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Post by scumbum on Mar 16, 2016 13:15:17 GMT -6
Got a room thats just sheetrock and concrete floor . I want to eliminate reverb , echo.......bring it into the dryness of the 70's . But I'm broke .
Got some good suggestions to do this without spending a lot ?
I've read somewhere that getting rolls of that pink insulation and stacking them in the corners can work .
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Post by tasteliketape on Mar 16, 2016 13:29:37 GMT -6
Jmo but if you don't cover the pink stuff it's itchy if you you rub against it and a little dusty Owens 703 2x4 sheets with cheep fabric cover or rock wool would be easy to make panels but they need covered also I think I have less than 20 dollars a panel in the one I made wood frame and all and could have been cheaper but I bought some better fabric I made 75 panels in six hours for myself and a friend studio so it's easy once you have the set up planned out again jmo
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Post by Pueblo Audio on Mar 16, 2016 13:40:38 GMT -6
I often observe inexpensive and uninformed room treatments result in way to much high end absorption while leaving bass uncontrolled. Here are some tips.
Avoid raw insulation, egg-crate and other foam treatments. They tend to be expensive and ineffective.
Use a material that has both absorption and diffusion properties. I like poly-fill quilts that are super cheap at economy stores like tj max or big lots. They absorb a little and bounce back a little. Try yelling into it and you will get the idea. Finding a pattern you can stomach is another matter :-).
Controlling the bass is more difficult most folks are unable to design or build an effective trap for there particular space... Dang it! I have to go but will return with more suggestions.
Cheers
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Post by ragan on Mar 16, 2016 14:11:04 GMT -6
Get some rockwool at Home Depot and some old sheets at Goodwill/Value Village/Salvation Army etc.
If you can't do that, get some moving/packing blankets from Harbor Freight. If you get their coupons, those blankets can be dirt cheap (they're cheap without coupons too). It won't do anywhere near as good a job as rockwool but it will help some of the flutter/slapback.
Really though, making your own panels out of rockwool is the best way to go. You can make triangular super chunk traps for the corners and then just take the 2' X 4' panels that it comes in (get at least 2" or 3" thickness), cover them, preferably frame them in some cheap wood but you don't have to, and put them on your walls. Use a mirror to find the first reflection points (from mix position) on the walls and above you.
None of it is hard to build and it's the best money you can put into your studio in my opinion. Especially in a small square-ish room.
Every sound your mics hear/record in there will sound better and you'll make better choices along the whole process from tracking to mixing because you'll be able to hear better what's going on.
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Post by svart on Mar 16, 2016 14:53:49 GMT -6
be careful getting blankets from goodwill and other thrift stores..
Bedbugs.. Seriously.. Those things are awful and hard to get rid of, and lots of people get them from donated clothing and bedding..
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Post by ragan on Mar 16, 2016 14:55:42 GMT -6
be careful getting blankets from goodwill and other thrift stores.. Bedbugs.. Seriously.. Those things are awful and hard to get rid of, and lots of people get them from donated clothing and bedding.. That's a good call. Hadn't thought of that. I've always just bought fabric from a fabric store for my panels but I've had friends that got old sheets and used them.
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Post by mrholmes on Mar 16, 2016 14:57:25 GMT -6
Got a room thats just sheetrock and concrete floor . I want to eliminate reverb , echo.......bring it into the dryness of the 70's . But I'm broke . Got some good suggestions to do this without spending a lot ? I've read somewhere that getting rolls of that pink insulation and stacking them in the corners can work . Do you plan near mid or far field monitoring?
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Post by scumbum on Mar 16, 2016 14:58:17 GMT -6
The room is 14x20 with 8.5 ceiling . Not small but not big .
The reverb is like an echo chamber in there .
Moving blankets were mentioned , never tried them but putting those up looks very cheap .
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Post by scumbum on Mar 16, 2016 15:00:38 GMT -6
Got a room thats just sheetrock and concrete floor . I want to eliminate reverb , echo.......bring it into the dryness of the 70's . But I'm broke . Got some good suggestions to do this without spending a lot ? I've read somewhere that getting rolls of that pink insulation and stacking them in the corners can work . Do you plan near mid or far field monitoring? I'd like to do as much as I can in there , track drums , vocals and mix . But tracking dry vocals is the main concern . Drums I think might be ok with all the liveness and reverb . Mixing I could always do somewhere else if I had to .
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Post by scumbum on Mar 16, 2016 15:32:07 GMT -6
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Post by mrholmes on Mar 16, 2016 16:00:37 GMT -6
Do you plan near mid or far field monitoring? I'd like to do as much as I can in there , track drums , vocals and mix . But tracking dry vocals is the main concern . Drums I think might be ok with all the liveness and reverb . Mixing I could always do somewhere else if I had to . Doing a good sounding tracking room is something different. If the room is very small you cant go wrong with massive amounts of Rockwool in all corners for base trapping. You should post the dimensions? For the range above 300 to 400 Hz there are a lot of nice DIY Difusor plans online. We did build two QRDs for my small room and it it makes the impression the room is larger. On the ceiling we did use absorption because it was not stable enough to hold diffusion. www.mh-audio.nl/diffusor2.asp#calculFor a small hobby studio with all DIY work it sounds very good...
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Post by scumbum on Mar 16, 2016 16:23:41 GMT -6
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
Posts: 15,013
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Post by ericn on Mar 16, 2016 17:11:32 GMT -6
The cheapest way to treat any room is to get it right the first time. The easiest way to do that is hire some body who knows what they are doing!
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Post by mrholmes on Mar 16, 2016 18:23:35 GMT -6
The room is 14x20 with 8.5 ceiling . Not small but not big . The reverb is like an echo chamber in there . Moving blankets were mentioned , never tried them but putting those up looks very cheap . From my expereince go with broadband rockwool absorption. Its the most easy way if you never did it before. If you dont want to dampen the HF range build cases with 1 cm slots the base goes in there. Here you have a good room mode calcualtor. It looks good for your romm. In theroy you just have few resonances in the low end. They are not tight toghter that will make it easier.... amroc.andymel.eu/?l=14&w=20&h=8.5&ft=true&r60=0.6And you need this one. www.whealy.com/acoustics/Porous.htmlAs well this one: www.roomeqwizard.comAnd this, one of the better B tools.., www.music-group.com/Categories/Behringer/Microphones/Condenser-Microphones/ECM8000/p/P0118Place the mic in diffrent spots and post the measurements. With those tools and a lot of rockwool I did my first room and it did not sound bad. It was BB base absorption in all corners and movabele HMF to HF absorption under the ceilig. I did use 10 cm thick bastoect for the ceiling with space between them. It was a cool balance between dry and nice reflextions. I think you can build a good room with try and error. Measuering before and after each building state is essential to get a feel for the treatment. The basic theroy behind it is not rocket science... To bad that English ist not my first language. Otherwise I would try to expalin more details...
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Post by jcoutu1 on Mar 16, 2016 19:08:14 GMT -6
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Post by tonycamphd on Mar 16, 2016 19:27:06 GMT -6
if you can afford it, step up to Ultratouch cotton insulation, it's super easy to work with, and you can sleep on it, it's specs exceed fiberglass and rockwool, i do like the sound of rockwool over fiberglass and cotton, it tends to send a bit of high freq's back into the room(the air stuff), fiberglass gives a room a sucked out feeling if you use it everywhere, cotton falls somewhere in between.
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Post by NoFilterChuck on Mar 16, 2016 19:35:10 GMT -6
The room is 14x20 with 8.5 ceiling . Not small but not big . The reverb is like an echo chamber in there . Moving blankets were mentioned , never tried them but putting those up looks very cheap . these specs are almost identical to my room, which is 12.5 X 20 X 8.5'. The floors are wooden tho. I did this with panels and stuff on the front 2/3rds of the room. the rear 1/3 is live with no treatment. I have 3 rows of those panels on the ceiling. those are 2'x4' Owens 703 2" panels mounted 5" off the ceiling. it's GREAT for tracking because the room has a nice ambience to it now that's dead enough for mixing in, but not dead enough to making playing in it terrible. No need for a vocal booth either, because the room is dead enough on the side with panels!! http://instagram.com/p/sN-VSiQUTS
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Post by donr on Mar 16, 2016 20:02:08 GMT -6
I like those large egg cartons. (is it April 1 yet?)
We had a Kaotica thread last year or longer ago. John, do you still have yours? I have one, haven't used it. Gotta try it.
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Post by donr on Mar 16, 2016 20:13:36 GMT -6
be careful getting blankets from goodwill and other thrift stores.. Bedbugs.. Seriously.. Those things are awful and hard to get rid of, and lots of people get them from donated clothing and bedding.. That's a good call. Hadn't thought of that. I've always just bought fabric from a fabric store for my panels but I've had friends that got old sheets and used them. I wonder if you could put quilts in a microwave to eradicate living things.
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
Posts: 15,013
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Post by ericn on Mar 16, 2016 20:32:36 GMT -6
That's a good call. Hadn't thought of that. I've always just bought fabric from a fabric store for my panels but I've had friends that got old sheets and used them. I wonder if you could put quilts in a microwave to eradicate living things. You could boil them ! My washing machine has a sanitize setting!
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Post by scumbum on Mar 16, 2016 20:56:45 GMT -6
The room is 14x20 with 8.5 ceiling . Not small but not big . The reverb is like an echo chamber in there . Moving blankets were mentioned , never tried them but putting those up looks very cheap . From my expereince go with broadband rockwool absorption. Its the most easy way if you never did it before. If you dont want to dampen the HF range build cases with 1 cm slots the base goes in there. Here you have a good room mode calcualtor. It looks good for your romm. In theroy you just have few resonances in the low end. They are not tight toghter that will make it easier.... amroc.andymel.eu/?l=14&w=20&h=8.5&ft=true&r60=0.6And you need this one. www.whealy.com/acoustics/Porous.htmlAs well this one: www.roomeqwizard.comAnd this, one of the better B tools.., www.music-group.com/Categories/Behringer/Microphones/Condenser-Microphones/ECM8000/p/P0118Place the mic in diffrent spots and post the measurements. With those tools and a lot of rockwool I did my first room and it did not sound bad. It was BB base absorption in all corners and movabele HMF to HF absorption under the ceilig. I did use 10 cm thick bastoect for the ceiling with space between them. It was a cool balance between dry and nice reflextions. I think you can build a good room with try and error. Measuering before and after each building state is essential to get a feel for the treatment. The basic theroy behind it is not rocket science... To bad that English ist not my first language. Otherwise I would try to expalin more details... Wow , cool info thanks !!
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Post by scumbum on Mar 16, 2016 20:59:50 GMT -6
Never seen this before and was like Whoa !!! Thats Cool !! But after listening to this video and reading that the recording level is boosted because the sound is trapped in the ball , it sounds like your singing in a dead small closet . Not that great of a sound ,
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Post by scumbum on Mar 16, 2016 21:03:47 GMT -6
if you can afford it, step up to Ultratouch cotton insulation, it's super easy to work with, and you can sleep on it, it's specs exceed fiberglass and rockwool, i do like the sound of rockwool over fiberglass and cotton, it tends to send a bit of high freq's back into the room(the air stuff), fiberglass gives a room a sucked out feeling if you use it everywhere, cotton falls somewhere in between. Is this the stuff ?? www.homedepot.com/p/UltraTouch-16-in-x-48-in-Denim-Insulation-Multi-Purpose-Roll-60301-16482/202709974If it is , it looks like you could just take two of those rolls and put them in a corner for a bass trap . Thanks for all the help and info guys ! Looks like a lot of cheap solutions ,
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Post by mrholmes on Mar 16, 2016 21:29:54 GMT -6
Another cool trick is to use a dynamic mic for the singer - dead as hell. With a few wooden frames some rolers and rockwool and stage fabric you can build two big mobile absorbers. I did use 20 cm rockwool... at 6000 rayls I have two of them.... if it needs to be dry with UMT 70... Some basotect can be cool to kill tangential room modes. I have one of these over my head and it does kills base too if the sonic angle is greater than 30 degres... Ot solved two probs at the same time a 500 Hz null and a lot off comp filtering in HF range caused by the production table.... My advise is to read some basic theory and try to write a concept based on your empty room measurements. Good is if you have an active PA speaker to take some high spl level sweeps. I takes time before you start to build. A lot of inspiration comes from watching pictures of diffrent stidios....
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Post by yotonic on Mar 16, 2016 21:35:31 GMT -6
I wonder if you could put quilts in a microwave to eradicate living things. You could boil them ! My washing machine has a sanitize setting! You can leave Kanye West's newest record on overnight and every living thing will have left by morning.
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