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Post by Johnkenn on Jan 26, 2023 18:54:24 GMT -6
Honestly, after reading the V-Comp page, I learned a few things. I haven't been pushing the input hard enough...just habit from years of using the Retro. If I had a Retro SL on double with the input at 1-2:00, I'd be getting -20 or -30 lol. I'm going in at about -25db and getting -10-15 ish GR. I've also always used faster release on vocals, but this thing is great around 11:00. audioscapeChain is - Soyuz 017 Tube-->H2 0011-->AS V-Comp-->Burl AD. Here's the Wav file - drive.google.com/file/d/1YAMIgqE9UUuYgGAGEkHW6hMHc-nrKzR8/view?usp=share_link |
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Post by kcatthedog on Jan 26, 2023 19:23:32 GMT -6
Link isn’t working on my mobile ?
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Post by Johnkenn on Jan 26, 2023 20:17:43 GMT -6
Scroll down and switch to desktop
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Post by Johnkenn on Jan 26, 2023 20:20:16 GMT -6
Or click the click here link
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2023 21:03:50 GMT -6
It's forward, modern and it sounds cool mainly but there's a high end distortion / poke that's annoying me.
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Post by Johnkenn on Jan 26, 2023 21:38:01 GMT -6
It's forward, modern and it sounds cool mainly but there's a high end distortion / poke that's annoying me. Man. I hear absolutely none of that. What you listening through? I’m fact, I’d say it’s the opposite of modern. Not being argumentative, I just don’t hear what you’re saying at all. I’ll tip my hat if that’s the consensus. |
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Jan 26, 2023 21:45:18 GMT -6
And to think I thought you did a Fleetwood Mac cover😎
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2023 21:46:35 GMT -6
It's forward, modern and it sounds cool mainly but there's a high end distortion / poke that's annoying me. Man. I hear absolutely none of that. What you listening through? I’m fact, I’d say it’s the opposite of modern. Not being argumentative, I just don’t hear what you’re saying at all. I’ll tip my hat if that’s the consensus. I won't deny it John I was being lazy and listened on my MBP speakers, so I just grabbed my Beyer DT700 PRO X's. Yeah, it doesn't sound as modern but there's still a high end pinch that my ears are wincing at slightly. I do use them on occasion as mixing headphones and compared to my "references" there's something going on in that upper end.
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Post by Johnkenn on Jan 26, 2023 21:48:47 GMT -6
Man. I hear absolutely none of that. What you listening through? I’m fact, I’d say it’s the opposite of modern. Not being argumentative, I just don’t hear what you’re saying at all. I’ll tip my hat if that’s the consensus. I won't deny it John I was being lazy and listened on my MBP speakers, so I just grabbed my Beyer DT700 PRO X's. Yeah, it doesn't sound as modern but there's still a high end pinch that my ears are wincing at slightly. I do use them on occasion as mixing headphones and compared to my "references" there's something going on in that upper end.
If that’s the case, I need to reassess my career choice and investment. Because…I just don’t hear it. That said - I didn’t listen to the SoundCloud conversion. Not being salty - hey - I need to know…but I thought that was the best vocal sound I’ve ever gotten. OK - added the wav file up top...but listening on my expensive speakers through an expensive DA through ridic expensive room correction - and I still don't hear it on the SC file. I mean maybe the fuzziness of the comp - but that's intended. This is going to be interesting/depressing if I'm the only one that doesn't think it... |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2023 22:01:56 GMT -6
If that’s the case, I need to reassess my career choice and investment. Because…I just don’t hear it. That said - I didn’t listen to the SoundCloud conversion. Not being salty - hey - I need to know…but I thought that was the best vocal sound I’ve ever gotten. Honestly, I only try to help John (sorry for being lazy though). If someone said the same to me so be it. Nobody needs to agree but that's what I'm getting at my end and I'm not going to lie. IMV nobody benefits, I guess I could have just skipped along but what's the point?
Funnily enough Martin posted a song with the Soyuz that did the same. Maybe it's just me and that mic? I'd need to hear more examples to compare really, so just for example I listened to a few examples, an odd mix of songs like Cameo Word Up, Heather Ethans Flame in the night (thanks seawell cool song), some Sia, Muse (Starlight) that's a smooth mic and some Maroon 5. Sia did start to approach the threshold at relative volume on a couple but nah, it's still messing with my ears for some reason.
P.S I've heard a lot of your stuff and its all been great thus far.
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Post by Johnkenn on Jan 26, 2023 22:08:19 GMT -6
If that’s the case, I need to reassess my career choice and investment. Because…I just don’t hear it. That said - I didn’t listen to the SoundCloud conversion. Not being salty - hey - I need to know…but I thought that was the best vocal sound I’ve ever gotten. Honestly, I only try to help John (sorry for being lazy though). If someone said the same to me so be it. Nobody needs to agree but that's what I'm getting at my end and I'm not going to lie. IMV nobody benefits, I guess I could have just skipped along but what's the point?
Funnily enough Martin posted a song with the Soyuz that did the same. Maybe it's just me and that mic? I'd need to hear more examples to compare really, so just for example I listened to a few examples, an odd mix of songs like Cameo Word Up, Heather Ethans Flame in the night (thanks seawell cool song), some Sia, Muse (Starlight) that's a smooth mic and some Maroon 5. Sia did started to approach the threshold at relative volume on a couple but nah, it's still messing with my ears for some reason. P.S I've heard a lot of your stuff and its all been great thus far.
I'm not dogging you - I genuinely want to know now if others think the same thing. I mean, regardless, I'm gonna roll with this because I think it sounds awesome...but if I'm the only one that thinks that, then that's an issue lol. I guess too, I'm just surprised that I don't hear that at all. Like - I don't hear the capsule pinching/getting small - and MOST mics do that on my voice. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2023 22:23:37 GMT -6
I'm not dogging you - I genuinely want to know now if others think the same thing. I mean, regardless, I'm gonna roll with this because I think it sounds awesome...but if I'm the only one that thinks that, then that's an issue lol. I guess too, I'm just surprised that I don't hear that at all. Like - I don't hear the capsule pinching/getting small - and MOST mics do that on my voice. Just out of curiosity, give Alexi Murdoch (Breathe) a listen or Stapleton / JT (say something). I find their voice / mic combo smooth as silk, some of the problem is aligning just aligning ears.. You might find it dull / boring so it would be interesting to correlate. |
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Post by Johnkenn on Jan 26, 2023 22:35:47 GMT -6
I'm not going to claim to have a vocal sound like Stapleton lol, but it's not really a very honest comparison, right? This is a completely unmixed vocal with no EQ or mix compression. Stapleton's is...well, not. But I didn't hear anything listening to several CS songs (whom I'm very familiar with) that I thought that was wildly different. If I were to treat this, I'd probably duck a little 3khz, maybe a little de-essing...but that's about it.
Listening to something like "Starting Over," It's more rolled off on top and more pushed in the 700-900hz range...and while I love what him and those records, that's not particularly what I seem to be drawn to. So, yeah - if more top and less middle mids is not modern, I guess the clip above is more modern.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2023 22:50:40 GMT -6
I'm not going to claim to have a vocal sound like Stapleton lol, but it's not really a very honest comparison, right? This is a completely unmixed vocal with no EQ or mix compression. Stapleton's is...well, not. But I didn't hear anything listening to several CS songs (whom I'm very familiar with) that I thought that was wildly different. If I were to treat this, I'd probably duck a little 3khz, maybe a little de-essing...but that's about it. Listening to something like "Starting Over," It's more rolled off on top and more pushed in the 700-900hz range...and while I love what him and those records, that's not particularly what I seem to be drawn to. So, yeah - if more top and less middle mids is not modern, I guess the clip above is more modern. I mean, maybe we should PM this and sorry to take up forum real estate but I've always been very sensitive to high end frequencies. Unfortunately I'm not amazing in other areas but it is what it is. Anyway, that's my point we might just not have the same preference. Even after tracking with a bit of comp / EQ on the channel strip I'd aim towards the Stapleton style but that's just me. That's why I tend to like the 2A just to roll stuff off through a bit of comp but I know some others aren't too keen on that style..
So as always, everyone's a critic and I'm not trying to teflon shoulder it but if you're happy then cool. Although I think we understand each other and our style's a bit better which is always nice  . |
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Post by christopher on Jan 26, 2023 23:30:14 GMT -6
I agree that I dig it, definitely has some balls. I really like this kind of thing to have in your toolbox, because it takes a condenser and makes it behave a little more like we’d expect an old dynamic: saturated and controlled, yet conveys a sense of power from the singer. But it’s better than a dynamic, has more detail. I do hear the distortion, but I’m thinking of this in a full mix and how it will likely cut through.
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Post by nick8801 on Jan 27, 2023 6:39:37 GMT -6
I think it sounds great! Definitely a colored sound, but that's kinda the point of that chain? If you like it, and it makes you want to sing, I'd say it's a winner!
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Post by svart on Jan 27, 2023 8:41:52 GMT -6
It's forward, modern and it sounds cool mainly but there's a high end distortion / poke that's annoying me. Man. I hear absolutely none of that. What you listening through? I’m fact, I’d say it’s the opposite of modern. Not being argumentative, I just don’t hear what you’re saying at all. I’ll tip my hat if that’s the consensus. I don't really hear anything either. I'm listening through earbuds though, but they're the same ones I listen to music all day on at work (for years and years), so I'm intimately used to every nuance of their sound.. I think you could push the compression even more, honestly. Watching videos of the big boys mix stuff, it's crazy watching them go "lets add a little compression to the vocal" and seeing their GR meters pegging out doing 15-20dB GR. I've been doing it more and more and honestly letting go of the "you can only do XXX amount of compression/EQ or you're dumb" stuff has been the best thing for my mixes in a long time, lol. But yeah, overall it's a great sound. A little chesty IMHO solo'd but it'll probably sound great in a mix. |
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Post by Johnkenn on Jan 27, 2023 9:05:13 GMT -6
Man. I hear absolutely none of that. What you listening through? I’m fact, I’d say it’s the opposite of modern. Not being argumentative, I just don’t hear what you’re saying at all. I’ll tip my hat if that’s the consensus. I don't really hear anything either. I'm listening through earbuds though, but they're the same ones I listen to music all day on at work (for years and years), so I'm intimately used to every nuance of their sound.. I think you could push the compression even more, honestly. Watching videos of the big boys mix stuff, it's crazy watching them go "lets add a little compression to the vocal" and seeing their GR meters pegging out doing 15-20dB GR. I've been doing it more and more and honestly letting go of the "you can only do XXX amount of compression/EQ or you're dumb" stuff has been the best thing for my mixes in a long time, lol. But yeah, overall it's a great sound. A little chesty IMHO solo'd but it'll probably sound great in a mix. Yeah - I’ve been listening more to radio stuff and I’m always kind of shocked at just HOW compressed the vocals are. It’s crazy. Still not my preference, though. |
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Post by srb on Jan 27, 2023 9:29:00 GMT -6
Once you learn to hear compression, you can't unhear it.
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Post by noob on Jan 27, 2023 9:35:39 GMT -6
There's no high frequency issue with this at all. Sounds super clean, detailed, and beautiful.
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Post by copperx on Jan 27, 2023 10:15:46 GMT -6
Once you learn to hear compression, you can't unhear it. And if you like that sound, you crave it. I often daydream with dancing gain reduction meters. |
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Post by noob on Jan 27, 2023 10:25:26 GMT -6
I don't really hear anything either. I'm listening through earbuds though, but they're the same ones I listen to music all day on at work (for years and years), so I'm intimately used to every nuance of their sound.. I think you could push the compression even more, honestly. Watching videos of the big boys mix stuff, it's crazy watching them go "lets add a little compression to the vocal" and seeing their GR meters pegging out doing 15-20dB GR. I've been doing it more and more and honestly letting go of the "you can only do XXX amount of compression/EQ or you're dumb" stuff has been the best thing for my mixes in a long time, lol. But yeah, overall it's a great sound. A little chesty IMHO solo'd but it'll probably sound great in a mix. Yeah - I’ve been listening more to radio stuff and I’m always kind of shocked at just HOW compressed the vocals are. It’s crazy. Still not my preference, though. Most of that radio stuff is CL 1B on vox |
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Post by donr on Jan 27, 2023 11:10:31 GMT -6
John I've heard you sing that line a dozen times over the years. There's something a little strained sounding in the loud parts here.
Dunno, maybe your voice wasn't yet opened up?
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Post by Johnkenn on Jan 27, 2023 11:24:08 GMT -6
John I've heard you sing that line a dozen times over the years. There's something a little strained sounding in the loud parts here. Dunno, maybe your voice wasn't yet opened up? Well, I sang it once…but weird, I disregarding the performance, I thought this was the best sounding vocal I’ve ever gotten. Got some vocal stuff coming up and looking forward to using it. |
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Post by Johnkenn on Jan 27, 2023 11:37:45 GMT -6
Yeah - I’ve been listening more to radio stuff and I’m always kind of shocked at just HOW compressed the vocals are. It’s crazy. Still not my preference, though. Most of that radio stuff is CL 1B on vox I doubt it’s “most.” Maybe some. Whatever it is, it’s compressed to high hell. So here’s what I like about the recording I posted above. I’m not worried about the performance… When it goes into the higher part, I don’t hear any “pinching” or tightness in the capsule. The frequencies stay consistent. That’s always been a hard thing for me to find in a mic and pre combo. Im also not really worried that it’s not perfectly eq’d either. To me, that can be tweaked according to the mix. But I thought it was really balanced. I do think the V-comp adds some harmonic distortion - maybe “buzziness,” but in a mix that will be negligible. What I wouldn’t want is to not be hearing certain frequencies properly despite monitoring through high end DA, speakers and a Trinnov. Not saying that to be a douche - I’m just saying if I’m not hearing things right, I could sell some of that shit and buy a car. |
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