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Post by reddirt on Jul 8, 2017 23:18:50 GMT -6
Hi guys, any among you have the knowledge of what is the best sounding / most reliable of the current crop of 1x15 / horn , PA top boxes.
Thinking along the realms of Yamaha DSR 115 / EV ETX 15 etc, etc; any and all brands considered.
Am not wanting a sub and all that entails hence 1x15 as opposed to 1 x 12
Currently have RCF HD 12 (plastic box) , not overly impressed so will retire them to in fill or monitors.
Wanting it to do do high quality but not loud reinforcement for acoustic act with a bit of bass : i.e. 2 acoustics, sax, upright bass, 3 vox
I'm miles from anywhere so can't audition for myself.
Cheers, Ross
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Post by wiz on Jul 8, 2017 23:34:33 GMT -6
Passive or powered?
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Post by reddirt on Jul 9, 2017 1:35:44 GMT -6
Thanks Wiz - powered
Cheers
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Post by johneppstein on Jul 9, 2017 14:26:29 GMT -6
Hi guys, any among you have the knowledge of what is the best sounding / most reliable of the current crop of 1x15 / horn , PA top boxes. Thinking along the realms of Yamaha DSR 115 / EV ETX 15 etc, etc; any and all brands considered. Am not wanting a sub and all that entails hence 1x15 as opposed to 1 x 12 Currently have RCF HD 12 (plastic box) , not overly impressed so will retire them to in fill or monitors. Wanting it to do do high quality but not loud reinforcement for acoustic act with a bit of bass : i.e. 2 acoustics, sax, upright bass, 3 vox I'm miles from anywhere so can't audition for myself. Cheers, Ross I am not impressed with any of the "plastic box" systems that I've seen from any of the usual suspects. Some are definitely worse than others but none of them are that great - I don't like the construction, the quality of the drivers, or the onboard amkplifier modules, which never seem to perform like the hype says they do. The cheap OEM Class D modules may be capable of meeting advertised spec if you're talking "Instantaneous Peak Power" but I seriously doubt they come close in continuous ("rms") measurements. There is one system i've had experience with that fits that general package size but not price point, which is one by EAW. I'm not certain of the exact model numbers, but I've seen them make it through 10 hours of a very loud (indoor) mini- festival in a maybe 500 occupany ballroom facility. True, they just barely made it - the tech from the sound company burned his hand on the heat sink of the amp in one of the tops boxes, but they did make it and sounded good doing it. The system was a pair (IIRC) of top boxes and a pair of moderate sized subs per side.) JBL also makes some (non-plastic) portable powered boxes that are pretty good. Steer clear of their plastic box stuff. |
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Jul 9, 2017 15:37:05 GMT -6
QSC and JBL are the standard, they are what they are. The Meyer, EAW and Vue audio boxes always impress but they ain't cheap!
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Post by jcoutu1 on Jul 9, 2017 19:31:13 GMT -6
Everyone is running QSC K12's these days.
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Post by mulmany on Jul 9, 2017 21:31:07 GMT -6
The Yamaha and EV hold there own against the QSC. I would recommend 10" or 12" speakers and then add a small sub. No one wants to lift 15" on and off a pole every night.
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Post by johneppstein on Jul 9, 2017 21:50:39 GMT -6
QSC and JBL are the standard, they are what they are. The Meyer, EAW and Vue audio boxes always impress but they ain't cheap! I've seen a lot of blown QSCs in clubs. Same with the plastic JBLs - they're so poorly made it's embarrassing. |
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Post by reddirt on Jul 9, 2017 23:49:47 GMT -6
"I would recommend 10" or 12" speakers and then add a small sub. No one wants to lift 15" on and off a pole every night."
Thanks but not interested in a sub as that's more space in a vehicle and more dollars; I'm good with lifting 60lbs onto a stand.
The contendors so far are EV ETX15, Yamaha DSR 115 , HK Pulsar 15, Turbosound IQ 15 ; any comments on those and possible other options are welcomed.
Cheers, Ross
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Post by wiz on Jul 9, 2017 23:57:27 GMT -6
i did a demo night with my old band for EV.
It was about 4-5 years back... don't know if they are the current boxes.
The 12" and Sub worked a treat..as did the 15" on their own.
They also had these little 8" that we used as fold back, they were ok too.... they even put them up and ran em with the sub.. would work good for little little gig.
I have played through the RCF's many times as one of the sound companies here in Bundy use them... the other company uses NEXO.. I Like the NEXO a lot.. .but the RCFs are cool..mainly as long as the guy mixing knows whats what they are all really good.
QSC gets a good rap... but I don't recall playing through them.
I have a set of EONs I have had for 20 plus years now... the only surviving piece is one 15" top box.. but Jo teaches singing through it, 8 hours a day, 6 days a week for the last 13 years ... 8)... combine that with us doing at least 600 gigs through it... you can bag the EONs, but they put a lot of food on my table and kid through school.....!!! 8)
I wouldnt recommend them though now , against whats out there.
Do you know Simon Stav? he is a nice bloke runs sound out of Geelong, I think he would be a good bloke to ask
cheers
Wiz
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Jul 10, 2017 8:52:36 GMT -6
QSC and JBL are the standard, they are what they are. The Meyer, EAW and Vue audio boxes always impress but they ain't cheap! I've seen a lot of blown QSCs in clubs. Same with the plastic JBLs - they're so poorly made it's embarrassing. It's also a numbers game so many QSC JBL and EV you see a lot blown! Fact is you get what you paid for! Personally I would pick up some nice old passives Meyer UPM, Apogee or EAW JF200 with say a XTA and some old crest 6001-7001s So many of the affordable Actives are Crappy drivers made useable with DSP ! |
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Jul 10, 2017 8:55:13 GMT -6
"I would recommend 10" or 12" speakers and then add a small sub. No one wants to lift 15" on and off a pole every night." Thanks but not interested in a sub as that's more space in a vehicle and more dollars; I'm good with lifting 60lbs onto a stand. The contendors so far are EV ETX15, Yamaha DSR 115 , HK Pulsar 15, Turbosound IQ 15 ; any comments on those and possible other options are welcomed. Cheers, Ross Yamaha and Turbo seam to have some pro respect for AV stuff, but again you take a look at the drivers and you wonder where the money went! |
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Post by johneppstein on Jul 10, 2017 15:18:53 GMT -6
I've seen a lot of blown QSCs in clubs. Same with the plastic JBLs - they're so poorly made it's embarrassing. It's also a numbers game so many QSC JBL and EV you see a lot blown! Fact is you get what you paid for! Personally I would pick up some nice old passives Meyer UPM, Apogee or EAW JF200 with say a XTA and some old crest 6001-7001s So many of the affordable Actives are Crappy drivers made useable with DSP ! Well, I've seen a lot blown in proportion to the number in service.The HF driver used in the JBL Eon is beyond any doubt the worst excuse for a speaker element I've ever seen in an alleged "PA Cabinet" - it makes the cheap Fostex drivers used in inexpensive bass amps look good. (It's "1 inch exit" but has a tiny, maybe 3/4" voice coil) It's so crappy that JBL doesn't sell a diaphragm for it (although the diaphragm is replaceable), they want you to spend $90 on a replacement driver. The phase plug, such as it is, is injection molded plastic. There is actually a 3rd party supplier that sells replacement diaphragms in two grades - for about $20 you can get ones like the original, for an extra $10 you can get ones with a real injection molded pot metal phase plug. I have a pair of bottom of the line JBL passives (Model JRX-115) that used the same driver. They worked OK for low volume rehearsals, but blew the first real gig I tried them on. (their light bulb driver protection does not work.) I did buy a set of replacement diaphragms, but then thought better of it and replaced both entire drivers with a pair of Peavey C22As I got used, which are VASTLY superior. (Thank god for standard screw mounts). Many of the bad QSCs I've seen had amp problems. NONE of the powered speakers in that class that I've seen have output commensurate with the published ratings. They claim ratings in the 800-1000 watt range but the actual output is like a traditional passive speaker like one of the little 2-way Peaveys you used to see all the time driven by maybe a 200 watt amp. What I'm using now for my portable PA with my country band is a little Yamaha integrated PA head with 2x200 watt amps (Which I believe are Class AB) into a pair of passive JBL PRX400s (Model PRX412M) which double as mains for small club gigs and monitors during rehearsals, which are excellent - they're real JBLs, not Harman crap with the JBL sticker slapped on. Most of the time one side feeds the JBL mains and the other feeds these little tiny Fender 10" co-axial wedge monitors. We seldom, if even, need more than the 200 watts on the mains in a small club due to the efficiency of the PRX412s. They make a 15" version, the PRX415M. I would not use any of the "plastic box" speakers on the market - they're a ripoff. JBL does make portable powered speakers that are quite good - powered versions of my passives - bit they're not plastic box and they cost a little more, but they're well worth the extra cost. Model numbers are PRX812 (12") and PRX 815 (15"). Another thing to remember about the plastic boxes is than more often than not the drivers are relatively low efficiency, so even if the amps did put out anywhere near rated powere on a continuous basis most of it would be lost in the speakers before any air got moved. Don't be fooled by impressive paper specs - paper won't amplify your band. (when I replaced those cheesy drivers in my old PA cabs with the Peaveys I got arounf a 6-10dB boost in HF efficiency, just goes to show how utterly execrable the original drivers were. I, myself, if looking for a new gigging system, would probably stick with passives and a good powered mixer or a small board and power amp. High quality used Class AB power amps are really cheap right now since the market is flooded with cheap, crappy Class D amps hyped with exaggerated specs. With a seperate amp you can easily upgrade power as needed and power amps don't add much bulk to your gear pack - and a lot of us have extra power amps hanging around anyway. If I need to augment my little Yammie I can easily add an external amp to it. It's a couple more individual pieces to carry but not significantly more bulk. The important thing in a gigging rig is reliability and backup. One of the big problems with the plastic box things are that if you blow a speaker your amp is out of service and if an amp goes, ditto for the speaker. I like to be able to swap out individual components if need be - it makes more sense. Also, if you DO need to service a plastic box usually they won't bother trying to fix the bad component. If an amp blows they'l pitch it and sell you a new amp module. With the prosumer Class D stuff more often than not the amp isn't even made by the company selling the gear, it's a cheap OEM part from who knows where? |
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