffed on any credits or appreciation for all the time & effort I put into his multi-year triple album project. The "triple album" part should have been a red flag....
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Post by rowmat on Nov 26, 2019 18:07:15 GMT -6
The reality is most creative types have some degree of narcissism. Usually grandiose in the form of the loud frontman or covert/vunerable in the case of the oversensitive "gonna change the world with my deep and meaningful songs" type.
Go on. Deny it! 😎
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Post by Guitar on Nov 26, 2019 18:22:23 GMT -6
The reality is most creative types have some degree of narcissism. Usually grandiose in the form of the loud frontman or covert/vunerable in the case of the oversensitive "gonna change the world with my deep and meaningful songs" type. Go on. Deny it! 😎 It is a rampant personality flaw (disorder?) in music. There was a raging person of the type on RGO for a while that finally got banned, I wont name names. Anyway, I know it too well from personal experience. Every one of my bands I've been in has had a big narcissist. Sometimes I wonder if it's needed in some way, to keep things going in a certain direction. Some very successful musicians fit the type as well but I can't imagine they're a joy to work with.
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Post by rowmat on Nov 26, 2019 18:45:00 GMT -6
The reality is most creative types have some degree of narcissism. Usually grandiose in the form of the loud frontman or covert/vunerable in the case of the oversensitive "gonna change the world with my deep and meaningful songs" type. Go on. Deny it! 😎 It is a rampant personality flaw (disorder?) in music. There was a raging person of the type on RGO for a while that finally got banned, I wont name names. Anyway, I know it too well from personal experience. Every one of my bands I've been in has had a big narcissist. Sometimes I wonder if it's needed in some way, to keep things going in a certain direction. Some very successful musicians fit the type as well but I can't imagine they're a joy to work with. In some cases the narcissism is indeed narcissism. In other situations what appears to be narcissist behaviour is all just part of the show. When is seemingly arrogant confidence and showmanship narcissim in the case of entertainment? A sign is whether or not it gets turned off once the curtains close.
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Post by spindrift on Nov 26, 2019 21:38:39 GMT -6
I have a friend who is the lead singer in a successful regional band. He wears sunglasses and appears aloof on stage to some degree. Talking with him in recording sessions, he says that it’s a way of becoming another person, disconnecting from himself so that he can perform in a crazy manner that suits the band and its audience. When he takes the glasses off, he’s just a regular joe like us. I had never considered the strength one needs to gather to perform at that level in front of thousands.
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Post by rowmat on Nov 26, 2019 22:54:31 GMT -6
With this guy? Any changes at all! 😱
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Post by Ward on Nov 27, 2019 8:57:03 GMT -6
With this guy? Any changes at all! 😱 Perfect! And like the comment said "His voice sounds like he eats gravel for breakfast and boulders for lunch". Brilliant.
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Post by drbill on Nov 27, 2019 10:32:34 GMT -6
I'm certain you've all experienced similar nightmares to some of mine, where you get the grocery list of changes and things needing to be done . . . and you get through all that after cursing under your breath, and then another list magically appears, and i jus doesn't stop. Some folks are so dissatisfied with their own work that someone or something else must be to blame, so they keep going and going trying to reshape things so that the real problems are covered up. Or so it would seem . . . I love those clients. Cause they make me not care about their product. AND... I charge hourly. More $$$ = better business bottom line.
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Post by EmRR on Nov 27, 2019 11:17:02 GMT -6
^ this!
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Post by popmann on Nov 27, 2019 13:01:32 GMT -6
I don’t know man, I think I’d just tell them i might not be their guy. /edit There’s an interview on YouTube with George Martin in the 80s. He was hanging out with John Lennon after the Beatles broke up and Lennon told him he wanted to re-record all the Beatles songs, that he hated the sound of all of them. It was a constant thing with Lennon I guess.. the Beatles may never been have released if it were up to him! While I'd certainly be interested if I'm wrong--that's not remotely because he was a sonic perfectionist--listen to the sonics he recorded post Beatles...I imagine it's that he wanted to rework a lot of the material without Paul and that fucking drummer who could swing. Again--witness what he did the rest of his life. To the OP...what I rarely do is "exactly what they say". If they tell me the electric guitar needs to come up 2db...I ask them what the issue is-can they not hear certain notes clearly enough...is it not generally forward enough? I will ABSOLUTELY make the lead guitar "more" somehow until they're happy. Maybe I boost the 2khz by 1.5db...maybe into a little saturation. But, while this isn't something I directly tell them--the reason they hired me is they CAN'T do this with their level of tech knowledge. I try to frame it in that I want them to tell me in English what the changes are they want to make...as specific as they need to get--rather that the engineering RX. If you can't hear the vocal in the third verse clear enough--let me address that. Don't tell me to turn the vocal up 2db in the third verse. That MIGHT...MIGHT...MAYBE...be the solution, but that's the kind of thinking that gets non engineers shit mixes. IMO/E. Maybe, the track is comp'd lower, and I need to up the vocal 2db at the FRONT of the chain so it better matches the rest of the track--pushing the fader up 2db will just sound odd in that case. Maybe it's from a scratch vocal take that didn't have the same kind of midrange (different day/distance etc)...and I need to pull it off to it's own track and make the unprocessed vocal sound more like the rest of the track and bus it through the same chain...those really aren't THAT different--but, it becomes whack-a-mole...if I turn it up 2db...suddenly they do "there's too much reverb on that third verse--turn it DOWN 2db"...now there's a note that sticks out...etc...because they didn't tell me the issue they hear and let me investigate and address it. I have absolutely had differences of opinion that made me want to say "take my name off it". But, you know what? IME, mastering is largely going to fuck things up...on a scale WAY bigger than my arguing that they want the lead guitar tooo loud because I'm talking to the lead guitar player...it IS too loud--IMO...and so mastering comes behind and pulls some 2khz and clips the whole thing, and suddenly, it ALL sounds worse, but the lead isn't too loud. Because my clients aren't at the level where they're having thoughtful mastering engineers with attended sessions or...they're having some douche at Discmasters "master" it in an hour (running time 50min) or...some nimrod on the internet advertising as a "mastering engineer" reinvent my mix into a piece of bright crushed garbage to justify their getting paid.
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Post by EmRR on Nov 27, 2019 13:25:04 GMT -6
I remember going 12-15 remix rounds on a song because of the character of a special effect reverb in one spot. The words from the guys mouth were absolutely not a correct description of what he wanted.
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Post by wiz on Nov 27, 2019 22:29:32 GMT -6
With this guy? Any changes at all! 😱 Perfect! And like the comment said "His voice sounds like he eats gravel for breakfast and boulders for lunch". Brilliant. Great song and great version.... I used to play this back in the early 90s and when playing the slide part would kick in a IPS33B... remember them? LOL that drummer and bass player are music royalty here in Oz... great paring Cheers Wiz
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Post by Ward on Nov 28, 2019 0:02:28 GMT -6
I used to play this back in the early 90s and when playing the slide part would kick in a IPS33B... remember I still have mine!
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