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Post by Tbone81 on Apr 24, 2021 15:26:52 GMT -6
Here's the scenario...I like to have pairs of mics. I'm rethinking my setup. Streamlining things and trying to figure out where LDC Tube mics fall into my future. So if I were to buy two different Tube Mics what would the best combo be? I'm leaning towards clones of the classics (u47/u48, u67, Elam 251, C12, m49 etc.). Price range would be around $2k each, $4k total, but could stretch a little more if I have to. I want multi pattern (at least cardiod and figure 8).
I'd be using them, in order of importance on:
1) Vocals of all kinds (male/female, modern/vintage, singersongwriter, all genres) 2) Acoustic guitar 3) Drum Rooms and/or OH 4) Miscellaneous acoustic instruments (cello, piano etc)
Mics that I've been considering:
Signal Arts u48 ADK z-67 ADK z-251 BeesNeez Arabella BeesNeez Mahalia BeesNeez Phelicity
Assume that I have Fet mics, dynamics and ribbons already covered. Also, for reference I'm somewhat familiar with u47 and u67 clones, but other than that my experience with the classic mics are very limited. I'd be buying them one at time.
So whats the best, non-similar, pair of tube mics that will cover the most ground? Interested in what you all have to say.
Pearlman TM-1. I have two, one wasn't enough. If they were multi pattern I’d be considering them, I’ve heard good things.
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Post by chessparov on Apr 24, 2021 16:46:55 GMT -6
If you get the Warm WA-47... You can have it further refined, by Chad @ Signal Arts later. Chris
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Post by Vincent R. on Apr 25, 2021 7:42:24 GMT -6
I like the idea of getting a Neumann styled mic and an AKG styled mic. I think going in that direction will serve you the best. For Neumann I would look at U47, M49, and U67 styled mics. They all really have their own sound, but they all have warmth with an enhanced midrange. The U47 is bigger than life, with a kind of built in compression and openness. The M49 has that bigger than life quality, but is less compressed with a more even and less woofy low end, and a slightly less open top end. The U67 is flat out neutral and sounds good on everything. The M269 is a bit more open. It could be what you’re looking for, but once you start looking at the AKG style mics you’ll have that openness on one of them. ADK’s 67 is based on the M269. Just know that before you pick it up. The U67 is much darker on the top end and is more universal in it’s application. I would look at the RMS269 before I look at the ADK if you want to go in that direction. It has a bigger midrange than the ADK and sounds richer.
With AKG you have two classics to look at; C12 and ELA M251 styled mics. The C12 is very open with less midrange push than the Neumann mics. It’s a very specific sound, but for a forward focused vocal it can sound really special. The 251 has a bigger sound to it. It’s seems like a cross between the C12 sound and the U47.
If I were looking at just two I’d look at the U67 and 251. I think they will have a nice contrast and work together when needed. The other combination which seems to be really popular is the U47 and C12. They are sort of two complete ends of the spectrum.
I like what I’ve heard from ADK’s 251. I haven’t heard the Lawson. I always love what I hear from the Bock, but that may be out of your budget. The Upton sounds a touch darker on top than others, which could be a good thing or a bad thing. For the 12 I might look at just having Barabric build one with Tim’s Capsule. I haven’t heard to many clips of the ADK, so I can’t comment.
The WA47 is really good for the money, but I’d still look at the FleA 47 or the Heiserman H47T if I were looking at the 47. As for the U67, Stam makes a good 67, but you can’t get it in any kind of timely manner. The WA67 sounds ok, but I’d probably upgrade the capsule if I went that direction. Unfortunately, no one seems to be making a good, readily available U67 clone. The reissue is great once you roll a few tubes in it, but it ain’t affordable.
Quick note; I own a FleA 49, custom U67, and I’ve been itching for a Bock 251 for a while.
Just my thoughts.
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Post by soundintheround on Apr 25, 2021 7:54:53 GMT -6
I'm a fan of both U47 and U67 clones from Stam. Different enough for vocals or instruments, but in the same ballpark if you wanted to use together on drum overheads.
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Post by johneppstein on Apr 25, 2021 19:21:25 GMT -6
One thing to think about - If you intend to use these mics as overheads, a piano micing pair, or anything remotely similar, you'll need a pair of the same mic, if not an actual matched pair.
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Post by Tbone81 on Apr 25, 2021 19:46:15 GMT -6
One thing to think about - If you intend to use these mics as overheads, a piano micing pair, or anything remotely similar, you'll need a pair of the same mic, if not an actual matched pair. Thanks, yeah I’ve thought about that. I may use them as mono OH and mono rooms but the only stereo application I’d use them is as drum room mics in which case I’ve found using two different mics can yield very interesting results. Doesn’t work for everything, but non similar mics panned hard left/right can be awesome when blended with other mics. YMMV of course
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Post by Vincent R. on Apr 25, 2021 20:22:05 GMT -6
One thing to think about - If you intend to use these mics as overheads, a piano micing pair, or anything remotely similar, you'll need a pair of the same mic, if not an actual matched pair. For that kind of application you could set up two different mics in mid-side.
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Post by Guitar on Apr 26, 2021 5:17:55 GMT -6
Mid/Side drums is one of my favorite techniques, nothing wrong with a mono drum room either if you have to. Maybe add a second pair even further away of some other mics. Or you could do the "old school" mic setup of one overhead, one out in front of the kick. I believe the Motown drums were recorded this way. Add close mics if you need them.
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Post by Ward on Apr 26, 2021 6:43:33 GMT -6
Mid/Side drums is one of my favorite techniques, nothing wrong with a mono drum room either if you have to. Maybe add a second pair even further away of some other mics. Or you could do the "old school" mic setup of one overhead, one out in front of the kick. I believe the Motown drums were recorded this way. Add close mics if you need them. With a matched pair of tube LDCs you could probably pull off Glyn Johns' recorder man method as well as with two SS LDCs. Just add a 57 or better sdd for snare and an outside kick drum... doesn't have to be a Heiserman 47FEt or a Heiserman type 19.
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Apr 26, 2021 15:45:07 GMT -6
Ask BradD best money you can spend on your hunt for the perfect mic is to rent a couple of hours at major studio with a bunch of the classics. Tell them what your up to and you will probably walk in with a bunch lined and ready for you to shoot out. Even better if you bring something you own as a reference. You will walk out with files you can take home and take the time to figure out what your goal is. Yes it’s not going to be cheap, but it’s probably less money than going down the wrong road.
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Post by chessparov on Apr 26, 2021 16:34:33 GMT -6
Looks like VK L.A. is allowing demo-ing again... Chris
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Post by Vincent R. on Apr 26, 2021 16:38:04 GMT -6
Ask BradD best money you can spend on your hunt for the perfect mic is to rent a couple of hours at major studio with a bunch of the classics. Tell them what your up to and you will probably walk in with a bunch lined and ready for you to shoot out. Even better if you bring something you own as a reference. You will walk out with files you can take home and take the time to figure out what your goal is. Yes it’s not going to be cheap, but it’s probably less money than going down the wrong road. I’ve done this twice; once at Spock Studios by me where Emily and I got to try a Wagner U47W and a Korby Kat with all the caps. Then at The Barbershop Studios where I sang into an amazing sounding M49C, U67, M269, RCA44, U47 FET, and more. Totally amazing experience.
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Post by Tbone81 on Apr 26, 2021 18:38:03 GMT -6
Ask BradD best money you can spend on your hunt for the perfect mic is to rent a couple of hours at major studio with a bunch of the classics. Tell them what your up to and you will probably walk in with a bunch lined and ready for you to shoot out. Even better if you bring something you own as a reference. You will walk out with files you can take home and take the time to figure out what your goal is. Yes it’s not going to be cheap, but it’s probably less money than going down the wrong road. Thats a good idea. I do regularly book time in big studios but I’m not sure there is a studio in Portland that would have all those mics. Jackpot probably has a few and Dead Aunt Thelmas have some nice Mics but most places around have u87’s and maybe some u47 type mic with a few extras. But unfortunately it’s not like LA or Nashville or NY...then again the prices for a full day of studio time are rediculously low too.
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Post by ericn on Apr 26, 2021 20:15:29 GMT -6
Ask BradD best money you can spend on your hunt for the perfect mic is to rent a couple of hours at major studio with a bunch of the classics. Tell them what your up to and you will probably walk in with a bunch lined and ready for you to shoot out. Even better if you bring something you own as a reference. You will walk out with files you can take home and take the time to figure out what your goal is. Yes it’s not going to be cheap, but it’s probably less money than going down the wrong road. Thats a good idea. I do regularly book time in big studios but I’m not sure there is a studio in Portland that would have all those mics. Jackpot probably has a few and Dead Aunt Thelmas have some nice Mics but most places around have u87’s and maybe some u47 type mic with a few extras. But unfortunately it’s not like LA or Nashville or NY...then again the prices for a full day of studio time are rediculously low too. OK this is where bringing your reference mic comes in: even if it’s a 58, having a the reference, best to have it just above the greats let’s you know what’s the mic and what’s your performance. Their is nothing like the performance of your life on a mic that isn’t quite right, but you thinking it’s the mic! Plus you can take it to other studios to gather more options and be able to figure out if it’s the mic, the room, or the performance.
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Post by javamad on Apr 27, 2021 3:42:41 GMT -6
+1 to the 47 - 251 combo
I have an SA-47 (which you won’t buy) and an AR-51 (not made any more) ... so I’m not much help except to say that between these two types you can really cover a lot of ground.
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