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Post by M57 on Aug 10, 2016 6:07:13 GMT -6
My old cheap 425 volt Battery Back up (Try not to laugh - I probably bought it 4 or 5 years ago at Home Depot for $35) is not doing the job - I'm pretty sure it can't handle the load - the last time the power went out, everything just shut down. I'll get the occasional flicker of house lights when lightning is close by, but I suspect that the power coming into my home is pretty stable. Running an iMac - a second monitor, and a host of gear. Recent purchases include tubes (WA-2A - Dizengoff Pre's etc.), but they're rarely on - only when tracking, which is not that often. I was considering something like.. www.amazon.com/dp/B00429N19WDo I even need a Battery? ..or should I just get a unit that has a filtering transformer/conditioning and shuts things down gently? Is >$200 a reasonable budget or would I just be throwing money away? Feel free to read the riot act to me and tell me that my house could burn down unless I get hi-end conditioning equipment and should be spending at least $500, but let me remind you that then I won't be able to afford that clock that does ..what? I dunno.
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Post by svart on Aug 10, 2016 8:30:33 GMT -6
I dunno, seems fine to me. Personally I don't run any "conditioning" on my computer or gear, I just shut down everything during thunderstorms. I think in 15+ years of recording, I've only had maybe 2-3 hard shutdowns due to power issues, none of which resulted in anything bad. I also save every single time I do something.
I would only put your computer and monitors on the battery backup, and intend on using it only to save your work and gracefully shut down. Lightning and odd power problems (automobile hits a power pole, etc) can still destroy your equipment, even with "protection" devices between your gear and the wall power, so the best option is to shut it down and unplug it if you keep having lightning strikes or power surges.
I guess the moral of the story is that no matter what anyone says, there is no perfect protection for electronics. The best protection is NO connection!
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Post by M57 on Aug 10, 2016 9:49:05 GMT -6
Thanks! We'll see how others weigh in, but that makes me feel better. I had the same thoughts regarding using the battery only for the computer. Yeah, if I'm in the middle of a session, I want to save and power down, but I save often enough that it's unlikely I'd ever lose more than 15 or 20 minutes of work anyway. I've never had a power outage break any of my equipment, and when I'm going to be away for a week I typically unplug everything. And it's not like I would need two hours of back-up. I mean what good does that do if my modem and the internet are likely down as well.
What about straight surge protectors? Are there quality differences there?
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Post by drbill on Aug 10, 2016 10:16:13 GMT -6
WE have some hellacious thunderstorms and lightning around here. So when I built the new CRM, Jeff Hedback recommended a SurgeX sub panel. Pricey, but I'm glad I did it. Due to ground up and superior electrical design I didn't have to star ground this buildout, and the result has been awesome. I also put an overall surge protector on the main panel of the house. Again, not cheap, but with two surge protectors in front of my gear there's a little more peace of mind. I've got no battery backup though. All our electrical close by is underground, so we have a little less problem with losing power I think : espsurgex.com/product/branch-circuit/
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Post by M57 on Aug 10, 2016 10:30:05 GMT -6
WE have some hellacious thunderstorms and lightning around here. So when I built the new CRM, Jeff Hedback recommended a SurgeX sub panel. Pricey, but I'm glad I did it. Due to ground up and superior electrical design I didn't have to star ground this buildout, and the result has been awesome. I also put an overall surge protector on the main panel of the house. Again, not cheap, but with two surge protectors in front of my gear there's a little more peace of mind. I've got no battery backup though. All our electrical close by is underground, so we have a little less problem with losing power I think : espsurgex.com/product/branch-circuit/Nice. Same company makes this.. www.amazon.com/SurgeX-SA-82-Flatpak-Surge-Eliminator/dp/B00DWPMRBAit's more in-line with my budget and needs, but no battery backup.
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Post by svart on Aug 10, 2016 10:51:07 GMT -6
I once was in a studio where lightning hit just outside the building.. Power went crazy, things started frying, etc.
Turns out that the lightning strike hit right near the ground rod of the building, sending the charge up through the grounding.. No protection circuit in the world would have saved anything on that strike.
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Post by jcoutu1 on Aug 10, 2016 14:40:20 GMT -6
I unplug my entire system from the wall when not in use. If I'm working and a storm is coming, I'll bail for the night. Better safe than sorry for me.
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Post by wiz on Aug 10, 2016 14:58:08 GMT -6
I unplug my entire system from the wall when not in use. If I'm working and a storm is coming, I'll bail for the night. Better safe than sorry for me. this is what I do each night as I leave. cheers Wiz
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Post by mulmany on Aug 10, 2016 17:38:20 GMT -6
I once was in a studio where lightning hit just outside the building.. Power went crazy, things started frying, etc. Turns out that the lightning strike hit right near the ground rod of the building, sending the charge up through the grounding.. No protection circuit in the world would have saved anything on that strike. Yeah, you would need a ground disconnect and that's a bit counter intuitive to surge protection.
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Post by westom on Aug 10, 2016 21:22:27 GMT -6
it's more in-line with my budget and needs, but no battery backup. Which do you want? Hardware protection or battery backup. Those are two completely unrelated functions. Battery backup does nothing to protect hardware. Battery backup is to protect unsaved data. It does not protect saved data or hardware. Surge protection is to protect hardware from a transient that can overwhelm existing robust protection inside every appliance. If anything needs that protection, then everything needs it. How many $100+ Surgex devices will be installed on a furance, all clocks, dishwasher, every TV, refrigerator, all LED and CFL bulbs, central air, each recharging electronics, and the most critical item if a surge exists - smoke detectors? Potentially destructive surges can be hundreds of thousands of joules. Valid recommendation also say why with numbers. How many joules does that Surgex absorb? Maybe about 600 joules. Electronics will routinely convert a 600 joules surge into rock stable, low DC voltages to safely power its semiconductors. Best protection is already inside electronics. Why did others forget to mention numbers? Most who make recommendations only recite what was heard - subjectively. Informed recommendations are based in perspective - ie spec numbers. Protection means hundreds of thousands of joules dissipate harmlessly outside. Then a surge is not inside hunting for earth destructively via appliances. Facilities that cannot have damage implemented this proven solution - even 100 years ago. It costs about $1 per protected appliance. Is provided by companies known for their integrity. And is little known to a majority only educated by hearsay, speculation, and advertising. So, do you want to protect unsaved data? Or do you want to protect hardware? Two completely different anomalies require two completely different solutions.
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Post by M57 on Aug 11, 2016 5:09:33 GMT -6
Thank you weston, and welcome to RealGear.
I realize we are talking about two different things, protection and back-up. I would say that back-up is not a high priority for me at this point - I included it in the discussion because many units include it as a feature. Regarding surge protection, I guess we haven't gotten around to specific numbers (yet) because we are still discussing whether or not, or even 'how much' of a need for external surge protection there is in the first place. As you and others have pointed out, there is already existing surge protection inside the units, and on the other side of the equation, there are situations that no surge protector can handle. I would like to hear specific numbers regarding reasonable protection, and I am doing some research on the subject. I'm not exactly sure what you mean when you say..
..but I think you are referring to protection already inside the units - so is it safe to assume that my rather expensive gear, manufactured by well-known companies in the pro-audio industry provides such protection? If so the question then becomes, will inexpensive over-the-counter residential grade units provide any additional protection, or do I need high quality commercial grade systems to increase protection? Is there value in redundancy, or is this a case where the strongest link prevails? My research seems to point to the fact that redundancy has value because the metal oxide varistors used in surge protectors degrade over time. In fact, if this is true, I may be much better off purchasing inexpensive surge protectors and occasionally replacing them rather than expensive units - or do the more expensive units use different technologies?
And finally, and with my computer and extra monitor only in mind, do you have an idea, using numbers, of how much surge protection I need and what kind of specs I should be looking for?
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Post by svart on Aug 11, 2016 6:12:05 GMT -6
it's more in-line with my budget and needs, but no battery backup. Which do you want? Hardware protection or battery backup. Those are two completely unrelated functions. Battery backup does nothing to protect hardware. Battery backup is to protect unsaved data. It does not protect saved data or hardware. Surge protection is to protect hardware from a transient that can overwhelm existing robust protection inside every appliance. If anything needs that protection, then everything needs it. How many $100+ Surgex devices will be installed on a furance, all clocks, dishwasher, every TV, refrigerator, all LED and CFL bulbs, central air, each recharging electronics, and the most critical item if a surge exists - smoke detectors? Potentially destructive surges can be hundreds of thousands of joules. Valid recommendation also say why with numbers. How many joules does that Surgex absorb? Maybe about 600 joules. Electronics will routinely convert a 600 joules surge into rock stable, low DC voltages to safely power its semiconductors. Best protection is already inside electronics. Why did others forget to mention numbers? Most who make recommendations only recite what was heard - subjectively. Informed recommendations are based in perspective - ie spec numbers. Protection means hundreds of thousands of joules dissipate harmlessly outside. Then a surge is not inside hunting for earth destructively via appliances. Facilities that cannot have damage implemented this proven solution - even 100 years ago. It costs about $1 per protected appliance. Is provided by companies known for their integrity. And is little known to a majority only educated by hearsay, speculation, and advertising. So, do you want to protect unsaved data? Or do you want to protect hardware? Two completely different anomalies require two completely different solutions. As someone who routinely does ESD/transient/power surge testing on commercial products.. Numbers might sell products, but in the wild.. Numbers don't mean a damn thing. Each strike is a completely different animal. Lightning can, and will, do ridiculous things, including either completely avoiding the protection, or fusing it, or in the rare case, the protection actually working. And, most "protection" devices are simply an array of transorbs, spark-gap-arrestors, and MOVs. Most UPS products have those built in. Hell, even most computer power supplies have these devices.
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Post by M57 on Aug 11, 2016 7:24:42 GMT -6
And, most "protection" devices are simply an array of transorbs, spark-gap-arrestors, and MOVs. Most UPS products have those built in. Hell, even most computer power supplies have these devices. Thanks svart. Can you comment on my thoughts about redundancy? What do you (or others) feel is the best paradigm for protection? ..strongest link or protection in series? ..or perhaps a combination of both? ..other considerations? Will a residential grade typical home-theatre type strip with surge protection make any difference, ..or assuming I'm unwilling to spend the big bucks should I just unplug when not using and keep my tail between my legs?
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Post by jcoutu1 on Aug 11, 2016 7:37:49 GMT -6
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Post by westom on Aug 11, 2016 9:22:11 GMT -6
Thank you weston, and welcome to RealGear. I realize we are talking about two different things, protection and back-up. I would say that back-up is not a high priority for me at this point - I included it in the discussion because many units include it as a feature. Regarding surge protection, I guess we haven't gotten around to specific numbers (yet) because we are still discussing whether or not, or even 'how much' of a need for external surge protection there is in the first place. As you and others have pointed out, there is already existing surge protection inside the units, and on the other side of the equation, there are situations that no surge protector can handle. I would like to hear specific numbers regarding reasonable protection, and I am doing some research on the subject. I'm not exactly sure what you mean when you say.. ..but I think you are referring to protection already inside the units - so is it safe to assume that my rather expensive gear, manufactured by well-known companies in the pro-audio industry provides such protection? If so the question then becomes, will inexpensive over-the-counter residential grade units provide any additional protection, or do I need high quality commercial grade systems to increase protection? Is there value in redundancy, or is this a case where the strongest link prevails? My research seems to point to the fact that redundancy has value because the metal oxide varistors used in surge protectors degrade over time. In fact, if this is true, I may be much better off purchasing inexpensive surge protectors and occasionally replacing them rather than expensive units - or do the more expensive units use different technologies? And finally, and with my computer and extra monitor only in mind, do you have an idea, using numbers, of how much surge protection I need and what kind of specs I should be looking for?
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Post by westom on Aug 11, 2016 9:40:37 GMT -6
Regarding surge protection, I guess we haven't gotten around to specific numbers (yet) because we are still discussing whether or not, or even 'how much' of a need for external surge protection there is in the first place. As you and others have pointed out, there is already existing surge protection inside the units, and on the other side of the equation, there are situations that no surge protector can handle. Your telco's $multi-million switching centers suffer about 100 surges with each storm. Which anomaly caused your town to be without power for four days while they replace that computer? None. Because effective protection is about no damage from surges - including direct lightning strikes. Same applies to cell phone towers, munitions dumps, broadcast stations, 911 response centers, etc. If a surge causes damage to any, then a major news story exists. Protection is that routine. Electronics atop the Empire State Building suffer 23 direct strikes annually - without damage. Do not be confused. Effective protection exists inside all electronics - without protectors. Concern is for something that might exist once every seven years. A number that can vary even in the same town due to factors such as geology. If that surge current enters on any utility wire, then existing protection can be compromised. That current hunts for earth destructively via appliances. Protection means that current connects harmlessly to earth by not entering any building. Best protection on TV cable is already installed for free. A hardwire must connect low impedance (ie less than 10 feet) to single point earth ground. Telephone cannot connect direct to earth. So a telco earths a 'whole house' protector for free. That protector is only doing what a hardwire does better. Appreciate the significance. Protect ors do not do protect ion. Protectors connect to what does protection. A protector is only as effective as its earth ground. That says what must have most of your attention - single point earth ground. Unfortunately many are enthralled by protectors; never learn about the only item that makes protectors effective - single point earth ground. Protectors are simple science. Lightning is typically 20,000 amps. So a minimal 'whole house' protector is 50,000 amps. That defines protector life expectancy over many surges and many decades. Effective protector costs about $1 per protected appliance. Companies known for their integrity provide this well understood commodity including Intermatic, Square D, Ditek, Siemens, Polyphaser (an industry benchmark), Syscom, Leviton, ABB, Delta, Keison, Erico, and General Electric. A Cutler-Hammer sells in Lowes and Home Depot. That is a protector. Simple science. Neither found nor discussed by any magic plug-in solution. Routinely found in facilities that cannot have damage. Any wire that enters must connect low impedance (ie no sharp wire bends) to single point earth ground before entering. As well understood over 100 years ago. Since a protector is only as effective as its earth ground (which is another discussion). Above is only a 'secondary' protection layer. Also inspect your 'primary' protection layer. Pictures (not text) in www.fpl-fraud.com/ after the expression "open vertical grounds" demonstrate what must be inspected in your 'primary' protection layer. What do ineffective and obscenely profitable 'magic boxes' not discuss? Earth ground. BTW, view protection numbers for a UPS. Often, its joules cannot be any smaller. That number is one step above zero so subjective reasoning, hearsay, and advertising can call it 100% protection. Even that UPS must be protected by a 'whole house' solution. What does the UPS not have? Earth ground. It does not claim and cannot protect from typically destructive surges. It is clearly not a protection layer. We designed surge protection that works in the real world. We traced surges to locate a human mistake that created damage. In one case, a network of powered off computers were connected to power strip protectors. Those protectors earthed a direct lightning strike destructively through that network. We literally replaced each surge damaged semiconductor to restore the entire system. And to trace the surge paths. Some consumer type knew it must be protect ion because it is called a surge protect or. No damage once we removed those protectors (that did what the manufacturer said it would do), upgraded earthing, and installed a 'whole house' protector. I have done this for quite some time. Direct strikes exist without damage. What I know will contradict what a majority were told by advertising and wild speculation. Even a protector does not do protection. Protect or and protect ion are two completely different items in protection system. A protector is only as effective as its earth ground.
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Post by M57 on Aug 11, 2016 11:17:09 GMT -6
Regarding surge protection, I guess we haven't gotten around to specific numbers (yet) because we are still discussing whether or not, or even 'how much' of a need for external surge protection there is in the first place. As you and others have pointed out, there is already existing surge protection inside the units, and on the other side of the equation, there are situations that no surge protector can handle. Your telco's $multi-million switching centers suffer about 100 surges with each storm. Which anomaly caused your town to be without power for four days while they replace that computer? None. Because effective protection is about no damage from surges - including direct lightning strikes. Same applies to cell phone towers, munitions dumps, broadcast stations, 911 response centers, etc. If a surge causes damage to any, then a major news story exists. Protection is that routine. Electronics atop the Empire State Building suffer 23 direct strikes annually - without damage. Do not be confused. Effective protection exists inside all electronics - without protectors. Concern is for something that might exist once every seven years. A number that can vary even in the same town due to factors such as geology. If that surge current enters on any utility wire, then existing protection can be compromised. That current hunts for earth destructively via appliances. Protection means that current connects harmlessly to earth by not entering any building. Best protection on TV cable is already installed for free. A hardwire must connect low impedance (ie less than 10 feet) to single point earth ground. Telephone cannot connect direct to earth. So a telco earths a 'whole house' protector for free. That protector is only doing what a hardwire does better. Appreciate the significance. Protect ors do not do protect ion. Protectors connect to what does protection. A protector is only as effective as its earth ground. That says what must have most of your attention - single point earth ground. Unfortunately many are enthralled by protectors; never learn about the only item that makes protectors effective - single point earth ground. Protectors are simple science. Lightning is typically 20,000 amps. So a minimal 'whole house' protector is 50,000 amps. That defines protector life expectancy over many surges and many decades. Effective protector costs about $1 per protected appliance. Companies known for their integrity provide this well understood commodity including Intermatic, Square D, Ditek, Siemens, Polyphaser (an industry benchmark), Syscom, Leviton, ABB, Delta, Keison, Erico, and General Electric. A Cutler-Hammer sells in Lowes and Home Depot. That is a protector. Simple science. Neither found nor discussed by any magic plug-in solution. Routinely found in facilities that cannot have damage. Any wire that enters must connect low impedance (ie no sharp wire bends) to single point earth ground before entering. As well understood over 100 years ago. Since a protector is only as effective as its earth ground (which is another discussion). Above is only a 'secondary' protection layer. Also inspect your 'primary' protection layer. Pictures (not text) in www.fpl-fraud.com/ after the expression "open vertical grounds" demonstrate what must be inspected in your 'primary' protection layer. What do ineffective and obscenely profitable 'magic boxes' not discuss? Earth ground. BTW, view protection numbers for a UPS. Often, its joules cannot be any smaller. That number is one step above zero so subjective reasoning, hearsay, and advertising can call it 100% protection. Even that UPS must be protected by a 'whole house' solution. What does the UPS not have? Earth ground. It does not claim and cannot protect from typically destructive surges. It is clearly not a protection layer. We designed surge protection that works in the real world. We traced surges to locate a human mistake that created damage. In one case, a network of powered off computers were connected to power strip protectors. Those protectors earthed a direct lightning strike destructively through that network. We literally replaced each surge damaged semiconductor to restore the entire system. And to trace the surge paths. Some consumer type knew it must be protect ion because it is called a surge protect or. No damage once we removed those protectors (that did what the manufacturer said it would do), upgraded earthing, and installed a 'whole house' protector. I have done this for quite some time. Direct strikes exist without damage. What I know will contradict what a majority were told by advertising and wild speculation. Even a protector does not do protection. Protect or and protect ion are two completely different items in protection system. A protector is only as effective as its earth ground. This is fascinating, really! It is a lot of information but I'm at the point now where I need solutions, not information. You have said a number of times $1 per appliance. But I don't know what that means.. Does that mean if I want to protect a computer and a monitor, I should spend $2? I should think not. and WHAT should I spend it on? OK, I need a protector - not protection, right? So what do that mean in terms of product and installation.
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Post by Martin John Butler on Aug 11, 2016 12:28:18 GMT -6
westom, can yoo recommend a particular product/system that will do what M57 is asking, keep his gear safe?
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Post by Martin John Butler on Aug 11, 2016 12:35:30 GMT -6
jcoutou, I once had surge protectors similar to yours in an apartment. Lightening from the roof above came right through, sparks and smoke came out of my TV speakers, (which was off at the time). Almost all my electronics were damaged, VCR, store system, speakers, TV, you name it. Oh boy, did that suck.
Whatever they said in the ad you posted a link to, probably won't work. I don't quite follow all that westom says, but he's on to something.
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Post by jcoutu1 on Aug 11, 2016 12:38:33 GMT -6
jcoutou, I once had surge protectors similar to yours in an apartment. Lightening from the roof above came right through, sparks and smoke came out of my TV speakers, (which was off at the time). Almost all my electronics were damaged, VCR, store system, speakers, TV, you name it. Oh boy, did that suck. Whatever they said in the ad you posted a link to, probably won't work. I don't quite follow all that westom says, but he's on to something. See my post higher up in the thread. I mainly use these units to get the outlet count that I need for all my devices and having a single power switch to fire up the system.
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Post by drbill on Aug 11, 2016 12:58:29 GMT -6
I don't really care if "science" and "common sense" says it's not necessary. Everyone has an agenda and a bias. I am aware of many people (martin now included) that have suffered catastrophic electrical failures from the elements and/or power grid. Lightning and power company generated failures are all too common in our industry - no matter if our gear has the $1 capable circuit installed or not. Are we going to roll the dice or not??? I've rolled before and come up on the loosing end....
If I live in a lightning strike prone area and I've got countless dollars worth of vintage gear, outboard, computers, VALUABLE hard drives with irreplaceable music, mics, etc. plugged into the AC outlets, I'm damn sure going to put anything I can on to protect them - even if it costs a bundle and is poo-poo'd by those in the know. I need to be working tomorrow, not figuring out why stuff got toasted and if I had enough protection and why things don't work. Being able to work, leave stuff plugged in and on, getting my jobs finished and having PEACE OF MIND are my highest priority. Every LITTLE bit counts, and if the SurgeX stuff cleans up the audio and provides a bit more protection, then IMO it's well worth the effort. Not having to Star Ground my current system and being able to leave 3rd pins connected was worth 10X's what the units cost. Clean, protected power = happy producer....
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Post by schmalzy on Aug 11, 2016 13:29:51 GMT -6
This is fascinating, really! It is a lot of information but I'm at the point now where I need solutions, not information. You have said a number of times $1 per appliance. But I don't know what that means.. Does that mean if I want to protect a computer and a monitor, I should spend $2? I should think not. and WHAT should I spend it on? OK, I need a protector - not protection, right? So what do that mean in terms of product and installation. I think a large part of what he's saying is this: without a single-point earth ground, protectors aren't doing a lot of protecting. Perhaps the first concern should be "does my studio/home/location have adequate earth grounding?" If yes, great. If not, solve that problem first. After that spend the money on commercial products equalling about $1 per appliance. Like, I'd get a $30 surge protector in my studio. That's how I'm interpreting what he's saying. I welcome the possibility (probability, even!) that I'm wrong.
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Post by westom on Aug 11, 2016 19:53:43 GMT -6
See my post higher up in the thread. I mainly use these units to get the outlet count that I need for all my devices and having a single power switch to fire up the system. Then why spend tens of dollars more for something that can even make fire more likely? Your best solution is something that is much safer such as $5 power strip from Walmart. That safer strip has many plug connections, a power switch, a 15 amp circuit breaker (that feature ios critical), has a UL approval label (also critical), and has no protector parts. It says nothing about UL1449 and says nothing about joules - to increase your life expectancy.
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Post by westom on Aug 11, 2016 20:43:00 GMT -6
schmalzy wrote: "I think a large part of what he's saying is this: without a single-point earth ground, protectors aren't doing a lot of protecting. Perhaps the first concern should be "does my studio/home/location have adequate earth grounding?" First sentence is correct. Protector without a dedicated wire to earth defines expensive, obscenely profitable, and ineffective protectors. That sentence does not yet define protection. One poster says why vintage gear, outboard, computers, VALUABLE hard drives with irreplaceable music, mics, etc. plugged into the AC outlets are more easily damaged. Denial based only emotion or speculation is a usual reason why damage happens. Second, any recommendation not tempered by spec numbers must be ignored - so as to avert confusion. Third, where is a number that defines "adequate earth grounding"? Since facts and numbers were not provided, then nobody yet knows what is subjectively described as "adequate earth grounding". For example a cold water pipe often and no longer provides it. Question is accurate. "Does my studio/home/location have adequate earth grounding?" An answer means facts with numbers. Including this - a low impedance (ie less than 10 foot) connection to earth ground. That low impedance connection makes obvious which protectors might do effective protection. And which (ie plug-in) protectors (with massive profit margins) do not even claim such protection. Plug-in protectors have no earth ground. Four, listed were manufacturers of integrity that provide an effective protector ... with that dedicated wire to connect to earth. Listed was a spec number that must exist. Sufficient information to select a best protector. Nobody needs their hand held in Lowes or an electrical supply house. Everybody can ask, "Show me your 'whole house' protector." It is that hard. Nobody needs a parent to read a critical spec number - 50,000 amps. Any child can select a best 'whole house' protector using those facts and numbers. Effective protector is that easily selected. Ask for facts and numbers that define "adequate earth ground". Questions best begin by describing what already exists. Since a homeowner is responsible for installing and maintaining that ground, then a homeowner should already know what exists.
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Post by drbill on Aug 11, 2016 21:32:25 GMT -6
I see a lot of words, partial quotes, partial explanation seemingly designed for evasion and/or confusion (like a homeowner is responsible for installing and maintaining a ground....really? LOL I'll guarantee that 98 out of 100 homeowners wouldn't even know what I was talking about, much less install and maintain it....), and so......I end up with no real understanding. Am I ignorant or stupid? Or both? Perhaps..... I think I'll trust the electricians and studio design consultants that do this kind of thing every day over a minimum wage retired guy at home depot. Because work it does. Voodoo, overkill, snake oil? I'm sure I'll find out. Eventually. So far so good.
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