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Post by Omicron9 on Jun 21, 2019 9:26:37 GMT -6
Greetings, RGOers...
Forgiveness if this Q has been previously asked; I did a search, but couldn't locate anything.
Regarding treatment companies, who do you like and why? I've narrowed it down to the three in the subject line, but leaning toward GIK. I have a friend with a mixing suite who swears by RealTraps, but I've heard so many mixed things about the company and the owner whose name I won't mention.
Thoughts? Suggestions? Experiences? Preferences? Muffin recipes?
Many thanks in advance,
-09
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Post by mdmitch2 on Jun 21, 2019 9:33:16 GMT -6
I like the GIK stuff a lot....it's been a while since I compared prices, but they had the best prices a few years back. I'm not sure there's a huge difference in performance between comparable products from the different brands, so for me it mostly came down to price. Also, GIK has top notch service and have continued to provide great advice years after I bought anything from them.
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Post by Omicron9 on Jun 21, 2019 9:37:36 GMT -6
Thanks, mdmitch2. I should have specified that pricing doesn't come into the equation; only efficacy and the company itself. Trying to go cheap on treatment kinda defeats the purpose. I keep hearing positive things about GIK, both products and company.
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Post by Tbone81 on Jun 21, 2019 9:44:33 GMT -6
I have both gik and realtraps. Most all of them purchased second hand. Both are great. Not sure I could tell a difference in sound, although for my ceiling cloud the realtraps did seem to perform better subjectively. Both owners are on the other site quite a bit and give lots of good advice to people. Gik panels look a little better imho and also, to some extent, they will make their products in custom sizes for you for a really reasonable price.
I don’t think there is a clear winner between the two, if you’re leaning towards gik go for it and don’t look back, you’ll be happy either way!
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Post by mdmitch2 on Jun 21, 2019 9:47:39 GMT -6
Thanks, mdmitch2. I should have specified that pricing doesn't come into the equation; only efficacy and the company itself. Trying to go cheap on treatment kinda defeats the purpose. I keep hearing positive things about GIK, both products and company. Once thing to consider is whether there is an air gap built into the back of the panel... not sure about the other brands, but GIK has an air gap, which improves performance versus a panel where the acoustic material sits flush against the wall. Another consideration is whether the sides of the panel are covered in fabric vs wood/metal. The GIK panels have fabric sides, so the absorption is uninhibited. |
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Post by Omicron9 on Jun 21, 2019 9:53:29 GMT -6
Fascinating. Thanks, gentlemen. Highly appreciated!
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Post by kcatthedog on Jun 21, 2019 10:25:43 GMT -6
Air gap is important but the panel can just be mounted off the wall and achieve the same increased absorption.
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Post by Tbone81 on Jun 21, 2019 11:14:44 GMT -6
For what it’s worth realtraps can be easily spaced off the wall about 4” with “U” shaped fence post brackets.
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Post by Tbone81 on Jun 21, 2019 11:18:22 GMT -6
Just looked up the chameleon traps from ready acoustics, I wasn’t familiar with the name but now I realize that own some of those as well! I like the chameleon traps as stand alone gobos because the front and back are identical as cosmetically appealing. And they can be easily stood up on their frames and moved around as baffles etc. however, for fixed installation I’d go realtraps or gik handsdown
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Post by johneppstein on Jun 21, 2019 11:21:59 GMT -6
Greetings, RGOers... Forgiveness if this Q has been previously asked; I did a search, but couldn't locate anything. Regarding treatment companies, who do you like and why? I've narrowed it down to the three in the subject line, but leaning toward GIK. I have a friend with a mixing suite who swears by RealTraps, but I've heard so many mixed things about the company and the owner whose name I won't mention. Thoughts? Suggestions? Experiences? Preferences? Muffin recipes? Many thanks in advance, -09 GIK for sure.
Stay away from Real Traps.
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Post by jamiesego on Jun 21, 2019 13:36:47 GMT -6
In my previous studio one of the partners emailed GIK with our control room dimensions and bought the panels they recommended. I thought it worked really well. It’s a really cheap compared to a dedicated build.
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Post by stormymondays on Jun 21, 2019 14:48:32 GMT -6
I have some custom GIK gobos, great stuff. I just had them make a shorter version of their folding vocal panel.
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Post by mcirish on Jun 21, 2019 15:02:05 GMT -6
I have a combo of GIK 2" and my own clones of the GIK but in 3"-6". I normally wouldn't do a clone thing of anyone's work, but I already owned a couple dozen panels of 703 (3") and I really didn't like the way they looked with burlap. So after getting nearly 100 GIK for work, I used their clever idea to make my own look good as well as perform well. I don't have any experience with the others but GIK was helpful, quick, not too expensive and most of all, it worked. I wish I had some of their 4" thick panels, but my clones are 6" and off the wall a bit, so it works out fairly well. The air gap between multi-layer panels and/or the wall is pretty important.
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Post by lando on Jun 21, 2019 16:43:50 GMT -6
GIK products are great. Also it’s a very respectable company with great service.
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Post by mitchkricun on Jun 21, 2019 17:25:59 GMT -6
I have both, but couldn’t tell you if one is better than the other. They are being used together. The Real Traps are aesthetically more finished looking and have better stands.
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Post by Omicron9 on Jun 22, 2019 8:34:10 GMT -6
To all responders: this is insanely helpful; thanks so much! Keep it coming, please.
-09
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Post by Omicron9 on Jun 22, 2019 8:35:09 GMT -6
Greetings, RGOers... Forgiveness if this Q has been previously asked; I did a search, but couldn't locate anything. Regarding treatment companies, who do you like and why? I've narrowed it down to the three in the subject line, but leaning toward GIK. I have a friend with a mixing suite who swears by RealTraps, but I've heard so many mixed things about the company and the owner whose name I won't mention. Thoughts? Suggestions? Experiences? Preferences? Muffin recipes? Many thanks in advance, -09 GIK for sure.
Stay away from Real Traps.
Thanks, johneppstein. I've heard that exact thing from more than one person, so I'll likely use GIK. -09 |
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Post by drsax on Jun 22, 2019 9:49:43 GMT -6
All GIK in my studio and been very happy with them
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Post by keymod on Jun 22, 2019 15:02:16 GMT -6
Greetings, RGOers... Forgiveness if this Q has been previously asked; I did a search, but couldn't locate anything. Regarding treatment companies, who do you like and why? I've narrowed it down to the three in the subject line, but leaning toward GIK. I have a friend with a mixing suite who swears by RealTraps, but I've heard so many mixed things about the company and the owner whose name I won't mention. Thoughts? Suggestions? Experiences? Preferences? Muffin recipes? Many thanks in advance, -09 GIK for sure.
Stay away from Real Traps.
Why the warning? |
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Post by johneppstein on Jun 22, 2019 15:10:19 GMT -6
GIK for sure.
Stay away from Real Traps.
Why the warning? Because Ethan is not a trustworthy person. There's a lot more to it, but I'd rather not go into it in public. Let's just say that I had to have my lawyer get on him and I'df rather not poke the hornet's nest. |
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Post by the other mark williams on Jun 22, 2019 22:58:31 GMT -6
I've got GIK panels and a RealTraps "Portable Vocal Booth." The GIK are great, IMO. The PVB is an interesting idea that theoretically resolves the other "reflection filter" type designs, but it is awkward AF to set up, so I rarely end up using it. At this point, I wish I hadn't bought it. I would've preferred one of their larger ones that stood up on legs, but they've been discontinued, as far as I can tell.
I plan to go with GIK from here on out.
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Post by yotonic on Jun 23, 2019 9:04:24 GMT -6
I have a combo of GIK 2" and my own clones of the GIK but in 3"-6". I normally wouldn't do a clone thing of anyone's work, but I already owned a couple dozen panels of 703 (3") and I really didn't like the way they looked with burlap. So after getting nearly 100 GIK for work, I used their clever idea to make my own look good as well as perform well. I don't have any experience with the others but GIK was helpful, quick, not too expensive and most of all, it worked. I wish I had some of their 4" thick panels, but my clones are 6" and off the wall a bit, so it works out fairly well. The air gap between multi-layer panels and/or the wall is pretty important. What's the clever idea you are referencing? I have used Guilford fabric on some 703 panels with spray mount as well as the more laborious wood frames, neither are a great solution. |
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Post by MorEQsThanAnswers on Jun 23, 2019 11:46:02 GMT -6
I would personally NEVER buy this stuff. You'd be surprised how easy it is to build these yourself. When I made my panels, I bought my insulation from here: www.buyinsulationproductstore.com/acoustic-panel-materials/It was the most affordable way **that i found** to get the "best" insulation for the job. This stuff is different than the pink fluffy you get at Home Depot. My fabric came from www.acoustimac.comAll you need is a staple gun and some 1x4 pieces of wood cut to the correct lengths. That said, these panels are very different from the carbon panels you might find from www.acousticfields.com. I'd call Dennis if you want some advice from a real magician. Also, check out the "Attack Wall" by ASC. That's on my "holy grail" list! Update: 3 years after this post, im proud to say I’m sitting in front of a row of ASC Tube Traps  |
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Post by MorEQsThanAnswers on Jun 23, 2019 11:55:07 GMT -6
Because Ethan is not a trustworthy person. There's a lot more to it, but I'd rather not go into it in public. Let's just say that I had to have my lawyer get on him and I'df rather not poke the hornet's nest. I've been curious about this too because Ethan always seemed to back his results up scientifically, but I never see good reviews when it comes to the forums. In fact, I more often see him getting into fights and deleting his account when I come across his posts. His "null test" seemed extremely legitimate from my perspective, but I'm willing to admit that I might have missed something. That said, $600 for a diffuser is f***ing absurd... |
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Post by johneppstein on Jun 23, 2019 12:42:05 GMT -6
Because Ethan is not a trustworthy person. There's a lot more to it, but I'd rather not go into it in public. Let's just say that I had to have my lawyer get on him and I'df rather not poke the hornet's nest. I've been curious about this too because Ethan always seemed to back his results up scientifically, but I never see good reviews when it comes to the forums. In fact, I more often see him getting into fights and deleting his account when I come across his posts. His "null test" seemed extremely legitimate from my perspective, but I'm willing to admit that I might have missed something. That said, $600 for a diffuser is f***ing absurd... He seems to back up his results scientifically, but he has been known to fake results to prove points that exist only in his head, so you can't trust anything he says unless you can find at least two other sources who are not connected to Ethan.
I know this through experience - I was involved in the notorious "converter experiment" that cemented the destruction of his reputation in professional circles. The one where he was caught faking evidence, admitted it when it became obvious that he couldn't lie or make excuses, then attempted to retract his admission, and finally ended up claiming that he did it deliberately in an attempt to make the experiment about "expectation bias" - without informing any of the other principals in the experiment.
You can't trust him. He has been proven to be willing to manipulate or alter data in order to support his preconceptions.
It would appear that null testing is a good methodology and can often be useful, but it has also been demonstrated that sometimes two files that null sometimes do sound different, so something's missing there.
There's also the matter that required a firmly worded letter from my lawyer to resolve, which is not directly related to the converter fiasco.
The price of diffusers is an unrelated matter, however the last time I looked Ethan's diffusers were rather simple designs that don't diffuse in 3 dimensions. I prefer "skyline" types (and custom designs that work on the same general principle) myself, but they're much more difficult to manufacture and, if made of wood, tend to be quite heavy.
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