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Post by forgotteng on Dec 17, 2018 21:10:52 GMT -6
It’s time to backup and replace a few hard drives. I have always used Seagate in the past but heard they were less reliable lately. Anyone have any valid opinions or threads on what drives are the best nowadays? This would be for internal drives. Is it better to have 1 4gig drive or 2 2gig drives?
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Post by mulmany on Dec 17, 2018 21:13:13 GMT -6
What are you using them for specifically? Samples, main drive, recording drive...?
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Post by forgotteng on Dec 17, 2018 21:17:46 GMT -6
Sorry about that. These are main session files not for samples.
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Post by m03 on Dec 17, 2018 21:37:43 GMT -6
This would be for internal drives. Is it better to have 1 4gig drive or 2 2gig drives? Did you actually mean that you need 4TB and not 4GB? |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 18, 2018 2:40:02 GMT -6
SSD all the way these days, buy latest gen if you have the cash, or last gen to save a bit.
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Post by mulmany on Dec 18, 2018 6:23:52 GMT -6
I use Samsung pro or owc SSD. I then backup to HDD.
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Post by forgotteng on Dec 18, 2018 6:39:35 GMT -6
This would be for internal drives. Is it better to have 1 4gig drive or 2 2gig drives? Did you actually mean that you need 4TB and not 4GB? Haha, good catch, yea TB is what I’m looking for. |
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Post by forgotteng on Dec 18, 2018 6:43:44 GMT -6
I was thinking about the ssd route. My concern is due to the nature of some of my clients, sessions tend to drag on way longer than they should so keeping things organized and backup up or ready for overdubs feels like a logistical nightmare. Unless I dump a ton of money into a bigger ssd.
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Post by mulmany on Dec 18, 2018 8:03:41 GMT -6
I was thinking about the ssd route. My concern is due to the nature of some of my clients, sessions tend to drag on way longer than they should so keeping things organized and backup up or ready for overdubs feels like a logistical nightmare. Unless I dump a ton of money into a bigger ssd. I have a 4bay usb3 enclosure that I bring out and do my backups to, or transfer from if needed. I run two 250gig SSD for record drives in a TB enclosure. I then partition the drives in half to make sorting of sessions faster. It really doesn't take that long to transfer a whole project these days. It also ensures that you have a copy on the HDD. |
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Post by crillemannen on Dec 18, 2018 8:04:42 GMT -6
SSD ofc. Not super expensive anymore. The 1-2tb is affordable. If you have somewhat new computer the pcie ssd you attach direct to the motherboard is super fast but quite expensive if you want more then 500gb. I bought a samsung 870 1tb recently and it works like a charm.
Good luck
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Post by Martin John Butler on Dec 18, 2018 8:57:15 GMT -6
I use a small Glyph drive for backup. It's worked flawlessly for years. Glyph is really good when it comes to customer service, so if you're ever stuck, they'll help. Once a project is finished, like an album, or podcasts, I save it to another portable 1TB drive and clear out the Glyph. That drive stays in my closet, same as if I had 24 track reel to reel masters in the closet. At the same time, I save current projects to my iMac in Logic. This way I have the sessions if the Glyph ever fails. I also have Apple's Time Machine, so if everything went away, I can recall everything from the last time I turned off the computer.
Next time I'll get bigger drives, but keep the same basic way of securing my copies.
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Post by christopher on Dec 18, 2018 9:17:30 GMT -6
You always need 2 backups, so I would say you need 3 drives: ssd for system files and current projects, Then 2 drives for backup. I like DVD as a long term safety backup, burn it while wrapping up. It’s too easy for a hard drive to fail. I had a drive from an old laptop, I was always plugging it in to grab stuff from backup, then putting it away. One time I accidentally patched the connector wrong... sent psu power somewhere it shouldn’t have, it never powered up after that. That’s just an example of something unplanned happening. After that I decided USB is braindead, so I have an external USB drive now. But that started getting full, I got a bigger drive to backup that one. But it won’t successfully copy paste 800 gigs at once, so I have to backup in much smaller chunks. Which takes so incredibly long that I just haven’t done it. If you can get a dual backup routine now you’ll be much better off.
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Post by jtc111 on Dec 18, 2018 10:40:24 GMT -6
I have an Akitio Thunder3 Quad Mini 4-Bay SSD Enclosure loaded up with Samsung SSDs. One drive is for sessions, two are for libraries, the last is for saving miscellaneous stuff I don't want on my system drive but don't want to delete either. I'm pretty happy with that set up.
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Post by indiehouse on Dec 18, 2018 10:44:23 GMT -6
Isn’t it almost a wash to just opt for cloud storage these days? Instead of multiple TB SSD’s x 2?
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Post by indiehouse on Dec 18, 2018 10:45:24 GMT -6
At least for working projects? I guess long term storage of completed projects could be in-house. But even then...
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Post by forgotteng on Dec 18, 2018 10:57:30 GMT -6
All good information I have been trying to figure this out for over 10 years and still don't feel safe with anything I've done. The problem with the cloud is it takes so long to upload and then it stops and you lose sync and your never really sure if it's all there or not. Maybe it's just me. I did breakdown and buy a 1Tb ssd to work off of. We will try that.
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Post by Mister Chase on Dec 18, 2018 12:36:57 GMT -6
You always need 2 backups, so I would say you need 3 drives: ssd for system files and current projects, Then 2 drives for backup. I like DVD as a long term safety backup, burn it while wrapping up. It’s too easy for a hard drive to fail. I had a drive from an old laptop, I was always plugging it in to grab stuff from backup, then putting it away. One time I accidentally patched the connector wrong... sent psu power somewhere it shouldn’t have, it never powered up after that. That’s just an example of something unplanned happening. After that I decided USB is braindead, so I have an external USB drive now. But that started getting full, I got a bigger drive to backup that one. But it won’t successfully copy paste 800 gigs at once, so I have to backup in much smaller chunks. Which takes so incredibly long that I just haven’t done it. If you can get a dual backup routine now you’ll be much better off. I hope you are using archival grade DVDs... the dye or lacquer on consumer grade stuff will break down before long IMHO. |
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Post by Mister Chase on Dec 18, 2018 12:38:18 GMT -6
I've been using a WD USB 3 drive to record to. As far as recording performance, I haven't found any difference between it and my internal SATA 3 SSD. Plenty of bandwidth for audio. Call me crazy. It just takes a second to load up the first project of the day as the drive is asleep. 90 bucks 4 TB.
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Post by christopher on Dec 18, 2018 13:59:24 GMT -6
I didn’t use good quality DVDs, just memorex or TDK. That’s a good idea though. I started doing it as a short term solution, and immediately they’d go in a slip, and into an artist file folder, into a metal file cabinet. The stuff I did 13 years ago is now on multiple dead hard drives LOL. But I’ve been able to retrieve the Wavs from those DVDs. Not the ideal testing method, but it has been better than nothing. I sometimes think to myself, hmm.. by the time the hard drive is full, it’s probably on its last leg. If you can keep it alive long enough to get the data off, consider yourself lucky!
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Post by Guitar on Dec 18, 2018 14:07:12 GMT -6
My OS is installed on a SSD along with Cubase, etc.
My main session drive is Glyph Studio 4TB. I keep all my casual listening music collection on there too, so this drive comes with me on long trips out of town. I really like the Glyph even though it's not cheap, I feel it was worth it. Maybe an SSD session drive would load recall projects faster, but I haven't really found it to be an issue, they still load fairly quickly. This is a fast disk drive.
After a while I stick old sessions in my Dropbox and they get backed up to 2 different PCs automatically. That's one of the nice things about Dropbox for me, I don't have to think about it much.
So technically I have 2 personal copies of archived sessions, and one in the "cloud" as an emergency measure.
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Post by Mister Chase on Dec 18, 2018 14:22:02 GMT -6
I didn’t use good quality DVDs, just memorex or TDK. That’s a good idea though. I started doing it as a short term solution, and immediately they’d go in a slip, and into an artist file folder, into a metal file cabinet. The stuff I did 13 years ago is now on multiple dead hard drives LOL. But I’ve been able to retrieve the Wavs from those DVDs. Not the ideal testing method, but it has been better than nothing. I sometimes think to myself, hmm.. by the time the hard drive is full, it’s probably on its last leg. If you can keep it alive long enough to get the data off, consider yourself lucky! I've got some archival blu ray media here that I use. The thing about hard disk drives is that they need to be used periodically for them to have the best longevity, as I understand it. Those bearings and moving parts are what break down eventually. Solid state doesn't suffer from this but the stats on long term data retention don't really exist yet. Archival tape is still used in the IT world for a reason. Honestly I've thought of just storing at least masters o.k. 1/4" audio tape. This all reminds me I need another hard drive and to blu ray some things. |
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Post by johneppstein on Dec 18, 2018 17:46:05 GMT -6
You always need 2 backups, so I would say you need 3 drives: ssd for system files and current projects, Then 2 drives for backup. I like DVD as a long term safety backup, burn it while wrapping up. It’s too easy for a hard drive to fail. I had a drive from an old laptop, I was always plugging it in to grab stuff from backup, then putting it away. One time I accidentally patched the connector wrong... sent psu power somewhere it shouldn’t have, it never powered up after that. That’s just an example of something unplanned happening. After that I decided USB is braindead, so I have an external USB drive now. But that started getting full, I got a bigger drive to backup that one. But it won’t successfully copy paste 800 gigs at once, so I have to backup in much smaller chunks. Which takes so incredibly long that I just haven’t done it. If you can get a dual backup routine now you’ll be much better off. Writable optical disks - DVD-Rs - are subject to rot over time. Hard drives are generally more reliable for really long term storage.
How do you manage to patch a hard drive wrong? The way the connectors are keyed you'd have to try really hard to get it to "fit".
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Post by johneppstein on Dec 18, 2018 18:04:47 GMT -6
I didn’t use good quality DVDs, just memorex or TDK. That’s a good idea though. I started doing it as a short term solution, and immediately they’d go in a slip, and into an artist file folder, into a metal file cabinet. The stuff I did 13 years ago is now on multiple dead hard drives LOL. But I’ve been able to retrieve the Wavs from those DVDs. Not the ideal testing method, but it has been better than nothing. I sometimes think to myself, hmm.. by the time the hard drive is full, it’s probably on its last leg. If you can keep it alive long enough to get the data off, consider yourself lucky! I have hard drives in a P4 Win XP computer that are 15 years old and still working fine. I have consumer DVDs that I burned video files to 3 years ago that are unplayable.
The main problem that I see with hard drives is making sure that you keep a machine they're compatible with, the way things get arbitrarily "improved" in computerworld.
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Post by johneppstein on Dec 18, 2018 18:15:19 GMT -6
Solid state doesn't suffer from this but the stats on long term data retention don't really exist yet. Archival tape is still used in the IT world for a reason. Honestly I've thought of just storing at least masters o.k. 1/4" audio tape. This all reminds me I need another hard drive and to blu ray some things. From all the reports I've seen, SSD does not have long term reliability. Although it's improving I personally am skeptical that it ever will, as it rerlies on stored charges, which are fairly transitory things.
From Wikipedia:
(Emphasis mine.)
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Post by Guitar on Dec 18, 2018 18:22:05 GMT -6
that is my understanding as well, that SSD are better as working drives than long term storage
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