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Post by lolo on Jun 16, 2014 9:40:58 GMT -6
This looks really nice! Compared to the MCone, I like that it's balanced, the stepped volume control is standard, and the sealed mechanical relays. I wonder how good the internal DA is? This doesn't work for me because of the form factor, I just don't have that much space on my desk. The Dangerous Source or the Drawmer MC2.1 fit nicely between and under my PC monitors. Still, I would love to hear user comparison between this and the other high-quality monitor controllers. LesC, did you end up getting a Drawmer MC?
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Post by lolo on Jun 16, 2014 9:42:15 GMT -6
Not sure, think he started offering it when people starting asking for it
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Post by svart on Jun 16, 2014 10:53:13 GMT -6
So can someone explain to me why I would want one of these? I have digital and analog outs on my soundcard, the digital goes to the JBL monitors, and the analog goes to an amp and then to a switch and to two sets of analog speakers. I can just enable/disable the analog or digital signals and control their volumes right in windows audio control panel... No expensive controllers needed..
Am I missing something?
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Post by btreim on Jun 16, 2014 11:31:43 GMT -6
So can someone explain to me why I would want one of these? I have digital and analog outs on my soundcard, the digital goes to the JBL monitors, and the analog goes to an amp and then to a switch and to two sets of analog speakers. I can just enable/disable the analog or digital signals and control their volumes right in windows audio control panel... No expensive controllers needed.. Am I missing something? Well it would seem that if you're happy using your computer to make your monitoring volume adjustments then the McOne probably wouldn't serve much of a purpose to you. Having a nice big knob that I can grab to make volume adjustments and flip into mono quickly is very handy for me. Not to mention, I don't have a fancy interface that gives me volume adjustments on my outputs ITB.
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Post by svart on Jun 16, 2014 11:45:45 GMT -6
So can someone explain to me why I would want one of these? I have digital and analog outs on my soundcard, the digital goes to the JBL monitors, and the analog goes to an amp and then to a switch and to two sets of analog speakers. I can just enable/disable the analog or digital signals and control their volumes right in windows audio control panel... No expensive controllers needed.. Am I missing something? Well it would seem that if you're happy using your computer to make your monitoring volume adjustments then the McOne probably wouldn't serve much of a purpose to you. Having a nice big knob that I can grab to make volume adjustments and flip into mono quickly is very handy for me. Not to mention, I don't have a fancy interface that gives me volume adjustments on my outputs ITB. I don't really do much changing. I just move my faders on my mixer's master output and watch my inputs to the soundcard. I have the monitors preset for around 80db volume at around -12RMS input to the soundcard, so as I hit my optimal input range, my monitors are at their optimal listening range.. Isn't that what everyone else does?
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Post by btreim on Jun 16, 2014 12:31:58 GMT -6
Well it would seem that if you're happy using your computer to make your monitoring volume adjustments then the McOne probably wouldn't serve much of a purpose to you. Having a nice big knob that I can grab to make volume adjustments and flip into mono quickly is very handy for me. Not to mention, I don't have a fancy interface that gives me volume adjustments on my outputs ITB. I don't really do much changing. I just move my faders on my mixer's master output and watch my inputs to the soundcard. I have the monitors preset for around 80db volume at around -12RMS input to the soundcard, so as I hit my optimal input range, my monitors are at their optimal listening range.. Isn't that what everyone else does? I definitely make use of/need a monitor control between my 2192 and amps. But it sounds like you've got your system worked out and unless you're going for something like the McTwo that has other features on board you could easily stay away from the McOne.
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Post by LesC on Jun 16, 2014 13:59:13 GMT -6
LesC, did you end up getting a Drawmer MC?
Hi Laurence, sorry, I still haven't changed from the Dangerous Source. I've made my monitoring a bit more complex with the addition of an SVS SB-2000 sub (I know most on here hate subs, other than sandwiches, no need to berate me). I love the sub, and I've set it up so that with the Source I can switch between the Rocks full-range with no sub, and the Rocks high-passed via the sub's output. This is a similar setup to how the Focal Sub6 is typically used, but much less expensive and still very high quality. I'll also be adding a preamp, having trouble deciding between the Heritage DMA-73 and the Great River MP-2NV, both have fans on this site. I'll never be able to get enough room treatment in here, so I'll also be getting either a DSpeaker Anti-Mode 2.0 Dual Core or a MiniDSP Dirac box, which are kind of like 1KMultimedia ARC system on steroids. I'll also be either replacing my RME UFX with a Lynx Hilo, or just adding the Hilo. Once I figure that out, I'll know if I need the Source's DA. If not, then I would replace the Source with the Drawmer MC2.1. This process will take several months. I'm going to trade some stuff to get the Lynx Hilo, and see if that would be sufficient in conjunction with my Burl B2 ADC. If so, I'll trade the UFX for one of the preamps. Etc, etc, etc. A lot for me to think about, and keeping me busy along with my teaching full-time at two separate colleges, so everything music-wise is going a lot slower than I had hoped.
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Post by lolo on Jun 19, 2014 9:45:56 GMT -6
LesC, did you end up getting a Drawmer MC?
Hi Laurence, sorry, I still haven't changed from the Dangerous Source. I've made my monitoring a bit more complex with the addition of an SVS SB-2000 sub (I know most on here hate subs, other than sandwiches, no need to berate me). I love the sub, and I've set it up so that with the Source I can switch between the Rocks full-range with no sub, and the Rocks high-passed via the sub's output. This is a similar setup to how the Focal Sub6 is typically used, but much less expensive and still very high quality. I'll also be adding a preamp, having trouble deciding between the Heritage DMA-73 and the Great River MP-2NV, both have fans on this site. I'll never be able to get enough room treatment in here, so I'll also be getting either a DSpeaker Anti-Mode 2.0 Dual Core or a MiniDSP Dirac box, which are kind of like 1KMultimedia ARC system on steroids. I'll also be either replacing my RME UFX with a Lynx Hilo, or just adding the Hilo. Once I figure that out, I'll know if I need the Source's DA. If not, then I would replace the Source with the Drawmer MC2.1. This process will take several months. I'm going to trade some stuff to get the Lynx Hilo, and see if that would be sufficient in conjunction with my Burl B2 ADC. If so, I'll trade the UFX for one of the preamps. Etc, etc, etc. A lot for me to think about, and keeping me busy along with my teaching full-time at two separate colleges, so everything music-wise is going a lot slower than I had hoped. Yeah im also making some changes and will have to let the source go. Might grab the Drawmer.
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Post by mulmany on Jun 19, 2014 20:10:15 GMT -6
So can someone explain to me why I would want one of these? I have digital and analog outs on my soundcard, the digital goes to the JBL monitors, and the analog goes to an amp and then to a switch and to two sets of analog speakers. I can just enable/disable the analog or digital signals and control their volumes right in windows audio control panel... No expensive controllers needed.. Am I missing something? For me, it provides 3 Speaker outs (only use 2 right now), mono fold down, alternate inputs, and a non digital (no truncation) volume control.
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Post by LesC on Aug 5, 2014 15:48:28 GMT -6
Hi Laurence, sorry, I still haven't changed from the Dangerous Source. I've made my monitoring a bit more complex with the addition of an SVS SB-2000 sub (I know most on here hate subs, other than sandwiches, no need to berate me). I love the sub, and I've set it up so that with the Source I can switch between the Rocks full-range with no sub, and the Rocks high-passed via the sub's output. This is a similar setup to how the Focal Sub6 is typically used, but much less expensive and still very high quality. I'll also be adding a preamp, having trouble deciding between the Heritage DMA-73 and the Great River MP-2NV, both have fans on this site. I'll never be able to get enough room treatment in here, so I'll also be getting either a DSpeaker Anti-Mode 2.0 Dual Core or a MiniDSP Dirac box, which are kind of like 1KMultimedia ARC system on steroids. I'll also be either replacing my RME UFX with a Lynx Hilo, or just adding the Hilo. Once I figure that out, I'll know if I need the Source's DA. If not, then I would replace the Source with the Drawmer MC2.1. This process will take several months. I'm going to trade some stuff to get the Lynx Hilo, and see if that would be sufficient in conjunction with my Burl B2 ADC. If so, I'll trade the UFX for one of the preamps. Etc, etc, etc. A lot for me to think about, and keeping me busy along with my teaching full-time at two separate colleges, so everything music-wise is going a lot slower than I had hoped. Yeah im also making some changes and will have to let the source go. Might grab the Drawmer. Hi Laurence. I was re-reading this thread, and I'm a bit confused (not unusual for me). You have the McOne and the Source, but you're thinking of grabbing the Drawmer. Is there a problem with the McOne? I'm asking because I'm possibly interested in the McTwo instead of adding the Drawmer MC2.1 to my Source.
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Post by LesC on Aug 5, 2014 15:59:34 GMT -6
The McTwo's rack-mount main unit is quite different from the one shown on ZenPro's site and the one shown in the first post in this thread. The old pictures show a 2-unit size, whereas the new one is 1-unit and quite a bit nicer IMO. Here is what the unit looks like now: Also, the control unit size is quite different than what's shown on ZenPro's site. ZenPro shows: 2.5(W) X 2.3(H) X 4.0(D) inches NOS shows: 12.5(W) X 3.5(H) X 9.0(D) inches
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Post by LesC on Aug 5, 2014 16:07:14 GMT -6
Has anyone heard a comparison of the McTwo's DAC compared to the Dangerous DACs?
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Post by lolo on Aug 5, 2014 23:54:52 GMT -6
Yeah im also making some changes and will have to let the source go. Might grab the Drawmer. Hi Laurence. I was re-reading this thread, and I'm a bit confused (not unusual for me). You have the McOne and the Source, but you're thinking of grabbing the Drawmer. Is there a problem with the McOne? I'm asking because I'm possibly interested in the McTwo instead of adding the Drawmer MC2.1 to my Source. Hi Mate,I actually was considering selling the Mcone and the source at that stage. So I ended up selling the Mcone and is just Monitoring through the Source. with No mono unfortunately. I might be fooling myself. but monitoring just through the source is better for me. Its as if the Mcone degraded the sound. Yeah, seem strange. maybe just me.
Ordered a RM Supebeast. still waiting for it. was considering still selling the Source and grabbing a Drawner but I changed my mind. Going to keep the source and use it in conjunction with the Superbeast. will be good to compare the D/A conversion.
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Post by LesC on Aug 6, 2014 13:28:36 GMT -6
Thanks for the info. I've always avoided passive monitor controllers because of potential impedance mismatches.
I'm really looking forward to your comparison of the Superbeast and the Source's DAC.
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Post by mulmany on Aug 6, 2014 22:33:12 GMT -6
I don't have any complaints here. MCOne has been great, no issues. If there is a degradation in sound quality I can't hear any. I am using a RM superbeast.
Maybe the source did not like the passive load on its output? Seem strange though.
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Post by LesC on Jul 14, 2015 12:39:51 GMT -6
Hi Mate,I actually was considering selling the Mcone and the source at that stage. So I ended up selling the Mcone and is just Monitoring through the Source. with No mono unfortunately. I might be fooling myself. but monitoring just through the source is better for me. Its as if the Mcone degraded the sound. Yeah, seem strange. maybe just me.
Ordered a RM Supebeast. still waiting for it. was considering still selling the Source and grabbing a Drawner but I changed my mind. Going to keep the source and use it in conjunction with the Superbeast. will be good to compare the D/A conversion.
Hi lolo, did you get a chance to compare the Dangerous Source and the Superbeast D/A conversion? Sorry if you did that in another thread, please let me know.
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Post by Johnkenn on Jul 14, 2015 22:42:26 GMT -6
Dan, where you been lolo? We haven't been hanging out in the same threads lol. Win a compressor and you disappear lol
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Post by lolo on Jul 15, 2015 6:25:09 GMT -6
Hi Mate,I actually was considering selling the Mcone and the source at that stage. So I ended up selling the Mcone and is just Monitoring through the Source. with No mono unfortunately. I might be fooling myself. but monitoring just through the source is better for me. Its as if the Mcone degraded the sound. Yeah, seem strange. maybe just me.
Ordered a RM Supebeast. still waiting for it. was considering still selling the Source and grabbing a Drawner but I changed my mind. Going to keep the source and use it in conjunction with the Superbeast. will be good to compare the D/A conversion.
Hi lolo, did you get a chance to compare the Dangerous Source and the Superbeast D/A conversion? Sorry if you did that in another thread, please let me know. Hi Les, Did briefly, until one of the channels in the superbeast started scratching. Used it for a couple of days basically. It sounded great, but yeah.... wasnt too happy. Didnt have a real chance to compare side by side. What I heard of the supebeast was impressive Source is just solid. Will prob keep it for quite some time. Great box. if it just had a mono switch.... Send Ross a email because I wasnt happy, esp after waiting almost a year. He said he will send me a brand new superbeast 2 at no charge. Will be good to finally compare the source and the superbeast then side by side. Will let you know
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Post by lolo on Jul 15, 2015 6:31:02 GMT -6
Dan, where you been lolo? We haven't been hanging out in the same threads lol. Win a compressor and you disappear lol Still here JK , Always quickly checking in to see whats happening. Almost Daily... Day job has just been CRAZY CRAZY!! and then trying to still get some recording time and writing time (not alot of it though), hoping to get a cut soon Loving the FC526... will soon have to grab another.
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Post by swurveman on Jul 15, 2015 16:46:50 GMT -6
Not exactly. There may be shitty and worn out passive controllers, and normal ones, i guess... Sorry if this is a hijack, If so, please delete: If you have the time an inclination to answer Martin, where and why does the Presonous Central Station fall in the (a) shit, (b) worn out and ( c) normal ones passive controller spectrum? This is one of the hardest things I've had to wrap my head around-this concept of passive controllers not coloring sound and giving the true source- similar to the Roll Music Fulcrum passive concept. I understand its all about the quality of the passive circuit, but I don't understand what makes a great passive circuit and how/why it can compete with much more expensive monittor controllers with class A electronics a a stepped attenuator . I've read it comes down to cable length from the passive controller to the powered speaker, and too long of a cable brings about impedance issues that effect the sound. Nobody talks about that with the Fulcrom, but it seems to be a big deal with monitor controllers. For what it's worth, my cable length to my Adams A7X's from my CS is at its longest point around 5 feet, as my CS main unit is attached to my desk and sits an arms length away from my listening position .
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Post by Deleted on Jul 15, 2015 18:29:31 GMT -6
Essentially, a passive monitor controller is an attenuator with resistors and that's it. "Shitty" can relate to the overall quality of connectors and switches. Mechanic connections are a weak point in a signal chain. Also internal cabling and solder joints etc. "Worn out" is just this. Even well manufactured passive controllers can become flakey, if mechanics wear out. If the controller even uses potentiometers instead of rotary switches, things are even worse. These can lose stereo tracking, increase noise and really degrade the signal quality. Also, one must be aware, that not every stepped control is a rotary switch, but can be a potentiometer, which is by far inferior. "Normal" means, that the controller just does what it is supposed to do. Attenuate cleanly. In the beginning, most passive controllers do this nicely, then many degrade, see above, sooner or later. The later, the better. Why can they compete with more expensive active designs? Well, if the source is able to drive the attenuated line up to the amp, you have nothing but a resistive attenuation, and this is as clean as it gets. Active designs normally imply some kind of coloring, that is noticable, i.e. the 'sound' of the opamps. Therefore expensive active designs like SPL or others use quite high quality buffering opamps. For short cable runs, passive controllers are as good as it gets.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 15, 2015 18:40:10 GMT -6
Oh, and for the question about the presonus - i never had one in hand, so i can not say in which category it falls. For my personal situation, the NOS passive controller is all what it takes, and it does this clean, usable and without any issues for a long while, it is a rotary switched one, not the potentiometer version. We had several SMPros, which were "o.k." in the beginning, but in the long run cannot compete against a well made rotary switched controller.
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Jul 15, 2015 18:46:57 GMT -6
The Central station without the remote is oK sounding but falls victim to its price point build with the remote it sounds like ass! Honestly if you like the sound of your AD and don't need talkback or speaker switching a good ADC/Switchcraft/Moss & Mitchell ect. Patchbay and a simple well built Passive attenuators is the way to go!
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Post by swurveman on Jul 17, 2015 8:18:58 GMT -6
The Central station without the remote is oK sounding but falls victim to its price point build with the remote it sounds like ass! Honestly if you like the sound of your AD and don't need talkback or speaker switching a good ADC/Switchcraft/Moss & Mitchell ect. Patchbay and a simple well built Passive attenuators is the way to go! If you don't mind me asking Eric, what does the remote do to change the sound of the CS?
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Jul 17, 2015 9:10:18 GMT -6
The Central station without the remote is oK sounding but falls victim to its price point build with the remote it sounds like ass! Honestly if you like the sound of your AD and don't need talkback or speaker switching a good ADC/Switchcraft/Moss & Mitchell ect. Patchbay and a simple well built Passive attenuators is the way to go! If you don't mind me asking Eric, what does the remote do to change the sound of the CS? In theory it shouldn't do anything because it just adds longer cable, Sonic wise it completely muddies up everything I had a central station when I tried going OTB years ago the Central Station wasn't bad at first Plugged in a demo Remote and it felt like I needed sonic Drano unplugged it back to acceptable , plugged it back in and everything shrunk and top end disappeared plus a grungy quality , tried another Remote same thing !
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