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Post by stormymondays on Mar 5, 2019 15:08:56 GMT -6
Here's my report after a very nice (and expensive!) visit to www.proaudioeurope.com in London  We set up a mic test (all going into a GML preamp), where I could test for myself a few different things. The Neumann U67 reissue was my main target (spoiler: bought it!). I also tried the Soyuz SU-017 to have a different tube mic, and I was very interested in testing the cheapest and most expensive AEA 44-style mics. I also brought my JZ Vintage 67 which had been working really great at my studio. I was able to monitor with the same monitors I have (APS Aeon) so that was a nice bonus! The staff at Funky Junk was great. Highly recommended! Here are my impressions, more or less in the order that everything happened. First of all, I didn't let price be a factor in the decision process, and I did all I could to not be biased towards the U67. There were two of us on the test, so I could hear the mics with different voices. I have to say that the U67 started the race in the last place, and slowly but surely ended up slaying all the contenders. I tested singing and playing a bit of acoustic guitar at the same time, but not recording the guitar. The U67 has no shortage of low end at all. The sound was very much like my memory of using a vintage one back in 2002. It's not a bright mic by any means. I think it has a recognizable sound. The Soyuz was really nice! It's got a more modern sound, and it's a bit brighter, which made it feel better in the cans. For a while I thought I would get it instead of the U67, but read on... As far as the ribbons go, the cheap R44CE doesn't sound like the expensive A440... it sounds better! At least, it did to the three people in the room. A bit brighter and with a different transient response. We quickly ruled the A440 out, because we liked it less and it's more than twice the price of the R44CE! We hooked the R44CE to Royer's new box, the Royer dBooster R-DB20, which the staff told me liked a lot (unlike the Cloudlifter, which they didn't!). It was great, and almost won the shootout. It was fantastic on my voice but ok on the other singer. In both cases it needed some eq to sit in the mix (as expected for a ribbon). It was great for capturing an old-time country song with one guitar and two vocals on one mic, but that's something that I won't be doing every week. In the end, it's far from being a universal mic, which didn't suit my goal. I might end up buying it someday though! And how did my "control" fare, the JZ Vintage 67? Well, we could all tell it was in a different league. I've made great records with it, and it worked great on many singers, but there was no fear that getting a better mic was a good idea. So how did I decide between the U67 and the Soyuz? Easy. I just asked to add the tiniest bit of top end to it, so it would compete on a more equal footing. They used the stock Reaper EQ. BOOM! Instant "sounds-like-a-record" moment, tears in my eyes, shootout's done, bring out the credit card! It was really something. After packing the mic I had a chance to listen to some monitors. I'll keep it short. I didn't like the Aeon 2, too much smiley curve sounding compared to the regular Aeon. And I mistakenly didn't head the advice to NOT test the ATC SCM25A. Boy, are those monitors in my (distant) future! As they said "they're so good it's annoying". I'll be happy to answer any questions or elaborate on the comments!  |
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Post by aremos on Mar 5, 2019 15:49:24 GMT -6
Didn't understand the: " ... the cheap R44CE ... sounds better [than the the expensive A440]! ... We quickly ruled it out, because it's more than twice the price!"
Twice the price of what?
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Post by stormymondays on Mar 5, 2019 16:02:52 GMT -6
Sorry for the not-so-great writing! Still a bit tired from the multiple flight delays... We ruled out the A440 which it’s twice the cost of the R44CE, because liked the R44CE better. I edited the original post for clarity (I hope!) |
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Post by popmann on Mar 5, 2019 17:15:08 GMT -6
Its funny....#geritolShot....i grew up with engineers who just either hated the 67 for its lack of sizzle compared to the 87....or lack of “honesty” like an old 47 or c12 at distance....but, to me, and my relatively “little world of music”....it was THE vintage mic. You could boost the top and make it airier than a 251 due to the bleed to the tranformer....you could stick it on a raging guitar amp and come away with gold....you could use it as overheads, though I was always on the “akg” side for that, but it was a seperate but equal great sound there.
And then when i started shopping for a “gold mic” for my home studio....Rolff or someone at Blackbird sent me home with a M269....which is a 67 with a AC701 tube amp....fucking magic. When you boost the top, its a different top. Sweeter. So, Im not sure whether to thank them or curse them....at the time there were no repro transformers being made....so, no 67 clones. Lots that looked the part, some that “sounded a lot like but shitty”....now, there are a few, and even Neumann has “properly reissued”....
Congrats. Im glad to see the 67 getting its day. Now if only I had money enough for a pair!
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Post by Johnkenn on Mar 5, 2019 17:18:09 GMT -6
Yeah...I want a 67
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Post by Mister Chase on Mar 5, 2019 17:27:19 GMT -6
Yea. Would love a 67. Oy vay. Thanks for the report!
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Post by chessparov on Mar 5, 2019 19:51:36 GMT -6
IMHO when/if Neumann ever (finally) discontinues the U67...
Look out! The values will really skyrocket, like 47/C12.
Chris
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Post by hadaja on Mar 6, 2019 0:53:15 GMT -6
I too own a jz v67 and ithink it is quite a nice mic, but i think i might be a little different as i still cant part with my AT4060 as i likethat more then my u87's i have owned. Good choice with the 67. Although i own a Stam sa67 i have not used it that much yet. Nice info on the A440 as i nearly bought one of those, but after listening to a friends AEA 44 compared to my RCA 44 bx i still foundthe AEA lacking and preferred the RCA .
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Post by stormymondays on Mar 6, 2019 7:25:50 GMT -6
Forgot to add - there were no Chandler available for demo. That would have been cool! I'll probably get the Chandler TG sight unseen anyway...
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Post by swafford on Mar 6, 2019 9:32:48 GMT -6
Nice. Got the 44CE, just need that 67.
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Post by Vincent R. on Mar 6, 2019 15:14:10 GMT -6
Nice. Everything I’ve heard from the RI sounds great, even when it’s next to a vintage one and has a slightly different vibe, it still sounds great. I’d love to get my hands on one down the road.
Interesting to hear the difference between the R440 and the R44. That amplifier has to be doing something.
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Post by piilani on Aug 21, 2022 12:21:11 GMT -6
Here's my report after a very nice (and expensive!) visit to www.proaudioeurope.com in London We set up a mic test (all going into a GML preamp), where I could test for myself a few different things. The Neumann U67 reissue was my main target (spoiler: bought it!). I also tried the Soyuz SU-017 to have a different tube mic, and I was very interested in testing the cheapest and most expensive AEA 44-style mics. I also brought my JZ Vintage 67 which had been working really great at my studio. I was able to monitor with the same monitors I have (APS Aeon) so that was a nice bonus! The staff at Funky Junk was great. Highly recommended! Here are my impressions, more or less in the order that everything happened. First of all, I didn't let price be a factor in the decision process, and I did all I could to not be biased towards the U67. There were two of us on the test, so I could hear the mics with different voices. I have to say that the U67 started the race in the last place, and slowly but surely ended up slaying all the contenders. I tested singing and playing a bit of acoustic guitar at the same time, but not recording the guitar. The U67 has no shortage of low end at all. The sound was very much like my memory of using a vintage one back in 2002. It's not a bright mic by any means. I think it has a recognizable sound. The Soyuz was really nice! It's got a more modern sound, and it's a bit brighter, which made it feel better in the cans. For a while I thought I would get it instead of the U67, but read on... As far as the ribbons go, the cheap R44CE doesn't sound like the expensive A440... it sounds better! At least, it did to the three people in the room. A bit brighter and with a different transient response. We quickly ruled the A440 out, because we liked it less and it's more than twice the price of the R44CE! We hooked the R44CE to Royer's new box, the Royer dBooster R-DB20, which the staff told me liked a lot (unlike the Cloudlifter, which they didn't!). It was great, and almost won the shootout. It was fantastic on my voice but ok on the other singer. In both cases it needed some eq to sit in the mix (as expected for a ribbon). It was great for capturing an old-time country song with one guitar and two vocals on one mic, but that's something that I won't be doing every week. In the end, it's far from being a universal mic, which didn't suit my goal. I might end up buying it someday though! And how did my "control" fare, the JZ Vintage 67? Well, we could all tell it was in a different league. I've made great records with it, and it worked great on many singers, but there was no fear that getting a better mic was a good idea. So how did I decide between the U67 and the Soyuz? Easy. I just asked to add the tiniest bit of top end to it, so it would compete on a more equal footing. They used the stock Reaper EQ. BOOM! Instant "sounds-like-a-record" moment, tears in my eyes, shootout's done, bring out the credit card! It was really something. After packing the mic I had a chance to listen to some monitors. I'll keep it short. I didn't like the Aeon 2, too much smiley curve sounding compared to the regular Aeon. And I mistakenly didn't head the advice to NOT test the ATC SCM25A. Boy, are those monitors in my (distant) future! As they said "they're so good it's annoying". I'll be happy to answer any questions or elaborate on the comments! I am in the midst of shooting out the Soyuz 017 Tube against the U67 Reissue. So far I prefer the Soyuz. I think it sounds glorious. It addresses all of issues I have with my Flea 47. |
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Post by EmRR on Aug 21, 2022 12:45:27 GMT -6
Interesting to hear the difference between the R440 and the R44. That amplifier has to be doing something. Yep, keeps the mic from interacting with the preamp by isolating the impedance interaction. Each will be better than the other somewhere. In this test the passive mic was better into the Royer boost device than the built in 'same kinda thing' in the R440. They really are the 'same kinda thing', one is just outboard. Lose the boost device and try the mic into a dozen different types of preamps, you'll find better and worse. Try the same dozen preamps with the active mic, there's gonna be less difference. Kinda like training wheels or guard rails for mic/preamp interaction, could be good, could limit possibilities, depends on the size of your kit and your goals. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2022 16:25:52 GMT -6
If it says anything the only Neumann's I own currently is a vintage 67, reissue 67, TLM93 and KM184. I used to own a slurry of Neumann's but the aforementioned mic's are the one's that survived the decades. It's funny (sort of), over the years I've preached the awesomeness of some mic's but they might have only lasted a year or two, the 67 is so variably flexible that I can always find a use for it. I'd never dream of parting with it so it remains as a core mic..
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Post by robschnapf on Aug 21, 2022 16:42:15 GMT -6
Just tried out and still am trying the beesneez 67.
It’s very nice so far.
It has nice body to it and sounded great on female voice.
More tomorrow
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Post by Johnkenn on Aug 22, 2022 15:24:21 GMT -6
Here's my report after a very nice (and expensive!) visit to www.proaudioeurope.com in London We set up a mic test (all going into a GML preamp), where I could test for myself a few different things. The Neumann U67 reissue was my main target (spoiler: bought it!). I also tried the Soyuz SU-017 to have a different tube mic, and I was very interested in testing the cheapest and most expensive AEA 44-style mics. I also brought my JZ Vintage 67 which had been working really great at my studio. I was able to monitor with the same monitors I have (APS Aeon) so that was a nice bonus! The staff at Funky Junk was great. Highly recommended! Here are my impressions, more or less in the order that everything happened. First of all, I didn't let price be a factor in the decision process, and I did all I could to not be biased towards the U67. There were two of us on the test, so I could hear the mics with different voices. I have to say that the U67 started the race in the last place, and slowly but surely ended up slaying all the contenders. I tested singing and playing a bit of acoustic guitar at the same time, but not recording the guitar. The U67 has no shortage of low end at all. The sound was very much like my memory of using a vintage one back in 2002. It's not a bright mic by any means. I think it has a recognizable sound. The Soyuz was really nice! It's got a more modern sound, and it's a bit brighter, which made it feel better in the cans. For a while I thought I would get it instead of the U67, but read on... As far as the ribbons go, the cheap R44CE doesn't sound like the expensive A440... it sounds better! At least, it did to the three people in the room. A bit brighter and with a different transient response. We quickly ruled the A440 out, because we liked it less and it's more than twice the price of the R44CE! We hooked the R44CE to Royer's new box, the Royer dBooster R-DB20, which the staff told me liked a lot (unlike the Cloudlifter, which they didn't!). It was great, and almost won the shootout. It was fantastic on my voice but ok on the other singer. In both cases it needed some eq to sit in the mix (as expected for a ribbon). It was great for capturing an old-time country song with one guitar and two vocals on one mic, but that's something that I won't be doing every week. In the end, it's far from being a universal mic, which didn't suit my goal. I might end up buying it someday though! And how did my "control" fare, the JZ Vintage 67? Well, we could all tell it was in a different league. I've made great records with it, and it worked great on many singers, but there was no fear that getting a better mic was a good idea. So how did I decide between the U67 and the Soyuz? Easy. I just asked to add the tiniest bit of top end to it, so it would compete on a more equal footing. They used the stock Reaper EQ. BOOM! Instant "sounds-like-a-record" moment, tears in my eyes, shootout's done, bring out the credit card! It was really something. After packing the mic I had a chance to listen to some monitors. I'll keep it short. I didn't like the Aeon 2, too much smiley curve sounding compared to the regular Aeon. And I mistakenly didn't head the advice to NOT test the ATC SCM25A. Boy, are those monitors in my (distant) future! As they said "they're so good it's annoying". I'll be happy to answer any questions or elaborate on the comments! I am in the midst of shooting out the Soyuz 017 Tube against the U67 Reissue. So far I prefer the Soyuz. I think it sounds glorious. It addresses all of issues I have with my Flea 47. I got the SU-017 Tube several months ago and I absolutely love it. Favorite mic I've ever owned. |
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Post by drbill on Aug 22, 2022 18:06:16 GMT -6
I am in the midst of shooting out the Soyuz 017 Tube against the U67 Reissue. So far I prefer the Soyuz. I think it sounds glorious. It addresses all of issues I have with my Flea 47. I got the SU-017 Tube several months ago and I absolutely love it. Favorite mic I've ever owned. High praise John. Over the Upton and Heiserman? |
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Post by Johnkenn on Aug 22, 2022 20:15:56 GMT -6
I got the SU-017 Tube several months ago and I absolutely love it. Favorite mic I've ever owned. High praise John. Over the Upton and Heiserman? Yes. |
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Post by ab101 on Aug 22, 2022 20:21:13 GMT -6
High praise John. Over the Upton and Heiserman? Yes. Have you tried the Soyuz on a female - soprano? Any thoughts? That is where my Upton 251 shines, though with a GE 5 star tube over the EH Dallas provided. |
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Post by Johnkenn on Aug 22, 2022 21:43:22 GMT -6
Have you tried the Soyuz on a female - soprano? Any thoughts? That is where my Upton 251 shines, though with a GE 5 star tube over the EH Dallas provided. It’s been great on everything |
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Post by drbill on Aug 22, 2022 22:09:31 GMT -6
Have you tried the Soyuz on a female - soprano? Any thoughts? That is where my Upton 251 shines, though with a GE 5 star tube over the EH Dallas provided. It’s been great on everything Def on my radar now....thx. BTW, have you ever tried the FET version? Heard great things about that one as well. |
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Post by Vincent R. on Aug 23, 2022 4:58:26 GMT -6
Have you tried the Soyuz on a female - soprano? Any thoughts? That is where my Upton 251 shines, though with a GE 5 star tube over the EH Dallas provided. I can’t speak to the Soyuz or the Upton 251 on soprano, but a U67 is amazing on soprano. You never have to worry that the Soprano might sound a bit too bright. If need be you just add a little top end EQ. |
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Post by Johnkenn on Aug 23, 2022 8:08:54 GMT -6
I’ve had two clients lately that are complete recording novices and suggested they buy the Warm 67. One of the guys can be painful in the mids on the wrong mic.
Both sent back files that were awesome eq wise. Both were recorded with cheap interface mic pres. So I’ve been extremely impressed with the Warm 67 videos and tracks I’ve heard. Enough to where I want to buy one - but just don’t need it with the Soyuz.
I haven’t heard the fet version, but I’ve heard they’re very similar.
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Post by Quint on Aug 23, 2022 8:23:47 GMT -6
I’ve had two clients lately that are complete recording novices and suggested they buy the Warm 67. One of the guys can be painful in the mids on the wrong mic. Both sent back files that were awesome eq wise. Both were recorded with cheap interface mic pres. So I’ve been extremely impressed with the Warm 67 videos and tracks I’ve heard. Enough to where I want to buy one - but just don’t need it with the Soyuz. I haven’t heard the fet version, but I’ve heard they’re very similar. I like my pair of WA87s (though I may eventually swap those for the Serrano 87s) just fine and was curious about the WA67s. Though, now with the Beesneez 67s out, and for not a whole lot more money than the WA67s, I might have shifted my gaze to a pair of Beesneez 67s now. |
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Post by Vincent R. on Aug 23, 2022 9:04:24 GMT -6
I’ve had two clients lately that are complete recording novices and suggested they buy the Warm 67. One of the guys can be painful in the mids on the wrong mic. Both sent back files that were awesome eq wise. Both were recorded with cheap interface mic pres. So I’ve been extremely impressed with the Warm 67 videos and tracks I’ve heard. Enough to where I want to buy one - but just don’t need it with the Soyuz. I haven’t heard the fet version, but I’ve heard they’re very similar. The Warm WA67 sounds a little dull to me from what I've heard, but I guess it's better than sounding bright. Glad it's working well for them. The new WA-CX12 also sounds a bit dull IMO. I did like their new version of the WA87 in seawell's shoot out, and I liked their WA47 enough to make a video on it. So, I commend them to making the mics better over time. For the price they are great. I'm also still a huge fan of the Advanced Audio CM49. Not as robust as my FleA 49, but a wonderful sounding mic. Still haven't tried the new CM49LE they just released. It's a little more. Looks like an M49. I'm curious about that one, but with 2 FleA 49s I really don't need it at the moment. I'm trying out the new Beesneez BU67 tonight which is a touch more than the Warm, but sound awesome from everything I've heard. I'm tossing it up next to my modded MK U67. So I'm looking forward to hearing how they compare. |
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