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Post by drbill on Oct 31, 2018 16:02:36 GMT -6
And what's the capitol records association? Capitol is a co-sponsor of something called "gBETA Musictech": gBETA Musictech
gBETA runs free seminars for people looking to do a startup company. Apparently OSMIX is participating and they've latched on to the Capitol name, because, why not? They call it "collaborating". Whatever. I'll only do seminars if they provide food. Free food. Oooookaaaay...... Well, that's incredibly misleading on their part. So much so that that point alone would disqualify them from a listen IMO.
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Post by mrholmes on Oct 31, 2018 16:19:45 GMT -6
There is a part of the generation 30 and below. I think they substituted brian mass with smart phones. Talking to each other, why? We have fuckapp and shitbook!! 2,22 + 2,50 = smart phone. Who was Albert Einstein smart phone. The Beatles? smart phone. Hendrix? SIGH...
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
Posts: 14,937
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Post by ericn on Oct 31, 2018 18:51:14 GMT -6
OSMIX has the endorsement of one of their girlfriends: "Proud isn’t even a big enough word for how I feel about all the things my boyfriend has worked so hard to accomplish!! • For anyone who hasn’t heard, Aaron left Tesla a few months ago to pursue and re-engage in his passion and primary desire : musicianship. • Since then, he’s worked with some truly supportive, talented, and hardworking people whose creative forces have given way to some awesome results: not only is he playing and writing music again, he’s also growing his understanding and engagement with the music business in new and exciting ways. • Aaron, Jared, and Will have been working on an app for musicians to help streamline and automate the mixing process. They’ve all dedicated lots of time, money, and effort into growing their tech tool. So much so that they have been chosen out of hundreds of submissions to work with the gBeta music technology accelerator program in partnership with Capital Music Group (yes, as in Capitol Records!) that will help them grow their business. • Aaron would never say it, but I will: his work ethic and talent have given way to a whole new chapter marked by an energy that has created a positive domino-effect for everything around him. I am so proud of the work these dudes have put in and so excited for all the opportunities and good vibes coming their way!" Now that's an accomplishment! In other words “ please they need the $$ I’m sick of roman and his partners ctashing on my couch, he promised to take me out for steak if I wrote this”. Of course steak means Golden Corral 😥
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Post by rowmat on Oct 31, 2018 19:10:50 GMT -6
The issue is the end consumer doesn't give a crap and most wouldn't know their ass from their elbow when it comes to what constitutes a mix being good, bad or indifferent. We are almost at the point (and it will happen) where a smartphone app will write, arrange, mix and master songs from scratch on your phone. You select the genre, style etc write the lyrics of you want and 'bingo' there it is. Unfortunately that will satisfy about 90% of the market. AI is a juggernaut that will make most human endeavors redundant.
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Post by Blackdawg on Oct 31, 2018 19:41:44 GMT -6
The issue is the end consumer doesn't give a crap and most wouldn't know their ass from their elbow when it comes to what constitutes a mix being good, bad or indifferent. We are almost at the point (and it will happen) where a smartphone app will write, arrange, mix and master songs from scratch on your phone. You select the genre, style etc write the lyrics of you want and 'bingo' there it is. Unfortunately that will satisfy about 90% of the market. AI is a juggernaut that will make most human endeavors redundant. B I N G O
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Post by johneppstein on Nov 2, 2018 12:45:41 GMT -6
The issue is the end consumer doesn't give a crap and most wouldn't know their ass from their elbow when it comes to what constitutes a mix being good, bad or indifferent. We are almost at the point (and it will happen) where a smartphone app will write, arrange, mix and master songs from scratch on your phone. You select the genre, style etc write the lyrics of you want and 'bingo' there it is. Unfortunately that will satisfy about 90% of the market. AI is a juggernaut that will make most human endeavors redundant. Why stop at the lyrics? Any dumb phone could write something like "Booty! Booty! Shake it all night!"
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Post by rowmat on Nov 2, 2018 15:58:28 GMT -6
The issue is the end consumer doesn't give a crap and most wouldn't know their ass from their elbow when it comes to what constitutes a mix being good, bad or indifferent. We are almost at the point (and it will happen) where a smartphone app will write, arrange, mix and master songs from scratch on your phone. You select the genre, style etc write the lyrics of you want and 'bingo' there it is. Unfortunately that will satisfy about 90% of the market. AI is a juggernaut that will make most human endeavors redundant. Why stop at the lyrics? Any dumb phone could write something like "Booty! Booty! Shake it all night!" That's a bit too deep for me I'm afraid. I'm more of a "Yeah baby! Oh baby, baby, baby, yeah!" kinda guy.
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Post by iamasound on Nov 3, 2018 1:37:57 GMT -6
Why stop at the lyrics? Any dumb phone could write something like "Booty! Booty! Shake it all night!" Please John, can I use that, I need a chorus!
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Post by M57 on Nov 3, 2018 5:01:52 GMT -6
Wasn't the synthesizer suppose to put thousands of string players out of jobs? ..then sampled strings? ..then sampled string libraries with multiple articulations, effects, round robin, etc?? And yet, string players still have jobs. And guess what? The jobs they have are a hell of a lot more meaningful than the jobs they would have if the technology didn't exist. Are there less string players today because of synths and sample libraries? Probably, but those "stolen" jobs were part of the process of opening up the craft of making music to more and more people, and more people making music is a good thing. Technologically driven shifts in industry almost always have some sort of collateral damage component. Is there more crap out there? Of course. MORE means more of everything, and that's OK. The world is a better place when there's more music.
Once AI starts to mix better than I can and the price is right, I'm in. Will any engineers lose work because of this? Nope.. Mine is just a home studio. As far as I'm concerned, when the quality of AI engineering starts to break into the ranks of working ME's, it will supplant those who were mixing in cookie-cutter fashion in the first place. I conjecture that as long as there are still string players, there will be engineers - and they will be the best of the best. More and more people will be able to make music, and it will continue to get better and better across the board ..and there will be boat-loads of crap too.
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Post by drbill on Nov 3, 2018 10:17:44 GMT -6
IMO, thats a very short sighted view of the situation by someone that I suspect doesn't have the perspective of being there when it all went down. Maybe? No offense, but as one of the guys who brought synths into the LA marketplace and faced down all the stares and hushed comments while setting up in the big LA rooms with the orchestra's and rhythm sections, I can 100% guarantee you that there are less jobs for string payers today than there was back in the early 80's. There are less jobs for engineers too. Ultimately, less jobs for ALL professional musicians. Especially in LA. The Union is in a tailspin and has been for a decade or two. Hell, drum machines almost single handedly put drummers out of business for a decade. Luckily trends change, and those drummers who could survive for a decade of 90% less gigs are back working steady. For $50- - or maybe if they are lucky - 100 a night.
There is no way to quantify what AI will do to the music industry until after it happens, but we've been hit hard enough by technology to be suspicious of it don't you think? Music will not die. Maybe just musicianship.
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Post by johneppstein on Nov 3, 2018 11:04:58 GMT -6
Wasn't the synthesizer suppose to put thousands of string players out of jobs? ..then sampled strings? ..then sampled string libraries with multiple articulations, effects, round robin, etc?? And yet, string players still have jobs. And guess what? The jobs they have are a hell of a lot more meaningful than the jobs they would have if the technology didn't exist. Are there less string players today because of synths and sample libraries? Probably, but those "stolen" jobs were part of the process of opening up the craft of making music to more and more people, and more people making music is a good thing. Technologically driven shifts in industry almost always have some sort of collateral damage component. Is there more crap out there? Of course. MORE means more of everything, and that's OK. The world is a better place when there's more music. Once AI starts to mix better than I can and the price is right, I'm in. Will any engineers lose work because of this? Nope.. Mine is just a home studio. As far as I'm concerned, when the quality of AI engineering starts to break into the ranks of working ME's, it will supplant those who were mixing in cookie-cutter fashion in the first place. I conjecture that as long as there are still string players, there will be engineers - and they will be the best of the best. More and more people will be able to make music, and it will continue to get better and better across the board ..and there will be boat-loads of crap too. I would debate whether "Opening up making "music" to more and more people" is a good thing. I tend to feel that it is not and we'd all be better off without it. Sometimes gatekeepers are a GOOD thing.
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Post by johneppstein on Nov 3, 2018 11:09:08 GMT -6
Depends on what you call "music". We're already in an era when "singers" no longer have to even try to sing.
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Post by drbill on Nov 3, 2018 11:35:30 GMT -6
Depends on what you call "music". We're already in an era when "singers" no longer have to even try to sing. I stand by my point. MUSIC will not die, but musicianship (what you are referring to) might become quite a rarity.
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Post by Tbone81 on Nov 3, 2018 11:49:08 GMT -6
Did anyone watch “Exit Through The Gift Shop”? There was a great Banksy quote where he says “ I used to think everyone should make art, now I’m not so sure”.
He was referring to th ewatering down, and commercialization of street art (aka graffiti), but it touches on this subject too.
I think everyone should study an instrument at some point in their lives but should everyone be an artist, or producer, or music maker? Probably not. It drowns out the really great, soul aching music, the stuff that makes you want to cry. It all gets lost in the haystack at some point.
As to whether we should even be pursuing AI/automated driven music and music creation, I feel the answer is NO. If you only look at the end product it might be easy to justify AI created music, however such an outlook completely ignores a huge part of it. That is, the act of creating the music is as important as the music itself. The years I’ve spent learning guitar and bass. The time spent writing shitty songs with my friends in the garage at 16. The time spent laboring over the craft, learning to mix, training my ears. That all meant something. It meant something deeply important, more important than any actual song I’ve ever created/recorded/produced etc.
There’s an adage it martial arts: “The way is in the training”. That simple line means many things, among which is the importance of the journey, not just the destination.
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Post by M57 on Nov 3, 2018 11:59:53 GMT -6
IMO, thats a very short sighted view of the situation by someone that I suspect doesn't have the perspective of being there when it all went down. Maybe? No offense, but as one of the guys who brought synths into the LA marketplace and faced down all the stares and hushed comments while setting up in the big LA rooms with the orchestra's and rhythm sections, I can 100% guarantee you that there are less jobs for string payers today than there was back in the early 80's. There are less jobs for engineers too. Ultimately, less jobs for ALL professional musicians. Especially in LA. The Union is in a tailspin and has been for a decade or two. Hell, drum machines almost single handedly put drummers out of business for a decade. Luckily trends change, and those drummers who could survive for a decade of 90% less gigs are back working steady. For $50- - or maybe if they are lucky - 100 a night. There is no way to quantify what AI will do to the music industry until after it happens, but we've been hit hard enough by technology to be suspicious of it don't you think? Music will not die. Maybe just musicianship. Sorry, but I think that's a very short-sighted opinion of what constitutes musicianship. No, I wasn't "there," but I was aware, and "at" the time - And at the time, I remember thinking that if a synth can do your job, that speaks to the value/quality of what you contribute to the music in the first place. What it did, in fact does was to open up roads for musicians that weren't possible before. Musicianship is part of the human spirit - you can't kill it. Jobs that are being consumed by technology are "suspect" in the first place. I know that's a harsh word - I don't mean to say in the sense that they're "bogus," but I couldn't find a softer way to say it. How many engraver jobs have been lost to technology? Do you think any millennials give it a second thought? Was the quality of orchestral music better when it was engraved by hand? Same with "real" gear vs virtual - It's simply a shift. The reality of this revolution is that while there are losers monetarily speaking, there are far more winners - and the 'void' many imagine is really an infinite space for growth and creativity.
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Post by johneppstein on Nov 3, 2018 12:05:17 GMT -6
Depends on what you call "music". We're already in an era when "singers" no longer have to even try to sing. I stand by my point. MUSIC will not die, but musicianship (what you are referring to) might become quite a rarity. How can you have music without musicianship? Without musicianship it's just more noise.
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Post by M57 on Nov 3, 2018 12:17:01 GMT -6
I would debate whether "Opening up making "music" to more and more people" is a good thing. I tend to feel that it is not and we'd all be better off without it. Sometimes gatekeepers are a GOOD thing. I'm a "teacher by day" - says so in my status.. At my school EVERY fourth and fifth grader is not only in the chorus, but also in either the String Ensemble or the Band, and EVERYONE plays an instrument. Music making and literacy is not just the expectation - it's the culture. When I was in Africa studying dance and drumming - EVERYONE in the village was a musician because everyone dances. There's little to distinguish the dancer from the drummer because dance is an integral part of the music - and the gatekeepers were the usual suspects - including sexism, nepotism and politics. When it comes to who can make great music, gatekeepers are always a bad thing. When it comes to who ends up "making" a living - the market is the gatekeeper, for both GOOD and BAD.
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Post by johneppstein on Nov 3, 2018 12:35:53 GMT -6
IMO, thats a very short sighted view of the situation by someone that I suspect doesn't have the perspective of being there when it all went down. Maybe? No offense, but as one of the guys who brought synths into the LA marketplace and faced down all the stares and hushed comments while setting up in the big LA rooms with the orchestra's and rhythm sections, I can 100% guarantee you that there are less jobs for string payers today than there was back in the early 80's. There are less jobs for engineers too. Ultimately, less jobs for ALL professional musicians. Especially in LA. The Union is in a tailspin and has been for a decade or two. Hell, drum machines almost single handedly put drummers out of business for a decade. Luckily trends change, and those drummers who could survive for a decade of 90% less gigs are back working steady. For $50- - or maybe if they are lucky - 100 a night. There is no way to quantify what AI will do to the music industry until after it happens, but we've been hit hard enough by technology to be suspicious of it don't you think? Music will not die. Maybe just musicianship. Sorry, but I think that's a very short-sighted opinion of what constitutes musicianship. No, I wasn't "there," but I was aware, and "at" the time - And at the time, I remember thinking that if a synth can do your job, that speaks to the value/quality of what you contribute to the music in the first place. What it did, in fact does was to open up roads for musicians that weren't possible before. Musicianship is part of the human spirit - you can't kill it. Jobs that are being consumed by technology are "suspect" in the first place. I know that's a harsh word - I don't mean to say in the sense that they're "bogus," but I couldn't find a softer way to say it. How many engraver jobs have been lost to technology? Do you think any millennials give it a second thought? Was the quality of orchestral music better when it was engraved by hand? Same with "real" gear vs virtual - It's simply a shift. The reality of this revolution is that while there are losers monetarily speaking, there are far more winners - and the 'void' many imagine is really an infinite space for growth and creativity. I strongly disagree. I don't think synths "opened up new roads" at all. The roads have always been there - synths just gave us flashy new cars to drive on them - while arguably detracting from the degree of skill - and, yes, "musicianship" - needed to do so.
Engravers? Fine, creative engraving is still beyond the scope of a machine. The engraving for the master plates for our currency is still done by hand - if it could be done by machine it would be pointless, as any counterfeiter could buy a machine and CAD program. What technology has done is rob us of jobs for journeyman engravers - with the result that the numbers of true masters are dwindling.
OTOH, how many everyday objects have the type of ornamentation that was commonplace a century ago? Not much. Stuff is much plainer and utilitarian and consequently we have lost something without hardly even being aware of it - much of the beauty has gone out of our lives. The very rich, of course, can still afford it.....
Do "millenniels" give a second thought? Why is this even a question? Millennials are for the most part dolts and boors who have been systematically trained NOT to think and NOT to be creative. They just regurgitate what they've been force fed. Why should we who are in what's left of the creative arts even care what they "think"? It's beside the point.
Gear vs virtual? Virtual still can't duplicate the quality performance of real gear. It can, however, do some things that real gear can't. There's a place for both, but thinking that virtual can replace real gear is like claiming that a camera can replace a painter's studio. It's ludicrous. Or that a microwave can replace a gas stove.
I would really like to believe that but all the evidence is to the contrary - else why would there be any demand for crap like automatic mixing programs and even computerized composition? If musicianship was an integral part of the human spirit there would be no interest in and no market for that crap. But instead your "millenniels" want to get to play the part (or what they THINK is the part in their media jaded, ignorant way) without actually learning to do the work.
It's pretty disgusting and does not bode well for the future of our civilisation.
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Post by johneppstein on Nov 3, 2018 12:47:20 GMT -6
I would debate whether "Opening up making "music" to more and more people" is a good thing. I tend to feel that it is not and we'd all be better off without it. Sometimes gatekeepers are a GOOD thing. I'm a "teacher by day" - says so in my status.. At my school EVERY fourth and fifth grader is not only in the chorus, but also in either the String Ensemble or the Band, and EVERYONE plays an instrument. Music making and literacy is not just the expectation - it's the culture. When I was in Africa studying dance and drumming - EVERYONE in the village was a musician because everyone dances. There's little to distinguish the dancer from the drummer because dance is an integral part of the music - and the gatekeepers were the usual suspects - including sexism, nepotism and politics. When it comes to who can make great music, gatekeepers are always a bad thing. No, gatekleepers are a GOOD thing. It would appear that your school is run by gatekeepers who believe in opening the gates to foster creativity - as opposed to the thousands of schools that have few if any music programs and turn out graduates who can't even play or sing in the most rudimentary way.
Your kids get graded on their musical performance, right? Ergo, gatekeepers.
The job of the gatekeeper is not just to keep people out - it's to OPEN the gates to those who are deserving.
If you are a teacher, you are a gatekeeper.
Wrong. The market we have now is chaos and operates against all artists. We have a Hot 100 where over 90% of the "hits" are written by TWO HACK WRITERS and singing stars are judged on their looks, not their musical ability. A market where a Bob Dylan or a Bruce Springsteen would not have stood a snowball's chance in hell of success.
And the gearpimps get rich because of the thousands and thousands of chumps who buy into the illusion of universal accessibility.
The difference is that now the gatekeepers are no longer music people (not even music lawyers), they're Madison Avenue and they're selling image.
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Post by M57 on Nov 3, 2018 13:30:40 GMT -6
Your kids get graded on their musical performance, right? Ergo, gatekeepers.
The job of the gatekeeper is not just to keep people out - it's to OPEN the gates to those who are deserving.
If you are a teacher, you are a gatekeeper.
Wrong. The market we have now is chaos and operates against all artists. We have a Hot 100 where over 90% of the "hits" are written by TWO HACK WRITERS and singing stars are judged on their looks, not their musical ability. A market where a Bob Dylan or a Bruce Springsteen would not have stood a snowball's chance in hell of success.
And the gearpimps get rich because of the thousands and thousands of chumps who buy into the illusion of universal accessibility.
The difference is that now the gatekeepers are no longer music people (not even music lawyers), they're Madison Avenue and they're selling image.
Nope - no grades - because there is no market in their lives - at least not yet. I'm no gate-keeper ..and you're making my point for me -- The "market" promotes both GOOD and BAD. If 90% of what you hear is bad, you're shopping in the wrong market.
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Post by drbill on Nov 3, 2018 13:36:00 GMT -6
IMO, thats a very short sighted view of the situation by someone that I suspect doesn't have the perspective of being there when it all went down. Maybe? No offense, but as one of the guys who brought synths into the LA marketplace and faced down all the stares and hushed comments while setting up in the big LA rooms with the orchestra's and rhythm sections, I can 100% guarantee you that there are less jobs for string payers today than there was back in the early 80's. There are less jobs for engineers too. Ultimately, less jobs for ALL professional musicians. Especially in LA. The Union is in a tailspin and has been for a decade or two. Hell, drum machines almost single handedly put drummers out of business for a decade. Luckily trends change, and those drummers who could survive for a decade of 90% less gigs are back working steady. For $50- - or maybe if they are lucky - 100 a night. There is no way to quantify what AI will do to the music industry until after it happens, but we've been hit hard enough by technology to be suspicious of it don't you think? Music will not die. Maybe just musicianship. Sorry, but I think that's a very short-sighted opinion of what constitutes musicianship. No, I wasn't "there," but I was aware, and "at" the time - And at the time, I remember thinking that if a synth can do your job, that speaks to the value/quality of what you contribute to the music in the first place. What it did, in fact does was to open up roads for musicians that weren't possible before. Musicianship is part of the human spirit - you can't kill it. Jobs that are being consumed by technology are "suspect" in the first place. I know that's a harsh word - I don't mean to say in the sense that they're "bogus," but I couldn't find a softer way to say it. How many engraver jobs have been lost to technology? Do you think any millennials give it a second thought? Was the quality of orchestral music better when it was engraved by hand? Same with "real" gear vs virtual - It's simply a shift. The reality of this revolution is that while there are losers monetarily speaking, there are far more winners - and the 'void' many imagine is really an infinite space for growth and creativity. Well...I disagree. And I got to live it, breath it, and hang out / weep with those who left music professionally to sell cars, shoes and become UPS drivers. (All needed of course, but IMO a lesser calling than being a professional musician.) I got to live with and cry with professional trumpet players who had devoted their lives to their craft, professional string players who could read anything you can put on paper, pro drummers who had the feel of gods, professional keyboard players who could arrange anything and play anything as they became everyday work a day NON-musicians. All of them leaving their craft to make a living at minimum + wage jobs - cause they had to to support their families. All of them out of "musical" work because of technology and "progress" which you seem to believe is good for society and the average joe. Is that OK with you so that we can have "everyone" playing music with no gatekeepers? Is it "OK" so that everyone can be involved with music? Is it "OK" that I can't find anyone anymore who actually knows how to read music or play at a decent level aside from the occasional phenom? What becomes of talented individuals who literally practiced 6-8+ hours a day to become the top of their craft but their craft is devalued to nothing because of the technocrats raping the musical community? I can tell you. They either become teachers or find other jobs, cause they can't make a living at their chosen craft anymore. Hey, its OK that we disagree - I get your point, but I disagree vehemently, because I've seen what it has done to talented individuals and to the musical community overall. There may be an infinite void not that begs creativity to fill it, but there are not those with the skill to actually do so. It absolutely HAS devalued music and those who devoted their time and money to create it. The perspective of teachers (yourself) is far different than that of professional musicians (those who lost their careers) and myself (who somehow managed to adapt). I'm the exception to the rule I'm afraid. A dinosaur who somehow figured out where to migrate to to survive. We have a very different viewpoint.
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Post by formatcyes on Nov 3, 2018 14:09:38 GMT -6
drbill I understand your pain but we can take the argument back further and say recorded music is the root of the problem. Before recorded music most houses had instruments and almost everyone was involved. Talented people would make money traveling around doing their shows and leave people more excited about making their own music. The advent of recording only the best on the planet with multiple takes turned participants into passive observers, then music into just back ground noise. When piano was replaced with the record player this is the first sad step IMHO. What happened to all the piano techs? They had to work for UPS. Progress is what it is and things get replaced, people's lively hood gets destroyed and they have to do something else it is what it is. We don't get to choose when to stop the progress train.
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Post by drbill on Nov 3, 2018 14:17:43 GMT -6
drbill I understand your pain but we can take the argument back further and say recorded music is the root of the problem. Before recorded music most houses had instruments and almost everyone was involved. Talented people would make money traveling around doing their shows and leave people more excited about making their own music. The advent of recording only the best on the planet with multiple takes turned participants into passive observers, then music into just back ground noise. When piano was replaced with the record player this is the first sad step IMHO. What happened to all the piano techs? They had to work for UPS. Progress is what it is and things get replaced, people's lively hood gets destroyed and they have to do something else it is what it is. We don't get to choose when to stop the progress train. Indeed. I'm not going to argue the point any further though other than to say that "music" is a part of the human spirit. But MUSICIANSHIP is a learned skill that takes hours a day for a lifetime. Something that casual dancers, having a piano in the house, going to grade school to learn an instrument doesn't even come close to approaching..... If one (metaphorically, not you in specifically) wants to argue against that, it's a sad day. Cheers,
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Post by johneppstein on Nov 3, 2018 14:43:37 GMT -6
Your kids get graded on their musical performance, right? Ergo, gatekeepers.
The job of the gatekeeper is not just to keep people out - it's to OPEN the gates to those who are deserving.
If you are a teacher, you are a gatekeeper.
Wrong. The market we have now is chaos and operates against all artists. We have a Hot 100 where over 90% of the "hits" are written by TWO HACK WRITERS and singing stars are judged on their looks, not their musical ability. A market where a Bob Dylan or a Bruce Springsteen would not have stood a snowball's chance in hell of success.
And the gearpimps get rich because of the thousands and thousands of chumps who buy into the illusion of universal accessibility.
The difference is that now the gatekeepers are no longer music people (not even music lawyers), they're Madison Avenue and they're selling image.
Nope - no grades - because there is no market in their lives - at least not yet. I'm no gate-keeper ..and you're making my point for me -- The "market" promotes both GOOD and BAD. If 90% of what you hear is bad, you're shopping in the wrong market. If you really think I'm "making your point for you" you have not done a very good job of reading what I said.
"The Market" does NOT "promote both good and bad". The "market" promotes nothing except pretty faces that look good on TV and YooToob. Why should they promote musical talent when they can "fix" anything, at least to the low standards of the martket. Occasionally someone good does happen to sneak through - like Lady Gaga - but Lady Gaga did not make it on her musical talent, she made it on her looks and her wacky outfits. And invest in and DEVELOP musical talent? God forbid - there's no development and support anymore.
If anything the cvurrent market favors the bad - they're more pliable, easier to manipulate and "handle".
First, I'm not "shopping" in any market. At this point, what I'm doing is OBSERVING. Second, there really isn't much choice in what "market" people have to shop in because in the great morass of what music has become if you don't get picked up by the arbiterrs of commerciality nobody's likely to ever hear you, no matter how good you are. Because there are no musical "gatekeepers" to provide promotion and development. And very few people have the resourses to do it themselves and people who have money seldom have much real talent. Unless Paris Hilton is your idea of a great singer.
If you don't mind my asking, how old are you? I ask because I'd like to know your frame of reference.
And yes, if you're a teacher, you're a gatekeeper. You provide opportunities, training, and resources for young people. That's a gatekeeper.
No grades? Then how do your students pass to the next grade?
No market in their lives?
Are you kidding? LIFE is a market. If you're a teacher you should know that.
As it happens, my dad was a college professor and my mom got her credential to teach grade schoolers after my parents retired. I grew up around universities and schools my whole young life. You ARE a getekeeper. You need to come to grips with that if you haven't.
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Post by johneppstein on Nov 3, 2018 15:02:03 GMT -6
drbill I understand your pain but we can take the argument back further and say recorded music is the root of the problem. Before recorded music most houses had instruments and almost everyone was involved. Talented people would make money traveling around doing their shows and leave people more excited about making their own music. The advent of recording only the best on the planet with multiple takes turned participants into passive observers, then music into just back ground noise. When piano was replaced with the record player this is the first sad step IMHO. What happened to all the piano techs? They had to work for UPS. Progress is what it is and things get replaced, people's lively hood gets destroyed and they have to do something else it is what it is. We don't get to choose when to stop the progress train. First, recording provided a vast windfall for many people in music. It was a shift, but there were many more people actually playing professionally as opposed to playing in the parlor at home and in the labor day parade.
The piano was never "replaced by the record player." The two serve different functions. And what has impacted the jobs of piano techs has been the electronic keyboard. (My keyboard player is actually a second generation piano tuner/tech.)
"Progress" is a word that means different things ion the mouths of different people. These days what some people mean by "progress" is anything but. (I wrote a song about that - there's a link here somewhere...)
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