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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2017 21:14:25 GMT -6
Now it's my turn to look for a few ideas. Some of you know I do location classical recording. Most of the time it's concerts--one take, pack up, go home. But once in a while, I do actual sessions. I was doing that today--pianist out in the auditorium, me offstage in the wings. I could hear her easily, but had to shout for her to hear me. Time to think about a talkback system. So I thought I might see if folks here had some ideas.
i only have a handful of requirements: cheap, quiet and very portable. I've probably got a few pieces here that I can use--small speakers, small consumer amp. I figure any crap dynamic mic with an off switch would suffice. So at the minimum, I'd need some sort of mic pre with a -10 consumer output. That doesn't seem to be a common piece. But I'm flexible and open to ideas.
Any suggestions? Many thanks.
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Post by Bob Olhsson on Dec 9, 2017 21:29:23 GMT -6
Rane and M-Audio both appear on eBay.
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Post by donr on Dec 9, 2017 21:32:20 GMT -6
How about a pair of cheap consumer wireless walkie-talkies? Not like you're gonna interrupt a take to talk back. Or your cell phones, for that matter..
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2017 21:36:07 GMT -6
Rane and M-Audio both appear on eBay. I'll look. Thanks Bob. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2017 21:42:29 GMT -6
How about a pair of cheap consumer wireless walkie-talkies? Not like you're gonna interrupt a take to talk back. Or your cell phones, for that matter.. Needs to be hands-off for the performers, since they don't know when I'm going to pop off about something. Cell phone is an interesting notion, but they're usually off for sessions of this nature. |
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Post by gouge on Dec 9, 2017 21:50:19 GMT -6
Just use walkie talkies
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Post by donr on Dec 9, 2017 21:52:05 GMT -6
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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2017 9:48:41 GMT -6
Thanks for the link. The 23-mile range is interesting. I might need longer mic cables. |
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Dec 10, 2017 12:17:11 GMT -6
I know a couple of guys who used cheap powered speakers and a cheap wireless mic, usually lav or headset.
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Post by Pueblo Audio on Dec 10, 2017 13:48:31 GMT -6
Now it's my turn to look for a few ideas. Some of you know I do location classical recording. Most of the time it's concerts--one take, pack up, go home. But once in a while, I do actual sessions. I was doing that today--pianist out in the auditorium, me offstage in the wings. I could hear her easily, but had to shout for her to hear me. Time to think about a talkback system. So I thought I might see if folks here had some ideas. i only have a handful of requirements: cheap, quiet and very portable. I've probably got a few pieces here that I can use--small speakers, small consumer amp. I figure any crap dynamic mic with an off switch would suffice. So at the minimum, I'd need some sort of mic pre with a -10 consumer output. That doesn't seem to be a common piece. But I'm flexible and open to ideas. Any suggestions? Many thanks. One thing that is missing from your list of requirements, and may be the most important, is a TB system that is intelligible to the performer. Crappy sound quality can really vex an artist and blow the mood of the session. Classical location recording was my main vocation for a decade or two. Even to this day I have never seen a satisfactory monitor/talkback product. This is because variations in recording workflow and production needs preclude a TB that always has the "perfect fit". Customization has been the rule in my experience. Over time I developed for myself 3 different systems specific for the complexity of the gigs I encountered. My smallest system, which seems like what you are interested in, consists of an old Shure dynamic mic. The kind that looks like an air traffic controller mic. Then I bought a small, battery powered computer speaker and modified it by installing a simple mic preamp within. Picture attached. This system is small, portable, affordable and does not disturb nor distract the performer. When the mic is switched off the thing is dead silent. Because it is totally floating there are no ground loop issues to deal with. If you look closely you will see that I transposed the gender of the XLRs. This is so I can simply connect via any spare snake/mic line going from the stage to control room. Attachment Deleted |
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Post by jazznoise on Dec 11, 2017 3:04:32 GMT -6
I just yell over when I need to talk, but walkie talkies sound way more fun!!!
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Post by pope on Dec 11, 2017 16:55:05 GMT -6
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Post by markfouxman on Dec 11, 2017 17:00:56 GMT -6
Hey Michael,
Just use any small powered monitor and connect it to a cheapo small pre like Audio Buddy, etc. and dynamic mic. If you need that setup for a session I can lend you one.
Best, M
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Post by Deleted on Dec 12, 2017 7:22:45 GMT -6
Thanks everyone. There are some good suggestions and I'll consider them all. Mark, thanks for the offer. But we may be doing all 32 Beethoven piano sonatas over the next couple of years. You'd never get it back!
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Dec 12, 2017 9:10:03 GMT -6
Was talking to a freind who dose a lot of large scale Symthonic broadcast stuff his advice " local SR rental size to need, cheap wireless bodypack system so you can be heard anywhere anytime!"
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Post by markfouxman on Dec 12, 2017 14:48:37 GMT -6
Mark, thanks for the offer. But we may be doing all 32 Beethoven piano sonatas over the next couple of years. You'd never get it back! AFAIK, only Vedrana does all of them in town! Do you record her? Sincerely yours played only third of them))). I definitely do not care about AudioBuddy, so you can have it--at least it will get some use and serve some purpose... Best, M |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 12, 2017 21:34:38 GMT -6
Yep, it's Vedrana. We did opus 10.2 the other day. We'll have to resume our mic discussion when we can, but as you know, I record for both stereo and surround. So I've got to have a physical center mic. So for this, I'm using a km140 as a spot, then a 5-channel Decca tree with Schoeps (2 Mk2, 2 Mk2H, Mk21-center). Couple of my Stratus verbs to sweeten. Libby Gardner Hall looks better than it sounds, so it takes some placement tricks to avoid slaps.
BTW, most people use one of the NY Steinways in that room, but we did test recordings a couple of weeks ago. The Hamburg wins--much better instrument.
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Dec 12, 2017 22:00:27 GMT -6
Yep, it's Vedrana. We did opus 10.2 the other day. We'll have to resume our mic discussion when we can, but as you know, I record for both stereo and surround. So I've got to have a physical center mic. So for this, I'm using a km140 as a spot, then a 5-channel Decca tree with Schoeps (2 Mk2, 2 Mk2H, Mk21-center). Couple of my Stratus verbs to sweeten. Libby Gardner Hall looks better than it sounds, so it takes some placement tricks to avoid slaps. BTW, most people use one of the NY Steinways in that room, but we did test recordings a couple of weeks ago. The Hamburg wins--much better instrument. Hey I still have dents in my head from doing sessions at the Frank Loyd Wright 1st Unitarian Meeting House, recording was almost as much fun as finding an SR solution Taliesen would approve. |
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Post by markfouxman on Dec 14, 2017 0:17:41 GMT -6
Yep, it's Vedrana. We did opus 10.2 the other day. We'll have to resume our mic discussion when we can, but as you know, I record for both stereo and surround. So I've got to have a physical center mic. So for this, I'm using a km140 as a spot, then a 5-channel Decca tree with Schoeps (2 Mk2, 2 Mk2H, Mk21-center). Couple of my Stratus verbs to sweeten. Libby Gardner Hall looks better than it sounds, so it takes some placement tricks to avoid slaps. BTW, most people use one of the NY Steinways in that room, but we did test recordings a couple of weeks ago. The Hamburg wins--much better instrument. She is very good! At least you won't be desperately fishing between takes for the missing notes in passages))) The only time I chose NY over Hamburg was at ASU Katzin Hall. Last time I played in Libby Gardener was a few years ago. They had 4 D's and I chose #4, which was Hamburg. Heather also liked that one the best. Not sure if they changed the instruments since then... Speaking of surround I need to talk to you about true line source surround ribbon mic. Let's have a date... BTW, I have a perfect solution for your talk back system: ![]()  Best, M |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 14, 2017 21:45:50 GMT -6
The only time I chose NY over Hamburg was at ASU Katzin Hall. Last time I played in Libby Gardener was a few years ago. They had 4 D's and I chose #4, which was Hamburg. Heather also liked that one the best. Not sure if they changed the instruments since then...
#4 is the instrument we're using. It's very nicely balanced. I've recorded Jason Hardink on the NY and that worked well, but it was a different kind of music. It seems the NY has become the instrument of choice for most concerts at Libby because people think it projects better. But most of the time I think it needs to be on the short stick anyway. Speaking of surround I need to talk to you about true line source surround ribbon mic. Let's have a date...I'm all ears. I'd love to be less busy than I am. We should have gotten together months ago. BTW, I have a perfect solution for your talk back systemI wish I could upvote that graphic 20 times! ![]() There are probably some people watching this conversation who wonder what we're going on about. I guess the point is that a Steinway just isn't a Steinway. Besides the basic fact that there are American and German Steinways, each generation has been built by a different master craftsman. They all feel different and they all sound different--sometimes radically different. Heck, the best lieder piano I ever heard wasn't even a Steinway. It was a Mason & Hamlin. |
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Post by Bob Olhsson on Dec 14, 2017 22:58:17 GMT -6
I think the NY are a lot more variable and quality doesn't seem related to age. The very best I've ever heard have been NY but I've heard plenty that a Hamburg or Yamaha could beat.
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Post by markfouxman on Dec 14, 2017 23:17:43 GMT -6
Heck, the best lieder piano I ever heard wasn't even a Steinway. It was a Mason & Hamlin. Yes, I can believe it. A friend of mine bought modern 7' Mason & Hamlin for his studio and it was better than most of Steinway D's I've seen at concert halls at US Universities... Talking of "lieder" one of the best instruments I've ever played is Bechstein, and the very best is the newest Ant. Petrof 275. Last January I was recording it in Prague at Petrof factory with our stereo VL373A. The disk received Silver Medal at Global Music Award 2017: www.amazon.com/gp/product/B073W6N4RP/ref=dm_ws_sp_ps_dpI will give you this disk once (and if) our paths get crossed))) Best, M |
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