|
Post by guitfiddler on Oct 10, 2018 16:19:16 GMT -6
I was looking at the Audient and the Midas 8 channel preamp boxes. Have any of you used these and if you were to pick, which one would you pick? I don't really want to do this just to achieve two more channels for the drums, I would rather just get two more high end preamps, but I need something portable that will connect to my Apollo 8p. I thought I would get another 8p, but that's not a cheap solution. I'm looking for a cheap, but solid solution. Review: www.pro-tools-expert.com/home-page/2015/2/22/review-shootout-audient-asp880-vs-midas-xl48-mic-preamps.htmlAudio Results: www.pro-tools-expert.com/home-page/2015/2/26/audient-asp880midas-xl48-shootout-the-results.htmlI found this article. I like the Midas better on the drums. The transients are clearer and it seems more defined to the internet streaming audio. It was close on all the other sources. I have to say I really like the meters on every channel from the Midas as well. It's difficult to make decisions when you can't try products side by side and you only have the internet audio to go by.
|
|
|
Post by Tbone81 on Oct 10, 2018 16:54:18 GMT -6
I owned the Audient ASP800, which are the same pres as the 880 but with the addition of the two "retro" channels. I loved it. Thought it sounded great. I was using it as another 8 in for a mobile rig, mostly doing drums. The two retro channels sound great too, and the DI's are nice on bass. Never tried the Midas but it was on my radar when I was looking to make the purchase.
I would base your decision more on price and feature set rather than sound, as I'm guessing the sound is no less good on either of these units.
|
|
|
Post by sirthought on Oct 10, 2018 18:35:16 GMT -6
My whole rig is the Apollo 8P and Audient ASP800 (and a Presonus HP60). The ASP800 works well tracking with Apollo Console. It took me a bit to figure out how to set things up. Once that was done, it was smooth sailing. I feel happy and satisfied with the Audient pres for getting my sessions with higher track counts done.
I do not own any classic or boutique preamps. My previous recording experience was with a Roland VS2480. To some people this may skew what I think of as good. LOL But, tracking a band with this rig is nice.
The blind tests on Protools Expert were interesting. I liked both units. I thought the Midas sounded slightly warmer, while the Audient was a bit more open and crisp. That sort of difference is minimal to me, as it can be dialed in uniquely, either when tracking or later in editing. Once you start mixing you won't be disappointed with either of these.
The described Midas fan noise would drive me nuts. If it's louder than his computer and other studio gear that's a big no for me. There's enough other unwanted sources to fight.
If I had to do it again, though, I would bite the bullet and get another 8P. I like the unison technology and it's just designed to work together with the DSP. As much as I'd like to, I don't think I'll ever be getting racks of boutique outboard pres. I don't have a space for it and this mobile rig has served me well. If I really need something more I'll book time somewhere that already has the gear.
|
|
|
Post by mcirish on Oct 11, 2018 10:48:21 GMT -6
I've got the Midas XL48. I use it mostly for drums. I run it into a Lynx Aurora 16. I use a Hardy M1 (4) for most everything else besides the drums. The Midas is good sounding and I only have two complaints. 1) No front panel power switch (not even on the back) 2) The fan is audible I solved both those problems by making a little rack plate that has a power switch with an IEC cable. I also cut the fan speed with a resistor and moved the thermistor that controls the fan speed a little way from the coil that heats up. I know some guys just disconnect the fan entirely. I still wanted a little air movement. It has high and low pass filters, But i rarely use them. Metering is fine. It sounds clean and I'm satisfied with it overall.
|
|
|
Post by bricejchandler on Oct 12, 2018 3:35:13 GMT -6
I had the Audient ASP880 for a couple years. I bought it after owning their 8024 console for a long time so I was very familiar with the sound. I compared it to the Midas pre, and even though I liked the midas sound a little better, the fan noise was just too much for me as I was gonna be using the unit for mobile work and would be in the same room as the players most of the time. The Audient along with the ID22 served me wel as a mobile preproduction rig, it was extremely compact and good sounding. Now I've read on the internet that these pres are as good as pres costing 5 times more and I'll respectfully disagree. They sound good for the price and are very reliable but comparing them to my mercury, neves, or redd clones they 're just not in the same league. They can be a little brittlet with some mics. I sold the ID22 ASP rig because I wanted something even more protable and later got a Clarett 8pre. It was a lot more stable, amazing latency but the preamps were just horrible, absolutely horrible, huge mistake! I had to take external preamps to get a decent sound which defeated the purpose of this super mobile rig. I since got an Apogee ELement 88 and I'm pretty satisfied. It fits in a backpack along with my macbook and headphones, it's just so small and it sounds good. I've uploaded some real life samples on my dropbox, one is soloed drums, 2 full band recordings and one is a drum recording done with the element ( though it's a different player/drumkit/room, but the mic setup is the same ). Now these samples are 100% raw and all the Audient ones were recorded exclusively with the Audients pres and converters ( the element is just the element pres too ) These recordings are quick preproductions done in these band's rehearsal spaces so the acoustics are pretty bad and I probably spent no more than 30 minutes setting the mics up so not ideal placement but it should at least give you an idea of how the Audient sounds. www.dropbox.com/sh/bem0862gkamqn02/AADuQvlpUoAUF7YtEsLt1-Z1a?dl=0
|
|
|
Post by guitfiddler on Oct 12, 2018 3:43:36 GMT -6
I had the Audient ASP880 for a couple years. I bought it after owning their 8024 console for a long time so I was very familiar with the sound. I compared it to the Midas pre, and even though I liked the midas sound a little better, the fan noise was just too much for me as I was gonna be using the unit for mobile work and would be in the same room as the players most of the time. The Audient along with the ID22 served me wel as a mobile preproduction rig, it was extremely compact and good sounding. Now I've read on the internet that these pres are as good as pres costing 5 times more and I'll respectfully disagree. They sound good for the price and are very reliable but comparing them to my mercury, neves, or redd clones they 're just not in the same league. They can be a little brittlet with some mics. I sold the ID22 ASP rig because I wanted something even more protable and later got a Clarett 8pre. It was a lot more stable, amazing latency but the preamps were just horrible, absolutely horrible, huge mistake! I had to take external preamps to get a decent sound which defeated the purpose of this super mobile rig. I since got an Apogee ELement 88 and I'm pretty satisfied. It fits in a backpack along with my macbook and headphones, it's just so small and it sounds good. I've uploaded some real life samples on my dropbox, one is soloed drums, 2 full band recordings and one is a drum recording done with the element ( though it's a different player/drumkit/room, but the mic setup is the same ). Now these samples are 100% raw and all the Audient ones were recorded exclusively with the Audients pres and converters ( the element is just the element pres too ) These recordings are quick preproductions done in these band's rehearsal spaces so the acoustics are pretty bad and I probably spent no more than 30 minutes setting the mics up so not ideal placement but it should at least give you an idea of how the Audient sounds. www.dropbox.com/sh/bem0862gkamqn02/AADuQvlpUoAUF7YtEsLt1-Z1a?dl=0Very surprised by the Element, very interesting, thanks.
|
|
|
Post by sirthought on Oct 12, 2018 4:05:02 GMT -6
I since got an Apogee ELement 88 and I'm pretty satisfied. It fits in a backpack along with my macbook and headphones, it's just so small and it sounds good. Sounds like you are doing some mobile work like I do. Curious how you are setting up headphone mixes if you record a band at their space? (Sorry if that takes the thread off topic. PM me if preferred.) Also, the Element 88 does sound good there. But I wonder how that would track alongside the Apollo?
|
|
|
Post by bricejchandler on Oct 12, 2018 4:54:38 GMT -6
I since got an Apogee ELement 88 and I'm pretty satisfied. It fits in a backpack along with my macbook and headphones, it's just so small and it sounds good. Sounds like you are doing some mobile work like I do. Curious how you are setting up headphone mixes if you record a band at their space? (Sorry if that takes the thread off topic. PM me if preferred.) Also, the Element 88 does sound good there. But I wonder how that would track alongside the Apollo? Most of the time I just record them as if they were rehearsing so no headphones, and vocals through the PA... I do have a presonus hp60 that along with the element can give me 4 different headphone mixes. I also have a behreinge 8200 laying around if I want even more outputs so I can actually get 8 different mixes but I've never actually needed it. I tried the silver apollo when I was looking for a mobile rig 4 years ago and did not care for it. I got the id22 asp880 and thought it sounded better for my taste. Don't know about the newer editions... I'm very happy with the element. The conversion is excellent And my external preamps sound awesome through it, the headphone amps are smooth.
|
|
|
Post by Quint on Oct 12, 2018 5:15:50 GMT -6
I had the Audient ASP880 for a couple years. I bought it after owning their 8024 console for a long time so I was very familiar with the sound. I compared it to the Midas pre, and even though I liked the midas sound a little better, the fan noise was just too much for me as I was gonna be using the unit for mobile work and would be in the same room as the players most of the time. The Audient along with the ID22 served me wel as a mobile preproduction rig, it was extremely compact and good sounding. Now I've read on the internet that these pres are as good as pres costing 5 times more and I'll respectfully disagree. They sound good for the price and are very reliable but comparing them to my mercury, neves, or redd clones they 're just not in the same league. They can be a little brittlet with some mics. I sold the ID22 ASP rig because I wanted something even more protable and later got a Clarett 8pre. It was a lot more stable, amazing latency but the preamps were just horrible, absolutely horrible, huge mistake! I had to take external preamps to get a decent sound which defeated the purpose of this super mobile rig. I since got an Apogee ELement 88 and I'm pretty satisfied. It fits in a backpack along with my macbook and headphones, it's just so small and it sounds good. I've uploaded some real life samples on my dropbox, one is soloed drums, 2 full band recordings and one is a drum recording done with the element ( though it's a different player/drumkit/room, but the mic setup is the same ). Now these samples are 100% raw and all the Audient ones were recorded exclusively with the Audients pres and converters ( the element is just the element pres too ) These recordings are quick preproductions done in these band's rehearsal spaces so the acoustics are pretty bad and I probably spent no more than 30 minutes setting the mics up so not ideal placement but it should at least give you an idea of how the Audient sounds. www.dropbox.com/sh/bem0862gkamqn02/AADuQvlpUoAUF7YtEsLt1-Z1a?dl=0How much do you think the converters on the ASP might have played a role in your opinions of the preamps on the ASP? Just curious. I have an ASP800 but I've never used the converters on it. I've been happy with the preamps though. Just clean and transparent.
|
|
|
Post by bricejchandler on Oct 12, 2018 6:20:35 GMT -6
Good question and honestly I'm not sure. I've never used the 880 preamps independently from the converters.
I did have the Audient console for 10 years in my studio and always got great results into my lynx auroras, the results were better than what I got with the 880, but it's hard to compare as the room was better than most places I used the 880 in. I have used some of my external preamps through the element Line ins and the Audient line ins and think the converters on the element sound better.
Audient have just done a big shootout on their site comparing all the versions of their preamp from the tiny id4 soundcard to the desk. the takes done through the desk pres are going through symphony converters and to me those takes sound a million times better than through their soundcards or standalone preamps.
|
|
|
Post by bricejchandler on Oct 12, 2018 9:51:32 GMT -6
Some people seem interested in the Element so I added a couple 100% raw preproduction drum tracks done exclusively with the Element preamps, no eq or compression, just the mics plugged into the soundcard. The 3 examples are from different sessions with different drummers , kits and locations ( 1 and 2 are rehearsal spaces and 3 is actually an old wooden barn) but I still think the character of the preamp sounds pretty consistent across the different examples. here's the link again www.dropbox.com/sh/bem0862gkamqn02/AADuQvlpUoAUF7YtEsLt1-Z1a?dl=0
|
|
|
Post by Guitar on Oct 12, 2018 12:17:50 GMT -6
I was looking at the Audient and the Midas 8 channel preamp boxes. Have any of you used these and if you were to pick, which one would you pick? I don't really want to do this just to achieve two more channels for the drums, I would rather just get two more high end preamps, but I need something portable that will connect to my Apollo 8p. I thought I would get another 8p, but that's not a cheap solution. I'm looking for a cheap, but solid solution. Review: www.pro-tools-expert.com/home-page/2015/2/22/review-shootout-audient-asp880-vs-midas-xl48-mic-preamps.htmlAudio Results: www.pro-tools-expert.com/home-page/2015/2/26/audient-asp880midas-xl48-shootout-the-results.htmlI found this article. I like the Midas better on the drums. The transients are clearer and it seems more defined to the internet streaming audio. It was close on all the other sources. I have to say I really like the meters on every channel from the Midas as well. It's difficult to make decisions when you can't try products side by side and you only have the internet audio to go by. Wow, no question for me, I would go with the Midas XL48. Going into the test I was biased toward the Audient since I've heard good things done with those, Midas was semi unknown to me. But I listened for the most part blind and the Midas came out clearly on top for my ears.
|
|
|
Post by guitfiddler on Oct 12, 2018 15:17:30 GMT -6
Now I want the Element...lol
|
|
|
Post by Guitar on Oct 12, 2018 15:28:07 GMT -6
Now I want the Element...lol It never ends... it's never going to end.
|
|
|
Post by guitfiddler on Oct 12, 2018 18:31:29 GMT -6
Some people seem interested in the Element so I added a couple 100% raw preproduction drum tracks done exclusively with the Element preamps, no eq or compression, just the mics plugged into the soundcard. The 3 examples are from different sessions with different drummers , kits and locations ( 1 and 2 are rehearsal spaces and 3 is actually an old wooden barn) but I still think the character of the preamp sounds pretty consistent across the different examples. here's the link again www.dropbox.com/sh/bem0862gkamqn02/AADuQvlpUoAUF7YtEsLt1-Z1a?dl=0Just curious what mics were used into the Element on the drums?
|
|
ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
Posts: 15,021
|
Post by ericn on Oct 12, 2018 21:29:02 GMT -6
Now I want the Element...lol It never ends... it's never going to end. That could be the RGP Motto!
|
|
|
Post by bricejchandler on Oct 13, 2018 1:07:17 GMT -6
Some people seem interested in the Element so I added a couple 100% raw preproduction drum tracks done exclusively with the Element preamps, no eq or compression, just the mics plugged into the soundcard. The 3 examples are from different sessions with different drummers , kits and locations ( 1 and 2 are rehearsal spaces and 3 is actually an old wooden barn) but I still think the character of the preamp sounds pretty consistent across the different examples. here's the link again www.dropbox.com/sh/bem0862gkamqn02/AADuQvlpUoAUF7YtEsLt1-Z1a?dl=0Just curious what mics were used into the Element on the drums? Recording 1 is Kick - Sontronics DM1B Snare - SM57 OHs - schoeps MK4s in XY FOK - AEA R44 Toms - M201 and SM7 Rec 2 Kick - The drummer brought a kick mic he liked so I used that but don't remember what it was, one of the smiley face modern ones, D6 or E602. D6 probably Snare - SM57 OHS - schoeps in XY Rec 3 This one we originally weren't supposed to track drums so I didn't have all my mics available; I ended up with a weird setup. Kick - DM1B Snare - SM57 OHs - SM7 over the hihat, a U87 maybe 5 inches straight above the kick drum, panned L/R Bass tom - SM57 The Element is definitely a nice piece of gear. The preamps are good interface preamps, they can sound a bit dull or veiled on some sources but they do the job. However in these examples, I'm gonna state the obvious but I do think that the room and drums themselves play the biggest role in the differences in sound. The room where the first Audient drum example was recorded sounded horrible and the kit wasn't great. I don't want people to think that the Audient is what made that recording sound not so great... Searching through my files I found another drum session recorded with the 880, this room sounded quite a bit better than the first example so I uploaded it. ( and it's the same setup as element recording 1 only with an extra schoeps mic on the HH). And here's a live session tracked with my ID22+880 rig, no external preamps or anything. I do think that if you like the Element vibe better you would probably be happier with the Midas, which sounds a bit warmer I guess. If you can live with the fan noise that is.
|
|
kcatthedog
Temp
Super Helpful Dude
Posts: 15,226
Member is Online
|
Post by kcatthedog on Oct 13, 2018 3:57:44 GMT -6
Great thread. The sleeper reference for me but I haven’t used one is the new apollo x, which I think might be in between the audient and Midas but also no fan.
|
|
|
Post by guitfiddler on Oct 13, 2018 13:25:47 GMT -6
Just curious what mics were used into the Element on the drums? Recording 1 is Kick - Sontronics DM1B Snare - SM57 OHs - schoeps MK4s in XY FOK - AEA R44 Toms - M201 and SM7 Rec 2 Kick - The drummer brought a kick mic he liked so I used that but don't remember what it was, one of the smiley face modern ones, D6 or E602. D6 probably Snare - SM57 OHS - schoeps in XY Rec 3 This one we originally weren't supposed to track drums so I didn't have all my mics available; I ended up with a weird setup. Kick - DM1B Snare - SM57 OHs - SM7 over the hihat, a U87 maybe 5 inches straight above the kick drum, panned L/R Bass tom - SM57 The Element is definitely a nice piece of gear. The preamps are good interface preamps, they can sound a bit dull or veiled on some sources but they do the job. However in these examples, I'm gonna state the obvious but I do think that the room and drums themselves play the biggest role in the differences in sound. The room where the first Audient drum example was recorded sounded horrible and the kit wasn't great. I don't want people to think that the Audient is what made that recording sound not so great... Searching through my files I found another drum session recorded with the 880, this room sounded quite a bit better than the first example so I uploaded it. ( and it's the same setup as element recording 1 only with an extra schoeps mic on the HH). And here's a live session tracked with my ID22+880 rig, no external preamps or anything. I do think that if you like the Element vibe better you would probably be happier with the Midas, which sounds a bit warmer I guess. If you can live with the fan noise that is. Thanks for the info...great read!
|
|
|
Post by sirthought on Oct 14, 2018 16:44:01 GMT -6
Great thread. The sleeper reference for me but I haven’t used one is the new apollo x, which I think might be in between the audient and Midas but also no fan. Really? I would think the Apollo pres are better than Audient or Midas. I've always been really pleased with them, even when not using unison plugins. But again, I doubt the differences are so huge, that once you go into mixing you couldn't get the sound you hope for via EQ or dynamics.
|
|
kcatthedog
Temp
Super Helpful Dude
Posts: 15,226
Member is Online
|
Post by kcatthedog on Oct 14, 2018 16:56:30 GMT -6
Remember that the apollo X , which was just released, has been significantly upgraded internally, while the ic pres are, I believe, the same, almost everything else has been upgraded.
|
|
|
Post by Guitar on Oct 14, 2018 16:58:19 GMT -6
Yeah I was gonna ask which apollo? I guess that covers it.
It's kind of amazing that there are already 3 gens. A bit confusing as well.
|
|
kcatthedog
Temp
Super Helpful Dude
Posts: 15,226
Member is Online
|
Post by kcatthedog on Oct 14, 2018 17:54:02 GMT -6
silver, black, blue: get with the program will ya !
|
|
|
Post by Guitar on Oct 14, 2018 18:00:25 GMT -6
silver, black, blue: get with the program will ya ! they should introduce a "dark" apollo and a "normal" apollo at the same time just to confuse the sh%t out of everyone and maybe something with an odd number of DSP cores like an X7 or X3
|
|
kcatthedog
Temp
Super Helpful Dude
Posts: 15,226
Member is Online
|
Post by kcatthedog on Oct 14, 2018 18:22:35 GMT -6
I’m holding out for chartreuse to match my eyes !
|
|