|
|
Post by keymod on May 24, 2015 14:37:35 GMT -6
Any difference in performance? Any concerns about headroom or signal strength?
IOW, a preamp output to input of a compressor. Compressor output to line in/tape/whatever.... vs a preamp with an insert on it. Send to compressor, return from compressor. Output of preamp to line in/tape/whatever.... |
|
|
|
Post by tonycamphd on May 24, 2015 15:14:59 GMT -6
Not sure i see the usefulness of an insert on a stand alone preamp?(doesn't mean it's not, i'm just not picturing it). I see your question relating more toward a console setting..right? Inserts are generally correlated to SINGLE source channel strips, they usually give options to send pre/post eq, fader etc, and then return processed to the channel strips for further routing(sub mixes and such). Send/returns are generally used on a master section to send MULTIPLE sources to verbs, delays etc, but then usually don't have much in the way of further routing options.
does that help? or am i misinterpreting the Q?
|
|
|
|
Post by keymod on May 24, 2015 16:13:29 GMT -6
Maybe I should have said Channel strip, instead of preamp. Thinking along the lines of using 500series outboard with a console.
|
|
|
|
Post by jcoutu1 on May 24, 2015 17:25:46 GMT -6
Insert on a preamp will probably be between an input and output transformer right?
|
|
|
|
Post by gouge on May 24, 2015 17:28:24 GMT -6
only issue can be that some consoles use unbalanced insert sends. so you can have a possible noise issue.
the other thing is that interfacing unbalanced and balanced gear needs to be thought through.
in general terms the shortest path is the best path.
|
|
|
|
Post by mrholmes on May 24, 2015 18:14:09 GMT -6
the other thing is that interfacing unbalanced and balanced gear needs to be thought through. in general terms the shortest path is the best path. not to forget that a few dbs go away..... was it 6 db ....cant remember. |
|
|
|
Post by jazznoise on May 24, 2015 18:20:42 GMT -6
the other thing is that interfacing unbalanced and balanced gear needs to be thought through. in general terms the shortest path is the best path. not to forget that a few dbs go away..... was it 6 db ....cant remember. You do lose power, but interestingly enough when I was reading the Douglas Self book on Small Signal Audio Design he said that the SNR benefit of Balanced Signals was a myth (i.e implementing the summing for the balanced signals almost always negated the noise benefits). Where it did improve things was RFI, EMI . Because in general the fancypants reverb or comp will be balanced and the desk wont, you'll probably have little chance of overdriving the unit itself because of the level loss. If you have a desk I'd personally use inserts and sends because it involves less plugging and unplugging than mic pre or desk outputs. Also allows you to change the signal chain faster, just swap insert cables or desk sends! |
|
|
|
Post by tonycamphd on May 24, 2015 19:52:04 GMT -6
only issue can be that some consoles use unbalanced insert sends. so you can have a possible noise issue. the other thing is that interfacing unbalanced and balanced gear needs to be thought through. in general terms the shortest path is the best path. i believe most of the legendary consoles are unbalanced internally, noise is not an issue unless there is something seriously awry. |
|
|
|
Post by tonycamphd on May 24, 2015 19:57:59 GMT -6
Insert on a preamp will probably be between an input and output transformer right? I guess if you were going to do it that would make the most sense? I can't think of any, are there any stand alone pre's out there that have inserts on them? |
|
|
|
Post by gouge on May 24, 2015 20:18:43 GMT -6
only issue can be that some consoles use unbalanced insert sends. so you can have a possible noise issue. the other thing is that interfacing unbalanced and balanced gear needs to be thought through. in general terms the shortest path is the best path. i believe most of the legendary consoles are unbalanced internally, noise is not an issue unless there is something seriously awry. agreed,
but i was referring to noise from external tie lines and gear attached to the inserts not internal desk circuits.
|
|
|
|
Post by LesC on May 24, 2015 20:39:32 GMT -6
Insert on a preamp will probably be between an input and output transformer right? I guess if you were going to do it that would make the most sense? I can't think of any, are there any stand alone pre's out there that have inserts on them? I think the Great River MP-2NV has inserts, as do some others I've seen. |
|
|
|
Post by LesC on May 24, 2015 20:53:36 GMT -6
I forgot about one I own a pair of, the Warm TB12's have inserts.
|
|
|
|
Post by jcoutu1 on May 24, 2015 22:58:57 GMT -6
Insert on a preamp will probably be between an input and output transformer right? I guess if you were going to do it that would make the most sense? I can't think of any, are there any stand alone pre's out there that have inserts on them? My Trident pres had inserts, but also eq, so it makes a little more sense. |
|
|
|
Post by Ward on May 25, 2015 6:03:05 GMT -6
Balanced versus unbalanced is the main source of issues.
Many channel strips, even some preamps, and many consoles have unbalanced insert points. There is definitely a drop in performance moving from balanced to unbalanced and back again (and an increase in noise). Chaining maintains a balanced signal flow from microphone to converter.
|
|
