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Post by Johnkenn on Jun 16, 2019 8:17:23 GMT -6
Are you guys using digital or hardware limiting?
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Post by drsax on Jun 16, 2019 8:29:50 GMT -6
Digital. Even when most of the chain is analog, I’ll use a plugin with limiting at the end. UAD Sonnox Oxford II, Precision Limiter, Weiss or Elevate.
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Post by stormymondays on Jun 16, 2019 9:06:03 GMT -6
I can tell you from my first-hand experience that Tim Young at Metropolis has been using digital limiting since 1998 (at least!). On my last visit he was using Fabfilter, after decades with the TC system.
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Post by drbill on Jun 16, 2019 10:01:43 GMT -6
After the analog chain, my final element is Fabfilter as well.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 16, 2019 10:05:54 GMT -6
Digital here too, usually a combo of StandardCLIP and Limitless, although I do see a racked NTP Limiter or Gyraf G21 in my future some when.
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Post by trakworxmastering on Jun 16, 2019 10:55:53 GMT -6
Digital limiter in the box after the analog chain. I tried analog peak limiters and they ate the transients too much. It was a disappointment as I'd hoped analog would triumph over digital, but digital look-ahead is hard to compete with. Pro-L 2 or Limitless are my current go-to limiters. Sometimes the old ATR 102 for some pleasant tape compression just before the ADC acts as a nice analog peak limiter, but only for the first 1 or 2 dB...
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Post by Johnkenn on Jun 16, 2019 14:02:06 GMT -6
Just seems like mastering pros always have louder masters than me. Maybe that's why they're pros lol.
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Post by M57 on Jun 16, 2019 14:02:56 GMT -6
Just seems like mastering pros always have louder masters than me. Maybe that's why they're pros lol. What are you using John? ..or what do you use when you're not using a pro? |
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Post by Johnkenn on Jun 16, 2019 14:03:04 GMT -6
Mind you, I always get stuff mastered by real mastering engineers when the budget allows.
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Post by Johnkenn on Jun 16, 2019 14:18:47 GMT -6
I have been using Ozone 8 mostly...but I really like Stealth Limiter. Corny looking, but I swear it sounds better than some. I haven't tried the AOM Invisible II, but have the first one and it's really good.
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Post by donr on Jun 16, 2019 14:27:09 GMT -6
How much limiting do people do? If I do more than 4-6 dB max and only on peaks, not steady, it starts sounding too loud and crunchy. I like to get the DR in the ballpark before the limiter.
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Post by drbill on Jun 16, 2019 14:36:01 GMT -6
How much limiting do people do? If I do more than 4-6 dB max and only on peaks, not steady, it starts sounding too loud and crunchy. I like to get the DR in the ballpark before the limiter. Ditto |
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Post by nomatic on Jun 16, 2019 17:51:46 GMT -6
The key to loud masters is gain staging pre limiting....
If you know your chain each piece is additive in is effect and then digital limiting can be used more effectively.
Honestly one has to master a few hundred tracks before it becomes clear at least in my case.
I only typically limit 3 DB digital max BTW...
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Post by M57 on Jun 16, 2019 18:48:07 GMT -6
It's heresy I'm sure, but I find Logic's adaptive limiter to be very transparent, and there's something comforting about knowing the plugin is part of the DAW software. ..seeing as it's last in the chain. 2-5 db here, depending on the genre.
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Post by donr on Jun 16, 2019 19:18:07 GMT -6
I've been using FabFilter Pro-L2, and mainly for over prevention and maybe a couple dB more of loudness. Hadn't thought of digital peak limiting as a significant creative tool. I'd like to know if people, especially mix or mastering pro's, are using it at all that way, and if so, how.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 16, 2019 23:58:21 GMT -6
How much limiting do people do? If I do more than 4-6 dB max and only on peaks, not steady, it starts sounding too loud and crunchy. I like to get the DR in the ballpark before the limiter. Totally depends on the client's brief and genre of the music. From zero clipping and limiting, to digital clipping before the analogue chain, clipping the converters on the way back in, another round of digital clipping, and then limiting up to 6dB for those who want things ending up around -6dB LUFS Integrated etc. And yes, there's an art to making stuff sound that loud without it completely falling to pieces... Nearly always Limitless here, as it's so versatile, but sometimes Elephant, Xenon or Limiter6. Again, all client/genre/material dependent. |
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Post by Blackdawg on Jun 17, 2019 1:21:24 GMT -6
The key to loud masters is gain staging pre limiting.... If you know your chain each piece is additive in is effect and then digital limiting can be used more effectively. Honestly one has to master a few hundred tracks before it becomes clear at least in my case. I only typically limit 3 DB digital max BTW... This is it. Right here. There's a reason why mastering guys use a lot of analog gear in their chain. Generally it's used pretty lightly but they add something different, more weight, sparkle, air, thickness, punch, ect. Each box will do something to take it somewhere and adding it up and in the right order is where the magic is. That said I use digital limiting. Fab filter or pro limit |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 17, 2019 2:56:54 GMT -6
John, if you send me a track you are having trouble getting as loud as you want it, feel free to send it to me and I'll do my best, run it through my chain, and if you like what I do, I can explain exactly what I did and why etc. Private or public. It's the least I could do for you providing us all with this cool platform!
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Post by svart on Jun 17, 2019 7:22:33 GMT -6
The harsh truth is that you have to mix loud if you want the master to be loud. Mastering guys can't take a -16dB mix and make it a -3dB radio mix.
I shave transients with my converter input for "limiting". Lets face it, that's what limiting is. I can get about 6dB shaved before it gets crunchy if I push the mix elements just right.
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Post by donr on Jun 17, 2019 9:03:22 GMT -6
It would never occur to me to clip converters. Is it only on the two mix, re-digitizing from analog? Before mastering and re-digitizing again? You don't clip converters tracking, do you?
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Post by svart on Jun 17, 2019 9:42:29 GMT -6
It would never occur to me to clip converters. Is it only on the two mix, re-digitizing from analog? Before mastering and re-digitizing again? You don't clip converters tracking, do you? Mostly on the two-bus. I don't intend to clip the individual tracks and I try not to, but sometimes it happens and as long as I don't hear obvious distortion, I don't really worry about it. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 17, 2019 9:56:56 GMT -6
I only ever clip my converters when the client wants crazy loud, which luckily for me, is not so often, as I have a rep for preferring dynamic masters and working with clients who appreciate that. I also like to have a capture from the analogue chain at 24/96 that is as good as can be, for archiving. Once it's clipped, the damage is done, or you'd need to do a new analogue pass.
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Post by donr on Jun 17, 2019 10:23:10 GMT -6
What's typical dynamic range standard for "chart" music these days? 10dB? Less?
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Post by svart on Jun 17, 2019 10:28:15 GMT -6
What's typical dynamic range standard for "chart" music these days? 10dB? Less? A few radio hits I've scanned have been in the -6db RMS area. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 17, 2019 12:48:57 GMT -6
Yeah -5 to -10 RMS or LUFS Integrated for most Pop, Hip Hop, Trap, EDM etc. these days. 95% of it is horrible, and unlistenable on a good system.  |
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