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Post by grummy on Feb 26, 2014 1:21:48 GMT -6
I know these are kind of two different beasts. But I'm considering buying another decent mic, and these are the two that I'm currently drooling over most lately.
Just curious if anyone has played much with either or better yet had the chance to compare them.
The AT has edge just due to the fact that it sounds great. Is clean and I imagine could be used on pretty much anything. Including the quietest of things, due to insane specs. Really low noise & high output. Could be used for everything from vocal to ultra pristine quiet sound effects recording.
The Blackspade I've only heard online samples of (so grain of salt I know), but I've yet to hear it in a comparison where I didn't prefer it by kind of a lot. That said none of the comparisons I've heard were never to the 5040 either. It's obviously more of a colour inducing mic where the 5040 is all about purity of source. My guess is the UM25C has edge in the added sonic character and multiple polar patterns. Contributing factor is the 5040 is cardioid only.
I since the UM25C is based off of the 251 I should ask if anyone on here has compared it directly to the CV4 Mod that gets so much praise around here. I've read somewhere on here that it is in the 251 ballpark also.
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Post by Johnkenn on Feb 26, 2014 9:32:25 GMT -6
I've demo'd a prototype of the BS25 without the Tim Campbell capsule...and thought it was pretty good. I thought it was very, very comparable to my stock CV4 at the time. But not "better" enough for me to pull the trigger. I was all gung ho about getting the 25C - until I heard the clipolator clips from Zen Pro...(I assume those clips aren't made to STOP people from buying). I thought it was waaaay bright on everything. Like a major top end sibilance. I'm sure it's better when you get it in the room, but it spooked me enough to where I didn't buy it. It's a beautiful looking mic, though.
I SWEAR I don't make any money off of Shannon - but with my experience, I would suggest him. It doesn't have to be a Miktek either. Just buy a good, affordable mic, drop ship it to him to add a capsule. He can really go any direction you want. He's doing a proprietary thing with building/tweaking the capsule and backplates that no one else is doing...and it's working.
I'm absolutely sure there are other great mics out there - however, I've tried a TON of them - and haven't been really excited about any until I had Shannon mod my CV4. I haven't tried the JJAudio stuff - but they look well made...I guess you could always buy one of those and have Shannon put a capsule in...
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Post by tasteliketape on Feb 26, 2014 10:56:59 GMT -6
+1 on the Shannon mod
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Post by Martin John Butler on Feb 26, 2014 11:12:16 GMT -6
Shannon's busy installing the Thiersch capsule upgrade on my Blackspade U17 as I write. My experience with the stock U17 is it resembles a much more expensive and first class mic tone, but due to cost savings, they use a capsule that has a little too much sibilance and a light bottom end. That said, I bought it because I couldn't find any mic at $1,000 I felt bettered it. With the Thiersch capsule, it could be a whole new ball game. The U17 was designed with the upgrade potential built in, so it's exactly the same mic, just the capsule gets changed.
I suspect it's the same kind of thing with the UM25 and the UM25C. I think the C stands for Tim Campbell, and the consensus today is he makes the best C12 capsule. So, between Oliver Archut's wonderful designs, and Tim's capsule, I'd lean toward the Blackspade in a minute. I've used an original C12 once, and it was by far, the finest microphone I've ever heard, and I trust Oliver's and Tim Campbell's work.
Now, you may want to check with Shannon though, he's up to some new and interesting things that might get you even one step further up the ladder to mic nirvana.
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Post by watchtower on Feb 26, 2014 13:52:26 GMT -6
I've demo'd a prototype of the BS25 without the Tim Campbell capsule...and thought it was pretty good. I thought it was very, very comparable to my stock CV4 at the time. But not "better" enough for me to pull the trigger. I was all gung ho about getting the 25C - until I heard the clipolator clips from Zen Pro...(I assume those clips aren't made to STOP people from buying). I thought it was waaaay bright on everything. Like a major top end sibilance. I'm sure it's better when you get it in the room, but it spooked me enough to where I didn't buy it. It's a beautiful looking mic, though. I SWEAR I don't make any money off of Shannon - but with my experience, I would suggest him. It doesn't have to be a Miktek either. Just buy a good, affordable mic, drop ship it to him to add a capsule. He can really go any direction you want. He's doing a proprietary thing with building/tweaking the capsule and backplates that no one else is doing...and it's working. I'm absolutely sure there are other great mics out there - however, I've tried a TON of them - and haven't been really excited about any until I had Shannon mod my CV4. I haven't tried the JJAudio stuff - but they look well made...I guess you could always buy one of those and have Shannon put a capsule in... I agree. The UM25C in the Clipalator is strangely bright. I have no clue if all UM25Cs are like that or not. I DO know that Blackspade gets a specific tuning from Tim to "better match" their model of a 251. The UM25C is essentially a 251, but with a "secret" Telefunken tube with a 14V heater instead of a 6072 |
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Post by Johnkenn on Feb 26, 2014 15:04:29 GMT -6
Wonder if I could buy the BS without the capsule?
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Post by Martin John Butler on Feb 26, 2014 20:21:59 GMT -6
I think you'd have to buy the UM25, ( not the "C"), and replace the capsule.
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Post by Johnkenn on Feb 28, 2014 18:44:37 GMT -6
I invited Blackspade to talk about their microphones and they declined. So, I have no interest in Blackspade.
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Post by Martin John Butler on Feb 28, 2014 19:01:52 GMT -6
That's a shame, it's a very good design, and Tony at Blackspade follows through when there are any issues, so I'm surprised.
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Post by watchtower on Feb 28, 2014 22:10:20 GMT -6
Do you have Tony's email? I have been unable to get a response from sales@bspade.com after a messed up shipment last summer
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Post by grummy on Feb 28, 2014 23:04:38 GMT -6
I suppose I could ask someone from Blackspade about their mics but, I'd imagine they might be a little bias.
I was asking on here to get practical feedback from users with no vested interest in what mic I end up choosing. I don't mind all that much if anyone from the company is on here. If I'm going to drop close to three grand on a mic I want it to be the best (most suitable) mic I can get for that money.
Or is there some kind of censorship on Blackspade on this forum?
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Post by Johnkenn on Feb 28, 2014 23:19:47 GMT -6
No - I invited them here.
You are welcome to search "UM251c blackspade" on the purple site. That will tell you all you need to know.
Apparently, they didn't take kindly to me asking them to explain before I invested $2500 in their mic.
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Post by grummy on Feb 28, 2014 23:45:03 GMT -6
I'll do a search.
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Post by Johnkenn on Mar 1, 2014 7:01:34 GMT -6
And lets not bump that thread on Gearslutz...
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Post by RicFoxx on Mar 1, 2014 8:35:46 GMT -6
Wow, that thread at GS started off bad.
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Post by Johnkenn on Mar 1, 2014 9:48:24 GMT -6
I didn't think I was out of line at all...considering the guy that makes their "custom capsule" responded like he didn't even know who they were. They claim that I purposely posted that to hurt their company. I think it's evident in that post that - at that time - I was very interested in their product. Obviously, now, I'm not interested at all.
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Post by RicFoxx on Mar 1, 2014 16:40:43 GMT -6
I know this is a little off topic but I never hear you guys talk about the Mojave Audio MA-200...I love this mic and bought mine for $695 on the used market. Great on Overheads, Acoustics and Male Vocals. I read Sylvia Massey loves this mic and uses it to punch in for a U47 when not available. Really good with the VP28. I actually sold my CV4 because this covered a lot of ground for me.
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Post by RicFoxx on Mar 1, 2014 18:15:43 GMT -6
I didn't think I was out of line at all...considering the guy that makes their "custom capsule" responded like he didn't even know who they were. They claim that I purposely posted that to hurt their company. I think it's evident in that post that - at that time - I was very interested in their product. Obviously, now, I'm not interested at all. Not at all, just the opposite. |
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Post by grummy on Mar 1, 2014 18:41:50 GMT -6
Yeah. I found that thread. It got pretty sketchy pretty fast. Didn't read to me like you were trying to slander their company. Just relay some conflicting info. It's too bad they got sensitive like that. Seemed like it was revealed in the thread that you weren't out of line or making anything up. They were also able to clarify that discrepancy with TC. No real harm to them in the end.
It does seem like it'd be a great mic regardless. But after reading that thing I get why you stand where you do on them.
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Post by popmann on Mar 1, 2014 19:34:23 GMT -6
I know this is a little off topic but I never hear you guys talk about the Mojave Audio MA-200...I love this mic and bought mine for $695 on the used market. Great on Overheads, Acoustics and Male Vocals. I read Sylvia Massey loves this mic and uses it to punch in for a U47 when not available. Really good with the VP28. I actually sold my CV4 because this covered a lot of ground for me. I love Royers...I've actually used someone's Mojave KIT (converting a MXL) that was really nice...so, I thought "no brainer" and bought one when it came out, sight unheard. But, put the MA200 on the list of many I simply didn't see any value in keeping. Luckily, it was so immediately obvious that I got that one back in a return window. It was a lot like a 67...a really awful modded 67. Like if you buried a 67 in the Pet Cemetary... I wanted to like it. Maybe it was a QC thing. But, for me, it wasn't just that it was bright--it was that the treble frequencies were scratchy and papery. |
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Post by RicFoxx on Mar 1, 2014 19:46:26 GMT -6
I know this is a little off topic but I never hear you guys talk about the Mojave Audio MA-200...I love this mic and bought mine for $695 on the used market. Great on Overheads, Acoustics and Male Vocals. I read Sylvia Massey loves this mic and uses it to punch in for a U47 when not available. Really good with the VP28. I actually sold my CV4 because this covered a lot of ground for me. I love Royers...I've actually used someone's Mojave KIT (converting a MXL) that was really nice...so, I thought "no brainer" and bought one when it came out, sight unheard. But, put the MA200 on the list of many I simply didn't see any value in keeping. Luckily, it was so immediately obvious that I got that one back in a return window. It was a lot like a 67...a really awful modded 67. Like if you buried a 67 in the Pet Cemetary... I wanted to like it. Maybe it was a QC thing. But, for me, it wasn't just that it was bright--it was that the treble frequencies were scratchy and papery. Tell me how you really feel popmann!! I love that lil Mic, what pet cemetery did you bury it in?? I want to go dig it up. |
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Post by watchtower on Mar 1, 2014 21:04:04 GMT -6
I'm confused. It's entirely possible that Tim gives them a custom capsule without having heard a Blackspade mic. In fact, that's exactly what the case is.
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Post by Johnkenn on Mar 1, 2014 21:24:54 GMT -6
Did you read the thread? Did you read Tim's email back to me?
You can clearly see that in the beginning of the thread, I was extremely excited about the mic. When I started another thread asking for experiences with Tim Campbell's capsules, I got ZERO responses. So I emailed the guy...
Hey Tim -
Considering this mic...does it have the same kind of woody mid-range of a
251? Just wondering if you consider it close.
Sent from my iPad
Dear John,
I have not affiliated with and have not heard any Blackspade microphones.
I'm as curious as you.
Kind regards,
Tim
I thought it was kind of strange considering their marketing stated, ""For the details, the capsule is a full on custom job we reworked with Tim Campbell" "Tim builds the capsules for us from the ground up to specifically match the UM25C's amplifier and assembly."
Hey - they call the guy by his first name, but he hasn't heard the mic? Tim builds the capsule to match the amplifier? Hmmm. You would think he would have heard one. Then - he goes out of his way to say, "I have not affiliated with and have not heard any Blackspade microphones."
I find that marketing copy to be a bit disingenuous - misleading at the very least. They cleared it up, though. The fact is, they DO use Tim Campbell's capsules. They buy them from him - and I'm sure they have spec'd out exactly how they want the capsule.
I asked a question, got an extremely odd answer...they cleared it up and now they're pissed at me for asking it and presumably tarnishing their good name. Oh well.
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Post by popmann on Mar 1, 2014 21:58:28 GMT -6
Sorry Rick...I should shut my mouth more. Sorry...broke mama's rule...
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Post by grummy on Mar 2, 2014 0:26:09 GMT -6
It's like they were embellishing the marketing speak a little. You kind of accidentally outed that. They are sore about it.
All this aside, if this mic is everything it's cracked up to be I want one. Whether they are rude, sensitive, liars, or otherwise.
Does anyone use these mics?
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