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km84s
Jul 26, 2018 18:30:33 GMT -6
ericn likes this
Post by spindrift on Jul 26, 2018 18:30:33 GMT -6
Hey, how do you save a load of $$$ on a new microphone design for this new burgeoning market: Lose the expensive transformer, that's how!
KM84s in good condition are rare, but not that rare. They are an important enough tool in my arsenal to dish out some cash for. Think of those dud pieces of gear you have laying around, sell those suckers and get some great mics!
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ericn
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Balance Engineer
Posts: 14,971
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Post by ericn on Jul 26, 2018 19:29:42 GMT -6
Hey, how do you save a load of $$$ on a new microphone design for this new burgeoning market: Lose the expensive transformer, that's how! KM84s in good condition are rare, but not that rare. They are an important enough tool in my arsenal to dish out some cash for. Think of those dud pieces of gear you have laying around, sell those suckers and get some great mics! Even cheaper you buy the same piece of crap from the same OEM as everybody else and put the R &D money into advertising.
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km84s
Jul 26, 2018 20:30:13 GMT -6
Post by johneppstein on Jul 26, 2018 20:30:13 GMT -6
What's the off-axis like? I can’t say that I have experimented with this much. Mine have been used primarily on acoustic guitar and occasionally overheads. Since I got my KM84s, I haven’t used my Beyers as much, but I did do some head to head comparisons on acoustics and found them to compare favorably. Close miced or miced at a moderate distance (2-3 feet)?
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km84s
Jul 26, 2018 20:43:05 GMT -6
Post by EmRR on Jul 26, 2018 20:43:05 GMT -6
Again, KM140's. Definitely not budget, more the actual next model after the 84 than the 184. Same response as the 184. No, there's not a flat cardioid SDC in the Neumann line, not since the 84 I don't think. There's a flat omni, and I never ever see it show up on the used market.
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km84s
Jul 26, 2018 21:26:52 GMT -6
Post by spindrift on Jul 26, 2018 21:26:52 GMT -6
I've read the 184s are a little quieter in the mic amp stage than the 140s, but the 140s sound just a touch sweeter to me.
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Post by rowmat on Jul 26, 2018 21:36:41 GMT -6
Hey, how do you save a load of $$$ on a new microphone design for this new burgeoning market: Lose the expensive transformer, that's how! KM84s in good condition are rare, but not that rare. They are an important enough tool in my arsenal to dish out some cash for. Think of those dud pieces of gear you have laying around, sell those suckers and get some great mics! You'll often find KM85's (with a reduced bass response capsule) in much better average condition than most KM84's. They also are typically 20-40% cheaper than KM84's. I purchased three KM85's all in excellent condition and fitted them with KK84 capsules. I managed to find one very good used capsule on eBay and the other pair of capsules I purchased new from Sennheiser Australia.
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km84s
Jul 26, 2018 22:07:48 GMT -6
ericn likes this
Post by spindrift on Jul 26, 2018 22:07:48 GMT -6
Hey, how do you save a load of $$$ on a new microphone design for this new burgeoning market: Lose the expensive transformer, that's how! KM84s in good condition are rare, but not that rare. They are an important enough tool in my arsenal to dish out some cash for. Think of those dud pieces of gear you have laying around, sell those suckers and get some great mics! You'll often find KM85's (with a reduced bass response capsule) in much better average condition than most KM84's. They also are typically 20-40% cheaper than KM84's. I purchased three KM85's all in excellent condition and fitted them with KK84 capsules. I managed to find one very good used capsule on eBay and the other pair of capsules I purchased new from Sennheiser Australia. Exactly, I found a mint pair of KM83s on Fleabay and bought them. Ordered 2 KK84 capsules from Sennheiser, now I have an omni (83) or cardioid (84) KMi set! I would like to track down one KK85 though at some point.
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km84s
Jul 26, 2018 22:34:42 GMT -6
Post by rowmat on Jul 26, 2018 22:34:42 GMT -6
You'll often find KM85's (with a reduced bass response capsule) in much better average condition than most KM84's. They also are typically 20-40% cheaper than KM84's. I purchased three KM85's all in excellent condition and fitted them with KK84 capsules. I managed to find one very good used capsule on eBay and the other pair of capsules I purchased new from Sennheiser Australia. Exactly, I found a mint pair of KM83s on Fleabay and bought them. Ordered 2 KK84 capsules from Sennheiser, now I have an omni (83) or cardioid (84) KMi set! I would like to track down one KK85 though at some point. I still have three KK85 capsules. You wouldn't happen to have a spare KK83 you would be prepared to trade for a KK85 would you? The KK85 capsules are actually very useful on things like high hats when you typically don't require a lot of low end and also for close micing acoustic instruments if a number of players are close to each other and you need to close mic to reduce bleed but want to avoid excessive proximity effect.
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km84s
Jul 26, 2018 23:18:56 GMT -6
Post by spindrift on Jul 26, 2018 23:18:56 GMT -6
Hmmmm, I'll PM you tomorrow rowmat ....
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km84s
Jul 27, 2018 0:56:36 GMT -6
Post by Deleted on Jul 27, 2018 0:56:36 GMT -6
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km84s
Jul 27, 2018 1:13:01 GMT -6
Post by Deleted on Jul 27, 2018 1:13:01 GMT -6
Sorry for slightly OT, but how does an AKG C60 tube SDC mic sound in comparison for acoustic guitar? Apparently that's what they used on Crosby's "If I Could Only Remember My Name" album, which is probably my fave acoustic sound of all time.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 27, 2018 2:53:17 GMT -6
Is there any difference (other than the colour) between silver and black KM84s? I've found a dude in Belgium with nine for sale at $840 each, with discounts for more than two. Thinking of getting a consecutive serial number pair if he has them, plus an extra to flip later. In your view, do you ever need a pair on acoustic, or is just one fine?
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km84s
Jul 27, 2018 3:01:12 GMT -6
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ericn likes this
Post by rowmat on Jul 27, 2018 3:01:12 GMT -6
Sorry for slightly OT, but how does an AKG C60 tube SDC mic sound in comparison for acoustic guitar? Apparently that's what they used on Crosby's "If I Could Only Remember My Name" album, which is probably my fave acoustic sound of all time. I could probably tell you in a couple of weeks because I have an AKG C60 (AC701K tube) but have never done a direct comparison since I've owned the KM84's. I need to first replace the cable which connects the mic to the power supply. The power supply also houses the output transformer.
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km84s
Jul 27, 2018 5:32:05 GMT -6
ericn likes this
Post by Deleted on Jul 27, 2018 5:32:05 GMT -6
Just like the ART vs. GR thread, it has to be one the best threads of all time.! Hilarity personified.!
I've said it before and I'll probably say it again - I don't like "shootouts". I find them generally uninformative and often downright misleading - although sometimes entertaining.
Sorry to go OT here but:
Over here many a time you have little else to go on, sadly the last local pro audio shop has shut down.. Now there's nothing for 200 miles, sure there's other options like KMR who have a wide selection to try and a demo facility but they are at the other side of the country. Plus it's ideal to test out equipment in your own chain, so it's a bummer really..
Distributors now generally put in requests on order (which defeats the point surely?), there are some companies with cracking returns policies like Thomman or Bax, but Thomann take around six days to deliver and it would take about three weeks to arrange a refund / replacement.. Imagine doing that with 20 mic's?
Bax offer a 90 day return but are limited in what pro audio they stock, still takes a long time to process as well. Also Thomann (the largest european retailer) has heavily stripped it's stock, a lot of brands aren't sold anymore but then again so has a lot of smaller retailers too.
Welcome to the new world, pro audio is for all intents and purposes dead.!
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km84s
Jul 27, 2018 7:02:31 GMT -6
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Post by bradd on Jul 27, 2018 7:02:31 GMT -6
I can’t say that I have experimented with this much. Mine have been used primarily on acoustic guitar and occasionally overheads. Since I got my KM84s, I haven’t used my Beyers as much, but I did do some head to head comparisons on acoustics and found them to compare favorably. Close miced or miced at a moderate distance (2-3 feet)? Approximately 18 inches.
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Post by Ward on Jul 27, 2018 7:49:03 GMT -6
The brighter KM 184 would have been more useful in the last days of analog tape, the 80s to later 90s. The milder and more natural KM84 out of production but more useful than ever in the digital age!! Fair enough Martin John Butler, my friend?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 27, 2018 9:26:40 GMT -6
Is there any difference (other than the colour) between silver and black KM84s? I've found a dude in Belgium with nine for sale at $840 each, with discounts for more than two. Thinking of getting a consecutive serial number pair if he has them, plus an extra to flip later. In your view, do you ever need a pair on acoustic, or is just one fine? Dude has 6 left, no consecutive serial numbers, so thinking of just getting one. That's a great price, even in the EU, for a great condition one, right? Will ask for more photos and deets of history then will probably take the plunge.
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Post by drbill on Jul 27, 2018 9:43:24 GMT -6
If the mic(s) are in good shape, and not beat, it's hard to imagine you could go wrong. One wonders why he's selling them so far below market value though....
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km84s
Jul 27, 2018 9:43:45 GMT -6
Post by spindrift on Jul 27, 2018 9:43:45 GMT -6
Get two, they will likely match very nicely and you will never regret it! That is a great price for 84s in good condition.
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km84s
Jul 27, 2018 10:01:03 GMT -6
Post by Deleted on Jul 27, 2018 10:01:03 GMT -6
Been keeping an eye on the second hand ones in France and the EU over the last year, they do seem to be priced a fair bit cheaper than those I see listed on English speaking sites/forums/eBay/Reverb etc. Reverb seems crazy, asking £1000 a piece etc. Kinda makes me think of buying all six and flipping four of them, but I'm not that mercenary/flush at the mo. He told me €1400 for a pair (just over $1630 at current exchange rate). Waiting to hear back with more photos, and info on history, age, condition etc. They are listed as black ones in impeccable condition, but there is only one low-res photo of one of them...
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km84s
Jul 27, 2018 10:09:20 GMT -6
Post by spindrift on Jul 27, 2018 10:09:20 GMT -6
The nice thing about buying through a Reverb type operation is that there is some buyer protection built in...but you do pay for it. I don't buy used mics without an understanding that there is a short evaluation period to ensure the tube is quiet and everything is good to go with the mic. No tube in a KM84 obviously but you should should be able to play with it for a couple hours to make sure it is in proper working order. For the money you could save, it might be worth a quick flight to the seller's city to check them out in person to avoid any "pitfalls". Good luck!
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Post by Deleted on Jul 27, 2018 10:12:40 GMT -6
Yes, he says you can try them out in his studio, and he's only in Belgium so would be a couple of hours by train.
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km84s
Jul 27, 2018 10:42:22 GMT -6
Post by spindrift on Jul 27, 2018 10:42:22 GMT -6
Don't be talking to me if you're on the fence about buying nice mics LOL! I can't get enuf of them...such fascinating little devices.
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Post by drbill on Jul 27, 2018 10:51:33 GMT -6
Go there, listen to them there, buy all of em if they are working. Then listen again back at your own studio and keep the 2 best. Then sell the rest at market value and essentially you'd get two for the price of 1.
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km84s
Jul 27, 2018 11:15:08 GMT -6
Post by Blackdawg on Jul 27, 2018 11:15:08 GMT -6
*COUGH*DPA4006*COUGH*
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