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Post by mrholmes on Jun 8, 2019 4:37:13 GMT -6
Mh.
Its a tough decission given the fact if you mix your own song.
I know every word, every line in and out and tend to like vocal down more. Vocal down sounds more with the band together.
What is your expereince with it. My impression is in some modern songs the lead vocals are way too up front - for my taste. But I am kid of the 80s and 90s.
Any expereince opinion to find the right compromise?
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Post by theshea on Jun 8, 2019 5:05:10 GMT -6
i totally 100% agree with everything. its hard with my own stuff, normally its vocal down for me, although it gets a bit louder with my new songs. i guess thats down to beeing a bit more confident and secure about my vocals.
my method: turning down the volume until i can mostly only hear drums and vocals. than i walk around in the room listening to the whole song. sometimes ooening the door and listening from outside the corridor.
that helps me decide if a vocal has the right level.
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Post by wiz on Jun 8, 2019 10:33:01 GMT -6
Come in fresh in the morning.... start with the entire mix volume down and slowly turn it up, until you can just hear the mix, then adjust the kick snare and vocal till the three are right. It’s a good way of getting a basic level
Cheers
Wiz
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Post by chessparov on Jun 8, 2019 18:48:58 GMT -6
(IMHO) Whatever your intended audience might think, regarding placement of the lead vocal(s)...
I like what Bob O. has brought up, being the importance (or lack thereof) of arrangements. Particularly for voices and/or
instruments that tend to be less prominent, in a mix.
I'll be feeling that tonight, as I may sing a song (or two) live. With my Buddy, Francois Dean, who has a terrific acetylene
torch Tenor (think Stevie Wonder meets 70's Lenny Williams hybrid!). When we sing a well arranged...arrangement there's ample room for my (mellow but loud) Baritone to find its space. That kind of (Spinto) Tenor cuts through a loud band like a knife!
Chris
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Post by Vincent R. on Jun 8, 2019 19:03:37 GMT -6
I think it depends on the style of music. Mixing crooner style songs the vocal has to be big and up front. Opera can go either way, but generally I like the voice in the mix and only coming on top on the big notes. For more crossover stuff; Bocelli or Groban you wants something in between the big crooner vocal and the opera vocal. I’ve done rock mixes both ways. It’s all about the song and the vibe.
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Post by chessparov on Jun 8, 2019 19:30:18 GMT -6
Makes sense. Tame Impala's vocals are way....way back. But still very cool! Chris
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Post by svart on Jun 8, 2019 20:11:36 GMT -6
90% of people listening to music are listening to the lyrics and vocals first and foremost.
Vocals up.
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Post by hio on Jun 9, 2019 3:29:35 GMT -6
+1 Vocal up ^
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Post by M57 on Jun 9, 2019 4:34:37 GMT -6
DIY songwriter here.. I use to come down with acute vocal updownitis quite often, finding myself debilitated sometimes by the difference of a few tenths of a db, but over time I've come to find my sweet spot. Surprisingly, I've found it's pretty consistent regardless of the genre, and I consider that I explore a diversity of styles. I suppose some would call it vocal up, but I call it vocal just right.
Anyway, I'm thinking that though the genre is an important part of the decision, even more important is the voice itself. Where does it want to sit?
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Post by jakeboy on Jun 9, 2019 7:19:41 GMT -6
I struggle with this too....The Stones would sometimes layer Mick’s vocals down in and around the guitars. It worked for them, obviously.
But it seems to me in vocal music the vocal tells the story, conveys the message of the song, and should be heard clearly...but as in all music production, this cannot be a hard and fast rule. Whatever sounds good is good. I do like the suggestion Wiz gives above.
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Post by jeremygillespie on Jun 9, 2019 7:23:48 GMT -6
I mix the vocal where the artist and I agree it sounds the best and fits the mood of the song and genre. Then print a vocal up and a vocal down and send them all off to mastering. Sometimes my mastering engineer is doing something and she needs to have the vocal a bit louder or quieter, or needs to jump between them for certain sections. I leave that up to her.
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Post by Ward on Jun 9, 2019 8:09:14 GMT -6
My songs? Vocal down
My client's songs? Vocal up.
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Post by the other mark williams on Jun 9, 2019 11:45:28 GMT -6
These days, I tend toward vocal up, unless the genre or artist's vision points towards vocal down. Radiohead's The Bends is one of my favorite rock albums, and the vocal is pretty far back on that record at times. So sometimes, it just fits the artistic direction.
And if the client can't sing very well, it can sometimes make sense to bury the vocal and emphasize the guitars, synths, etc.
Of course, if they can't sing *or* play guitar, then it's going to be a fun experimental project. Been there.
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Post by Bob Olhsson on Jun 9, 2019 11:57:13 GMT -6
The higher a vocal can be without interrupting the rhythm, the better! Check out Aretha Franklin's Atlantic catalog.
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