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USB4
Sept 3, 2019 13:22:24 GMT -6
Post by hio on Sept 3, 2019 13:22:24 GMT -6
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USB4
Sept 3, 2019 14:06:24 GMT -6
Post by din on Sept 3, 2019 14:06:24 GMT -6
oh jeebus
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Post by donr on Sept 3, 2019 14:35:03 GMT -6
But will it support MIDI? (Just joking..)
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USB4
Sept 3, 2019 19:35:13 GMT -6
Post by BenjaminAshlin on Sept 3, 2019 19:35:13 GMT -6
Manufactures are still using thunderbolt 1/2 in most cases. Will be about 5 years before we see USB4 interfaces.
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USB4
Sept 3, 2019 20:30:24 GMT -6
via mobile
Post by shoe on Sept 3, 2019 20:30:24 GMT -6
Didn't 3.2 just come out recently? lol
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USB4
Sept 4, 2019 2:52:21 GMT -6
Post by hio on Sept 4, 2019 2:52:21 GMT -6
Manufactures are still using thunderbolt 1/2 in most cases. Will be about 5 years before we see USB4 interfaces. No, I don't think so, this bridge so to speak has been a long time coming based on a whole litany of factors and even Intel's newer CPUs will be optimized for this new standard protocol for some time. Also, peripheral manufacturers and even motherboard designers won't be needing to pay the usage tax they were having to pay for just Thunderbolt. That means Thunderbolt-compatible products will no longer have to pay the company a licensing fee, too, which should incentivize manufacturers to adopt Thunderbolt in their products sooner than later.
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USB4
Sept 4, 2019 4:14:42 GMT -6
Post by cyrano on Sept 4, 2019 4:14:42 GMT -6
Manufactures are still using thunderbolt 1/2 in most cases. Will be about 5 years before we see USB4 interfaces. If we ever see USB4... Apple has put all it's marketing force behind USB-C. And that seems to stick. The market will decide. Currently, all audio interface manufacturers are looking at Dante and/or AVB. These are a lot more interesting*, as most computers have an ethernet port. That doesn't mean all these ports can be used easily, but any [non-budget] computer from the last ten years would do. Supporting AVB or Dante will take up a lot of the manufacturers' limited budget, so USB4 will be sitting on the back bench. A bit the same as USB3, really. As far as my limited memory goes, only Zoom has a few USB3 interfaces. Let's face it: USB2 is perfectly adequate for 99% of users out there. Only people doing 64 channels or more simultaneously need something else and most of these have already changed to AVB, or Dante. It's just unfortunate we end up with two standards: the proprietary Dante and the very-slow-moving but open AVB. * Think cables up to 75 m and routing ability over network, allowing some channels to go to one computer and some other (or even the same, for backup) channels going to a second machine that could be miles away. And AVB could even include video and could even travel over the internets...
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USB4
Sept 4, 2019 5:04:34 GMT -6
Guitar likes this
Post by hio on Sept 4, 2019 5:04:34 GMT -6
Manufactures are still using thunderbolt 1/2 in most cases. Will be about 5 years before we see USB4 interfaces. As far as my limited memory goes, only Zoom has a few USB3 interfaces. RME, MOTU, UAD, Tascam, and Presonus to name a few more.
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USB4
Sept 5, 2019 1:09:53 GMT -6
Guitar likes this
Post by the other mark williams on Sept 5, 2019 1:09:53 GMT -6
Manufactures are still using thunderbolt 1/2 in most cases. Will be about 5 years before we see USB4 interfaces. If we ever see USB4... Apple has put all it's marketing force behind USB-C. And that seems to stick. The market will decide. But USB-C is just the connector, yes? My understanding is that USB4 will use the USB-C connector. It seems that Apple will have the one connector (USB-C), which will carry data via USB or Thunderbolt, depending on the device. This is what it does now.
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Post by Ward on Sept 5, 2019 6:10:01 GMT -6
Yeah yeah yeah . . you kids and your USB4
My 2012 17" MBP has 3 USB connectors, Thunderbolt, ethernet, FIREWIRE 800(!), and . . . a CD/DVD drive!
...and stay off my lawn.
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USB4
Sept 5, 2019 6:34:03 GMT -6
Post by cyrano on Sept 5, 2019 6:34:03 GMT -6
If we ever see USB4... Apple has put all it's marketing force behind USB-C. And that seems to stick. The market will decide. But USB-C is just the connector, yes? My understanding is that USB4 will use the USB-C connector. It seems that Apple will have the one connector (USB-C), which will carry data via USB or Thunderbolt, depending on the device. This is what it does now. I haven't read the entire USB4 spec yet. AFAIK USB-C has a few options that matter mostly to Apple, like the ability to carry DisplayPort connections. DisplayPort has been embraced by screen manufacturers. Most modern screens use DisplayPort internally. I'm not sure how many PC makers have embraced the standard. I do know however that USB-C equipped laptops don't all support it. With TB too, it seems to differ between PC laptop makers and Apple. Apple's USB-C ports support TB2, except on the latest Macbook. So it's a bit of a mixed bag, really. The user sees USB-C and will expect some features that might be missing. Some of the optional features are a bit odd, too. Like support for analog headphones, that still will require an adapter. And the techies might frown upon analog ports inside a HF digital connection. It doesn't seem easy to design, as it will likely pick up some interference. Some of these options, like haedphone and mic, are obviously there for smartphones. That's what I'm concerned about. It's developed as a one-size-fits-all solution and more often than not that turns out to be a doesn't-really-fit-anyone solution. Besides, the average computer user hardly needs more speed. 90% of computer users still don't own an external harddisk, fi. Let's not forget that we, as audio users, are a minute part of the market. So, let's wait and see what the market will do. More precisely, how long it will take to become ubiquitous. USB3 has been along for a long while, yet there's still more USB2 around.
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USB4
Sept 5, 2019 17:00:12 GMT -6
via mobile
Guitar likes this
Post by shoe on Sept 5, 2019 17:00:12 GMT -6
Well...sometimes people don't know they need more speed until they do, though. Like, if the tech advances, people will very likely invent interesting things to do with it and then who knows what your average person might end up doing with it.
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Post by hio on Sept 5, 2019 18:32:50 GMT -6
Haven't you heard, USB4 was the last piece of the puzzle at the USB Implementers and Development Forum here in Oregon and the final bit of the puzzle to realize teleportation by the end of 2020.
I have just purchased a one way ticket out of here if our elections get fffed up again and Moscow Mitch won't even bring election safeguards to a vote in the senate that were already passed in the house.
I don't know which is worst, what some might call a human horror show or those that enable *it*.
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USB4
Sept 6, 2019 8:29:46 GMT -6
Post by sirthought on Sept 6, 2019 8:29:46 GMT -6
Yes, USB-C is just the connector. There are devices with USB-C that are using USB 2 technology (Metric Halo, Presonus), so that won't be the hold up, but it might lead to a lot more confusion.
USB 3.2 is available, but not really any devices using it that I know of. They may as well wait for 4.
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Post by Guitar on Sept 8, 2019 17:50:19 GMT -6
I disagree that AVB/Dante/RedNET is the future. It is part of the future. I predict USB 4.0 will either take over or be widely implemented by the biggest names in interfaces.
It would be nice if we could come to some sort of pseudo-standard so people can choose more freely without worrying about connector types, operating systems, and so on.
USB 4.0 could be that standard. We'll see.
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Post by the other mark williams on Sept 8, 2019 19:41:41 GMT -6
I disagree that AVB/Dante/RedNET is the future. It is part of the future. I predict USB 4.0 will either take over or be widely implemented by the biggest names in interfaces. It would be nice if we could come to some sort of pseudo-standard so people can choose more freely without worrying about connector types, operating systems, and so on. USB 4.0 could be that standard. We'll see. I totally agree. Except it is apparently always supposed to be written as "USB4", rather than "USB 4.x".
The USB4 speed is quite impressive: on paper, at least, it matches Thunderbolt 3. I don't know if it has the same access to the motherboard that Thunderbolt has, but I hope it does.
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USB4
Sept 9, 2019 4:55:44 GMT -6
Post by hio on Sept 9, 2019 4:55:44 GMT -6
I disagree that AVB/Dante/RedNET is the future. It is part of the future. I predict USB 4.0 will either take over or be widely implemented by the biggest names in interfaces. It would be nice if we could come to some sort of pseudo-standard so people can choose more freely without worrying about connector types, operating systems, and so on. USB 4.0 could be that standard. We'll see. I totally agree. Except it is apparently always supposed to be written as "USB4", rather than "USB 4.x".
The USB4 speed is quite impressive: on paper, at least, it matches Thunderbolt 3. I don't know if it has the same access to the motherboard that Thunderbolt has, but I hope it does.
That would be 535 pages of specifications on paper and matches the Thunderbolt 3 speeds right out of the chute and maybe more to come like we need it and that would be 40 Gigabits per second (or 5 Gigabytes per second which some confuse), plus USB4 has the compatibility component with no Intel tax.
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USB4
Sept 9, 2019 5:47:41 GMT -6
Post by Drew @ UA on Sept 9, 2019 5:47:41 GMT -6
TB has been license free for 2 years FYI.
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USB4
Sept 9, 2019 16:09:45 GMT -6
Post by hio on Sept 9, 2019 16:09:45 GMT -6
TB has been license free for 2 years FYI. So, and before that? Apple tried to pull a fast one with a patent and we would be paying the Gala and Braeburn tax or some stupid dongle if Intel hadn't pulled their weight, now owns the trademark, and offered it for free.
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USB4
Sept 10, 2019 17:17:48 GMT -6
Post by cyrano on Sept 10, 2019 17:17:48 GMT -6
There have never been license fees for Thunderbolt from Apple. Intel tried, but failed much in the same way as with USB 1.0.
Intel developed it and called it "light peak". It was intended to be optical, but cost cutting made Intel/Apple release TB1 in an electrical version.
Intel partnered with Apple to get market acceptance. Apple renamed it "Thunderbolt". Later on, Apple integrated TB (and a lot of other stuff) into USB-C. I'm not sure Intel liked that much.
The only thing in this thread with hefty license fees, is Dante. It costs 9k and an NDA just to read the docs, for starters...
AVB OTOH, is completely open. I just wish they'd finally get some specs out. These should be nearly complete for audio, but a lot of work needs to be done for video and integration. Since AVB uses standard (modern) ethernet, it's implementation is cheaper and equipment longevity is better. Besides, an ethernet chip is cheaper than a TB chip. Most computers with a gbit ethernet port can already run AVB. MacOS has had the AVB driver included in Core audio for years. Linux has had it for a long time. The one I hear nothing from, is Microsoft.
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USB4
Sept 11, 2019 11:43:32 GMT -6
via mobile
Post by javamad on Sept 11, 2019 11:43:32 GMT -6
TB has been license free for 2 years FYI. And yet there are so many devices with one single TB port .... totally invalidating the daisychainability ... Grrrr a pet peeve of mine!
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USB4
Sept 12, 2019 19:09:37 GMT -6
via mobile
Post by Quint on Sept 12, 2019 19:09:37 GMT -6
TB has been license free for 2 years FYI. And yet there are so many devices with one single TB port .... totally invalidating the daisychainability ... Grrrr a pet peeve of mine! Not the Apollo. I like that the Apollos have always had daisy chaining in mind.
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