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Post by lpedrum on Aug 20, 2014 13:29:30 GMT -6
Later this year I hope to purchase a stereo mix compressor as I move a bit more into hybrid recording and mixing. The SB4001 gets lots of raves online and is a reasonable price. The Overstayer looks really intriguing but it's much harder to find reviews. It's not a 500 unit but is actually cheaper than the Serpent. Both are made in the USA. Has anyone on this site had any experience with either of these compressors? I currently use Cytomic the Glue and like what it does--the blend is a must for me and both of these units have that. Here's a link to Overstayer.
Overstayer Stereo Compressor |
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Post by svart on Aug 20, 2014 13:33:41 GMT -6
They are both based on the SSL4K stereo bus compressor, like the GSSL was, only these seem to include all the extras like the sidechain filters and such. (More examples of folks making cottage industries around other's non-profit work..)
I suppose you couldn't go wrong with either one.
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Post by btreim on Aug 20, 2014 13:47:02 GMT -6
I own an overstayer if you have some files you want me to run through it.
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Post by drbill on Aug 20, 2014 14:44:01 GMT -6
I haven't tried the overstayer, but I can say that the Serpent 4001 rocks as a buss compressor. Excellent clone of the SSL with a few tricks of it's own that take it over the top. You can't go wrong with it.
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Post by lpedrum on Aug 21, 2014 8:51:20 GMT -6
I own an overstayer if you have some files you want me to run through it. Only if that's easy for you to do Ben. It's interesting that I can't find one negative comment about the Serpent ANYWHERE, and usually that type of acceptance means a good investment. The Overstayer is not as well known. I wonder what their return policy is if one doesn't dig it--I'll have to look into that. I'm not sure if either of these units allow for mono compression while tracking--does your Overstayer? Is there anything about the Overstayer you find lacking or do you think its the perfect solution for SSL type mix compression? |
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Post by lpedrum on Aug 21, 2014 8:54:01 GMT -6
(More examples of folks making cottage industries around other's non-profit work..) I'm not sure what you mean but that. Should I ask? Maybe not! |
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Post by svart on Aug 21, 2014 9:18:34 GMT -6
(More examples of folks making cottage industries around other's non-profit work..) I'm not sure what you mean but that. Should I ask? Maybe not! Nah, it won't mean anything to ask the manufacturers. I was an original member of GroupDIY and watched, and built one of the original GSSL compressors back when there were maybe a dozen in the world.. Since then I've seen so many people join that forum. A lot of them only joined to take and sell the ideas that the original members put there for free. The whole idea behind the forum was free knowledge and learning. Over time too many folks made it about building kits and making money, so I ended up quitting the forum. I guess you can tell that I have a grudge against those who stole the work that others did. |
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Post by tonycamphd on Aug 21, 2014 9:27:42 GMT -6
it's not always black n white, i have to say that companies like dbx messed up on the 166 circuit, guys like Jim Williams figured out their mistake, he makes mods that improve it beyond the best dbx ever offered imo, he also does the same to all kinds of equipment, Serpent figured out what makes the old 1176's sound like... old 1176's, and has implemented those findings into their Splice(something UAD has not achieved), along with a lot of other features that allow it to outperform the original, i'd also add that design patents only stand for 17 years, after that anything goes legally. That said, i'm not impressed with carbon copies either.
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Post by ElGato on Aug 22, 2014 10:52:09 GMT -6
I've heard some blind tests (not the serpent) and the overstayer has never impressed me, sorry. I know these online tests are not the be all end all but just my 2c.
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Post by btreim on Aug 22, 2014 13:01:51 GMT -6
I own an overstayer if you have some files you want me to run through it. Only if that's easy for you to do Ben. It's interesting that I can't find one negative comment about the Serpent ANYWHERE, and usually that type of acceptance means a good investment. The Overstayer is not as well known. I wonder what their return policy is if one doesn't dig it--I'll have to look into that. I'm not sure if either of these units allow for mono compression while tracking--does your Overstayer? Is there anything about the Overstayer you find lacking or do you think its the perfect solution for SSL type mix compression? Sure, send me a PM and I'll try and get some files turned around this weekend. I'm not quite sure what the return policy is, but it's a fairly small shop so I would imagine they would work with you. The overstayer doesn't have a dual mono mode, but I suppose you could run a mono track through one side of it. The thing that sold me on the overstayer wasn't so much that I thought it would be exactly like an SSL but because it had a few features (wet/dry and shelving eq for example) that I really thought would be useful to me, especially since I wasn't in the position to buy dedicated boxes to do those tasks at the time. All of that aside, I just really enjoy playing around with it! My only gripe would be that I'm not a huge fan of it being powered by a wall wart. I know there's lots of reasons for manufactures to do that and it helps cut down on cost, but it just messes with my cable organization! |
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Post by Guitar on Aug 22, 2014 22:29:57 GMT -6
All I can say is Serpent is a pretty impressive operation, and I'm going to build an SB4000.
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Post by lpedrum on Aug 23, 2014 13:27:41 GMT -6
All I can say is Serpent is a pretty impressive operation, and I'm going to build an SB4000. I've yet to hear anything bad about the Serpent. |
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Post by tonycamphd on Aug 23, 2014 16:34:54 GMT -6
All I can say is Serpent is a pretty impressive operation, and I'm going to build an SB4000. I've yet to hear anything bad about the Serpent. Mike is really great at what he does, he's one of the rare electronics/ears chops guys around, his SA3A/Chimera is the perfect LA3A clone with the desired mods built right in, and that friggin 1176 Splice is the shit, the insanely great modern versatility and vintage sound aside, it's about as cool looking as any modern piece i've ever seen! He's very good at marrying the old school sound(less the noise), with modern parameter control. If only it had chicken head knobs 8) |
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Post by noah shain on Aug 23, 2014 22:39:00 GMT -6
I haven't used the serpent but I'll never part with my Overstayer VCA. Flexible as hell. Sounds great. From subtle to SMASH. I'll probably get another one. Drum bus, 2 bus, bass, everywhere. It kills. The FET is incredible too. I also have 4 channels of Jeff's Master and Servant circuit. Game changing device.
Overstayer is top quality gear.
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Post by topshelfmg on Nov 4, 2016 13:50:09 GMT -6
Seeing if I can revive this post! I posted in more detail on the SSL Style comp poll before I saw this, but I was wondering if anyone had any experience with the SB4001 and the TK BC501. If I were to be getting the Serpent, I would be doing so in the next 9 hours while it's still $250 off ($999). Would mainly be using it on the mix buss, but I'm sure it would also get used on the drum buss, BGVS buss, and even vocals every now and then. I'm definitely looking for versatility, and the ability to have the compressor be both "clean" and "gritty/snappy/punchy", unless one just really excels on mix buss duties over the other, which, as of now, doesn't really seem to be the case. I've met Mike, who seems like a great guy and even better compressor designer, and it seems like the Serpent has more going on under the hood. The addition of the extra side chain options and variable release is cool also. Both come highly recommended to me though, and I'd like to gather some last minute opinions if possible before I spring for the SB4001 today.
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Post by indiehouse on Nov 4, 2016 14:28:38 GMT -6
Seeing if I can revive this post! I posted in more detail on the SSL Style comp poll before I saw this, but I was wondering if anyone had any experience with the SB4001 and the TK BC501. If I were to be getting the Serpent, I would be doing so in the next 9 hours while it's still $250 off ($999). Would mainly be using it on the mix buss, but I'm sure it would also get used on the drum buss, BGVS buss, and even vocals every now and then. I'm definitely looking for versatility, and the ability to have the compressor be both "clean" and "gritty/snappy/punchy", unless one just really excels on mix buss duties over the other, which, as of now, doesn't really seem to be the case. I've met Mike, who seems like a great guy and even better compressor designer, and it seems like the Serpent has more going on under the hood. The addition of the extra side chain options and variable release is cool also. Both come highly recommended to me though, and I'd like to gather some last minute opinions if possible before I spring for the SB4001 today. I've had both. Both are great. Trust that no matter which one you end up with, it won't be the wrong choice. I think I could make the Serpent slam a little harder than the BC501. But really, both are great. I really have respect for Mike and his work. I've also got his Splice 500 series compressor, and I'm building his SA3A. So, I initially bought the BC501 on a killer black friday sale last year, and just a month ago picked up a SB4001 second hand for a really great price. Ended up selling the BC501. But really, don't sweat it. They are both great. |
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Post by topshelfmg on Nov 4, 2016 14:37:26 GMT -6
Thanks for your feedback! I plan on picking up a Splice MKII as my next compressor purchase one way or another. It always seems to come back to these two units as far as this style of mix buss compression, even when I open it up to other model suggestions. Leaning towards the Serpent, which is reassuring based on your experience.
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Post by rocinante on Nov 4, 2016 22:29:29 GMT -6
They really are all very similar acting in the end. I would lean towards the serpent or TK more as they are both are very feature filled. A little goes a long way with these though and I usually only have 2-3 bus compressor settings I use; very little, a little less, and loud.
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Post by thehightenor on Nov 5, 2016 4:47:49 GMT -6
I picked up a Roll Music RMS 755 stereo mix compressor, it cost more than the Serpent Audio 500 sereis comp here in the UK but I've been very impressed with this unit.
The bass end is very tight and BIG, and the Roll seems to add a lovely sparkle to the top end in a very "analog" way .... well it is analog :-)
It doesn't do the SSL mid crunch sound like a Smart C1, but that's not my thing anyway it's more open sounding but with a great control of the envolope.
Definately worth a demo, it's become my favourite mix bus compressor at the moment.
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Post by topshelfmg on Nov 5, 2016 16:47:35 GMT -6
I picked up a Roll Music RMS 755 stereo mix compressor, it cost more than the Serpent Audio 500 sereis comp here in the UK but I've been very impressed with this unit. The bass end is very tight and BIG, and the Roll seems to add a lovely sparkle to the top end in a very "analog" way .... well it is analog :-) It doesn't do the SSL mid crunch sound like a Smart C1, but that's not my thing anyway it's more open sounding but with a great control of the envolope. Definately worth a demo, it's become my favourite mix bus compressor at the moment. Ended up getting the Serpent, thanks guys! I'll let ya know how I like it. As for a more opened, natural mix buss compressor, I have a Tube Tech LCA-2A that was just cleaned up real nice by my friend/tech here in Nashville. I was looking for a contrasting tone / compression type so that I have different options for different genres. I love the LCA 2A... its technically a VCA, so it's fast as hell, but it's almost like a mix between a VCA and a vari-mu based on it's design, since a dual-triode acts as the VCA. It definitely retains a good bit of that Tube Tech sound. Can either be clean or very tubey, and is an amazing BGV and drum buss compressor as well. Imparts a nice weight to mixes, and I tend to like it on RnB/soul, swing, and acoustic (singer/songwriter) tracks a lot on the mix buss. The Serpent will be more for pop mixes and heavier genres. |
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Post by mdmitch2 on Nov 6, 2016 8:38:20 GMT -6
Good choice -- the sb4001 is great. Make sure to check out the "grind" mode. It adds a bit of harmonic color that I found often worked on rock mixes.
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Post by indiehouse on Nov 6, 2016 8:54:16 GMT -6
Good choice -- the sb4001 is great. Make sure to check out the "grind" mode. It adds a bit of harmonic color that I found often worked on rock mixes. It's cool, but subtle! |
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Post by jimwilliams on Nov 6, 2016 9:27:17 GMT -6
I have a couple of Overstayer comps in the shop right now. One is a fet 1176 knockoff, the V12.9 2011 model, the other is the dbx based VCA design, the V6.0 2011 issue.
The major issue/problem with these is the power supply. It's a modular switcher and it dumps a ton of hf hash onto the power rails, that gives these a grainy sound.
These used 5532/34 opamps and bipolar coupling caps. I ended up replacing the opamps, installing polarized Panasonic FR caps (with offsets properly oriented) film bypass caps and a bunch of Dale PTF .1% precision 5 ppm resistors. That signal path is now pure, clear and very quiet.
I used a Chandler external power supply and installed power feed cables to run these from that 1/2 rack linear supply. Now the power rails are super clean and so is the sound, huge low end, water clear tops, a big sound these didn't have before.
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Post by mdmitch2 on Nov 6, 2016 9:33:12 GMT -6
Good choice -- the sb4001 is great. Make sure to check out the "grind" mode. It adds a bit of harmonic color that I found often worked on rock mixes. It's cool, but subtle! I found it to be subtle on some mixes, and not at all subtle on others. It really depends on what's going on in the mix. I found it especially useful when a vocal was on the dull side. |
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Post by guitfiddler on Nov 6, 2016 18:25:53 GMT -6
 Is there a 19" rack mount unit of the SB4001? The 1176 Black/Blue stripe box is the one I'm very interested in. Is there anyone else that has used this piece and have more to say on it? |
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