ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
Posts: 14,961
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Post by ericn on Dec 11, 2018 19:13:35 GMT -6
As for position if you keep the driver diaphragms within one wave length of the freq 2 octaves above the crossover point it should sum with little problem . I start with the sub right under the near field. Thanks for your answer! Why is running the main monitors in full range and letting the sub add the missing low frequencies a bad idea? It can work, but here are the 4 problems with that type of setup. First unless you do a lot of measurements finding the true roll off of your Near fields is pretty inexact. With most speakers especially ported wood boxes you find a fair amount of sample to sample differences on the low end. Second The frequency extremes are where most speakers have the most distortion, add in the fact that many monitor manufacturers know a large number of their sales are based on spec sheet comparison getting a lower freq response, nobody said it was good sounding low end. Amajor reason for subs is lower this distortion. Third. The lower a Nearfield goes into the range of the sub the more they need to work together or against each other, filters or crossovers give us more control of this situation and we can for the most part keep the Near field working with instead of against the sub by rollling off the near field before we know it gets nasty. Lastly headroom and heat, the most power demanded by a speaker is at the low end by rolling off the near fields we have more power, also amps are dumb unless we put a filter in front of it the amp will be producing these big waves that the speaker can’t even reproduce. Amps get hot, and hotter with the more power they use, speakers don’t like heat in fact the hotter the motor of a speaker gets it starts to act like a compressor. This isn’t to say having a simple way to switch out the high pass on Near field isn’t a good idea, It’s great to give you that Booming car stereo prospective, it’s also nice to have the option of running the near fields full range to get an idea of what a smaller speaker sounds like. Since nobody makes a monitor controller that gives you these options with the ability to change filter settings, I have found a patch bay and a bunch of those inline filters a great way to be able to use a set of near fields and subs in all those configurations and also to add being able to sum the LF to mono and be able to intergrate these same options with a single set of subs and multiple sets of near fields/ mains. The tricky part is building attenuators to get all the levels to match.
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Post by aremos on Dec 11, 2018 19:19:56 GMT -6
Any thoughts for the newish Genelec 'The One' models? Cheers, Ross We had a demo at my studio with Genelec 8351's & I was blown away! Someone stated they have "the Genelec sound". I've been using 103x's for years & this is a totally new concept & sound. The software is fantastic & analyses the room. But these would be above the OP's budget. The Dutch & Dutch are the other speakers that are in this type of vein.
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Post by jeromemason on Dec 12, 2018 14:06:44 GMT -6
That's high praise, jeromemason . Out of curiosity, what subs are you running? I have a pair of passive radiator types from Seismic Audio that are modded. They're 2 10's and they sound really great. I'd highly suggest bypassing the ported speaker route if at all possible. If you're not going sealed try find passive radiator designs, they're honestly my favorite even over totally sealed these days.
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Post by peterhess on Dec 12, 2018 18:09:16 GMT -6
Thanks all for the insightful help! Thinking/saving. P
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Post by jeremygillespie on Dec 12, 2018 19:25:25 GMT -6
IMO, If your room is not situated and treated to have a sub, I personally feel like it’s a big mistake to get add them to your monitoring system.
Those dual woof Shape’s sounded really good at AES this year. If I had known they were that good I’d have given them a more serious listen before getting my Footprints. I’m still totally happy with what I have though.
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rigo
Full Member
Posts: 20
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Post by rigo on Dec 12, 2018 20:05:27 GMT -6
I bought a pair of Dynaudio LYD48's about a year ago, upgrading from a pair of Event 20/20's that I had been using for years, and they are kicking my ass and keeping me honest. They're a three-way design, quite compact and beautiful, and I am very happy with them. They are extremely detailed and revealing, and pack plenty of punch on the bottom end. They have been great for tracking (drums, bass, electric and acoustic guitars, violin), as they are always happy to let me know when I am not getting good enough sounds. It seems easier to hear when something is a bit off, and also easier to hear when it's right. I should say that I have not yet done any finished mixes on them, only roughs, as I am still tracking the two projects I am currently working on. But I have the sense that they will be very comfortable and reliable to mix on. The low end, in particular, seems quite consistent when I take rough mixes out of the studio and play them in the world. The Events, for all their strengths (and for all my familiarity with them), were difficult to trust on the low end. With the Dynaudios I can hear real separation and clarity in the kick and bass, with nothing muddy or generalized. And in my small studio they move a surprising amount of air. I bought them without having the opportunity to audition them anywhere, but I have to say I have taken to them very quickly. They are a clear step up from the Events, with better detail through the midrange, better punch on the bottom, and clearer (and more revealing) highs. They also present a wide and deep soundstage. So far their only annoying trait is that they constantly remind me that I need to work harder...
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Post by peterhess on Dec 13, 2018 8:09:17 GMT -6
Jeremy, yeah, while I’ve really enjoyed reading the discussion of sub setup here, I’m not going to go the sub route: dealing with getting a crossover correct is a level I can’t deal with, even if just for space, as instruments and people are coming in and out of my small room all the time. I’m thinking of going with Focals... saving for now. Thanks again to everyone for taking the time to help me think through! P
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Post by the other mark williams on Dec 13, 2018 10:46:24 GMT -6
Jeremy, yeah, while I’ve really enjoyed reading the discussion of sub setup here, I’m not going to go the sub route: dealing with getting a crossover correct is a level I can’t deal with, even if just for space, as instruments and people are coming in and out of my small room all the time. I’m thinking of going with Focals... saving for now. Thanks again to everyone for taking the time to help me think through! P totally legit, but I would like to mention that counterintuitively, I think it’s easier to set up with stereo subs than with a single.
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