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Post by jcoutu1 on Mar 10, 2016 12:19:23 GMT -6
Everyone seems to swear by the CAPI VP28 preamps. Can anyone make a case for purchasing the VP312, VP25, or VP26? Why would someone pick these over the VP28? I assume the only advantage is price and ease of build? What are the differences between the models?
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Post by deehope on Mar 10, 2016 14:23:01 GMT -6
Everyone seems to swear by the CAPI VP28 preamps. Can anyone make a case for purchasing the VP312, VP25, or VP26? Why would someone pick these over the VP28? I assume the only advantage is price and ease of build? What are the differences between the models? The vp28 is two stages those other 3 aren't. If I remember correctly a vp28 is the same as a vp26 combined with a vc528.
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Post by jcoutu1 on Mar 10, 2016 14:28:25 GMT -6
Everyone seems to swear by the CAPI VP28 preamps. Can anyone make a case for purchasing the VP312, VP25, or VP26? Why would someone pick these over the VP28? I assume the only advantage is price and ease of build? What are the differences between the models? The vp28 is two stages those other 3 aren't. If I remember correctly a vp28 is the same as a vp26 combined with a vc528. The question is more about why I would pick a 2 stage instead of the VP28 and what the differences between the others are.
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Post by Johnkenn on Mar 10, 2016 15:23:55 GMT -6
It's going through a second output transformer...more color...but some others here can get into more details. I know that I preferred the Litz Wire transformers...smoother in the mids and punchier on bottom to me. I haven't heard the VP312, but I remember thinking it was really, really good!
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Post by mdmitch2 on Mar 10, 2016 16:03:23 GMT -6
VP28 also has more available gain (72 db I think), and has a line level switch as well as a 'signal present' led indicator. It takes probably 2-3 times as long to build vs the VP26, but worth it for me... tonally I seem to remember that the 312 is a little more modern/hifi, and the vp25 maybe has a little more low end extension? Someone else will have to verify since I'm going off poor memory there....
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Post by mulmany on Mar 10, 2016 16:25:32 GMT -6
I have all 4. Vp25 gets used for drums, vp312 on OH, vp26 on elec gtr, VP28 on vox and rythem gtr.
Vp25 provides a little more bass with a nice aggressive kick.
vp26 good all rounder just not giving as big a bottom.
VP312 really fast and detailed, no caps in the signal path. Great for bass and transient detail.
VP28 just really good. Provides good thickness without sounding wooly. The line mode is great for the 2buss.
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Post by NoFilterChuck on Mar 10, 2016 16:27:54 GMT -6
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Post by jcoutu1 on Mar 10, 2016 16:51:38 GMT -6
I have all 4. Vp25 gets used for drums, vp312 on OH, vp26 on elec gtr, VP28 on vox and rythem gtr. Vp25 provides a little more bass with a nice aggressive kick. vp26 good all rounder just not giving as big a bottom. VP312 really fast and detailed, no caps in the signal path. Great for bass and transient detail. VP28 just really good. Provides good thickness without sounding wooly. The line mode is great for the 2buss. If you were starting over, would you still have the variety or just go will all 28's?
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Post by mulmany on Mar 10, 2016 17:07:27 GMT -6
I have all 4. Vp25 gets used for drums, vp312 on OH, vp26 on elec gtr, VP28 on vox and rythem gtr. Vp25 provides a little more bass with a nice aggressive kick. vp26 good all rounder just not giving as big a bottom. VP312 really fast and detailed, no caps in the signal path. Great for bass and transient detail. VP28 just really good. Provides good thickness without sounding wooly. The line mode is great for the 2buss. If you were starting over, would you still have the variety or just go will all 28's? Hmmm... interesting question. I think I would still have the 25, 312, and 28. The difference between the 25 and 26 is close so I would do the 25 and just hi pass what I don't want. Having said that I only have pairs of the 312, 28, and 26 so I have not run a full kit through just them.
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Post by tonycamphd on Mar 10, 2016 18:25:36 GMT -6
I need to get the vp25's for kick mics, they reach lower due to the larger output tranny, the Vp28 sure reaches low though, and the versatility is insane, other than getting a bit more low end extension from the kick with the 25, vp28's all the way for me, i have no desire to use another API style pre
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Post by EmRR on Mar 10, 2016 20:17:58 GMT -6
I could see the 25 sounding smaller due to the lower harmonics level as compared to the smaller transformers with higher harmonics level. Certainly the response is pretty much the same with any of them, and any apparent difference is harmonics/phase/etc.
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Post by NoFilterChuck on Mar 10, 2016 22:33:20 GMT -6
the 312DI is pretty dope. I wish the VP28 had a DI on it. then it would be perfect!
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Post by junior on Mar 11, 2016 0:39:24 GMT -6
312's and 26's here. 26's for snares, guitars or older-school vibe... 312's for pretty much anything else. All great stuff!
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Post by odyssey76 on Mar 11, 2016 4:06:04 GMT -6
Jesse - for me it has to do with being able to use the VP28's on the 2 bus or any other bus for that matter. Tony got me started on this when he described the VP28's as the "best soft kiss compressor" he'd heard (something like that). I find this is true as well. I just love what these do to slightly take the sharp edges off transients and thicken up the mids. My absolute favorite acoustic guitar preamp although they can be great on anything. They are really versatile and the filters are a blessing during tracking. Just all around goodness as preamps or line drivers.
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Post by jcoutu1 on Mar 11, 2016 5:34:28 GMT -6
Jesse - for me it has to do with being able to use the VP28's on the 2 bus or any other bus for that matter. Tony got me started on this when he described the VP28's as the "best soft kiss compressor" he'd heard (something like that). I find this is true as well. I just love what these do to slightly take the sharp edges off transients and thicken up the mids. My absolute favorite acoustic guitar preamp although they can be great on anything. They are really versatile and the filters are a blessing during tracking. Just all around goodness as preamps or linedrivers. It seems like the 28's really are the best bet, they just seem like a bear of a build. I'm confident that I could build a 26, but the 28 is another level.
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Post by odyssey76 on Mar 11, 2016 6:15:06 GMT -6
I had mine built by Joel Phillips. Ended up costing me $480 per VP28 which included building all the op amps. Last I checked he was real busy but let me know if want his info. Really cool guy and builds some of the best guitar amps on the planet (3rd Power - Nashville).
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Post by jfoc on Mar 11, 2016 7:19:27 GMT -6
VP28 isnt so bad, I would say op amps are trickier. Lots of space on the PCB & thick traces that take heat well.
CAPI were my first electronics project. Ive got 2 VP312 & 6 VP28.
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Post by tonycamphd on Mar 11, 2016 7:21:45 GMT -6
Jesse - for me it has to do with being able to use the VP28's on the 2 bus or any other bus for that matter. Tony got me started on this when he described the VP28's as the "best soft kiss compressor" he'd heard (something like that). I find this is true as well. I just love what these do to slightly take the sharp edges off transients and thicken up the mids. My absolute favorite acoustic guitar preamp although they can be great on anything. They are really versatile and the filters are a blessing during tracking. Just all around goodness as preamps or linedrivers. It seems like the 28's really are the best bet, they just seem like a bear of a build. I'm confident that I could build a 26, but the 28 is another level. CAPI stuff is so well documented and supported, Id say fear not, uve already built colour stuff, u got this, there are just more parts than the others, no biggie bud.
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Post by svart on Mar 11, 2016 8:32:42 GMT -6
I have VP25s and VP26s all built as 312's. I can't really hear too much difference in the output tranformers. I can hear more difference between the different opamps (2520 vs 1731, etc) than the different circuit topologies.
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Post by tonycamphd on Mar 11, 2016 8:55:00 GMT -6
I could see the 25 sounding smaller due to the lower harmonics level as compared to the smaller transformers with higher harmonics level. Certainly the response is pretty much the same with any of them, and any apparent difference is harmonics/phase/etc. I believe I was told by Jeff Steiger that the VP25 will extend down lower than a VP28, primarily due to the larger output tranny jsteiger ?
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Post by EmRR on Mar 11, 2016 9:11:39 GMT -6
Yeah, but appreciably lower in these cases is lower than any frequency made by an instrument; under 20Hz. The differences are primarily phase and distortion for comparable output levels. Jeff may of course correct me....
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Post by Johnkenn on Mar 11, 2016 9:49:09 GMT -6
I should buy a 312 and put it together...think even I could handle that tonycamphd
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Post by tonycamphd on Mar 11, 2016 10:25:46 GMT -6
I should buy a 312 and put it together...think even I could handle that tonycamphd i think adding a good iron, a flux pen, and a toothpaste free toothbrush 8) and you could build what ever you want. I have 2 tasks this weekend, fix an MK47 PSU issue, and fix your Vp28(I think i know exactly what's wrong with it?.?.?), i'll keep ya posted...
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Post by jfoc on Mar 11, 2016 10:27:33 GMT -6
minor confession time: On the first VP312 I built I put one of the electrolytic caps in backwards. I noticed it, but forgot to fix it before powering up. I was working with the tech who had showed me how to solder, and he had enough time to say "Well it seems like it's working-" before the cap exploded & the electrolytics became confetti. I powered off, cursed myself, cleaned it off & replaced it with a similar value cap. Powered up & its worked fine ever since.
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Post by junior on Mar 11, 2016 11:28:45 GMT -6
I should buy a 312 and put it together...think even I could handle that tonycamphd The 312 is actually a pretty easy build. Have fun!
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