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Post by Johnkenn on Dec 19, 2017 13:43:48 GMT -6
Haven't posted here very much, but this thread caught my attention. I was just on the other end of this. I purchased a quad satellite off of Craigslist last week that came with a bunch of plugins. I got out of the UAD thing a few years ago, but I miss some of the plugins and honestly could use the dsp, I just didn't want to have to rebuy a bunch of plugs I used to own. Anyway, found a good deal for a quad with a lot of the plugs I wanted only to find the seller had transferred too many times, and they denied the transfer. Somehow after 2 day's of phone calls, the seller got them to go through with the transfer. Even after UA sent an email to me and said it would not happen. Personally, being that you can't run the plugins without a card, I think the policy is dumb. Even if they loose out on a used sale, at some point the new owner is going to buy more plugins. Or, at least charge a minimal fee for the transaction, and do away with the limit. Wow
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Post by indiehouse on Dec 19, 2017 15:21:15 GMT -6
How do you even know how many transfers you have left?
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Post by Johnkenn on Dec 19, 2017 15:33:09 GMT -6
You can call the Einsatzgruppen er...support and ask I guess. They told me I had 15. So, 15 in 15 years.
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Post by Martin John Butler on Dec 19, 2017 16:32:51 GMT -6
Well Chuck, I think most people buying a used Apollo fully expect to buy a few pug-ins at some point.
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Post by dandeurloo on Dec 19, 2017 16:51:33 GMT -6
I can't get down with UAD any more. I have thou$and$ into plugs and DSP. After they raised almost all new plugs to 300 usd I bailed on buying new plugs from them. I have always known of the issues trying to resell their plugs and honestly most of their plugs have better native options these days. I haven't tried a number of the new plugs because like I said, they aren't getting my money anymore.
I hate being locked into a company and then the company dictating to me what I can do with my purchases. I have that with Avid and I don't need another Avid in my life.
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Post by NoFilterChuck on Dec 19, 2017 17:07:07 GMT -6
Nope you need a fresh AUTH file from the UAD account. you're wrong. They ditched the downloading of the Auth file manually a long time ago. now you just click the Authorize Plugins button in the UAD Meter and Control Panel app.
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Post by drsax on Dec 19, 2017 17:07:24 GMT -6
So, there is a published transfer limit: from UA forum: help.uaudio.com/hc/en-us/art...Apollo-Devices"Important Note on UAD device transfer limits: The maximum UAD hardware one system can accommodate is six UAD devices. To prevent the fraudulent sale/misuse of UAD products, Universal Audio limits the UAD hardware transfer quantity out of one account to five UAD devices." I do understand that there are people who constantly try to scam the UA system, but I think UA needs to look at how its policies create that frustration ? This is pretty unfortunate. I am a bigtime UAD User and have 6 units. Like Johnkenn I have bought and sold many UAD products over the years. I sell and then upgrade to more recent versions. If UA keeps this limit in place, it will spell the end of UAD for me after my current rig needs updating. It’s a shame as I just added two Apollo 16’s and a Twin to my rig. They need to get this straightened out. For those of us who are full time engineers and who constantly upgrade our systems, this is completely unacceptable, regardless of said policy. Since their plugs only work with their hardware, this limit is unreasonable. It will cost them far more in lost customers than they will make in new sales.
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Post by NoFilterChuck on Dec 19, 2017 17:21:02 GMT -6
I'd bet that they are relying on the hundreds of new Apollo Twin customers these days over folks that need Apollo 16s or whatever. Apogee went the same route, looking for customers who only need to spend under $1000.
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Post by kcatthedog on Dec 19, 2017 17:36:35 GMT -6
An interesting post from Beechwood at ua forum:
"I wrote to CS in Dec '15 about this. Back then it was a limit of 5 transfers out of an account (not sure if it's changed). The response back then:
"This limit is to help us monitor people who abuse the transfer process - if you have a legitimate need to make another transfer, let us know so we can look into your request and accommodate you."
I would guess the situation is still the same? If not, of course it becomes vastly harder to buy more UAD products. You would really think that as time passes you would earn the right to make more transfers."
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Post by mrholmes on Dec 19, 2017 18:03:44 GMT -6
Nope you need a fresh AUTH file from the UAD account. you're wrong. They ditched the downloading of the Auth file manually a long time ago. now you just click the Authorize Plugins button in the UAD Meter and Control Panel app. See I forgot about this fact in just a few months. Who cares I am out of the UAD thing... Writeing music till the 23th and than home for christmas.
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Post by donr on Dec 19, 2017 18:24:35 GMT -6
Here's what I don't understand.
Say you've got an Apollo 8 and a bunch of plugs. You want to sell the Apollo, but you buy a T-bolt Octo for the plugs you bought, 'cause you still like them.
You sell the Apollo, unlink it to your account, and it should become an Apollo with the basic set of legacy plugs that the new owner could/would buy more to improve.
Meanwhile, you have retained your licenses and maybe you buy the next gen Apollo at some point and use the plugs there too.
OTOH, you could sell the Apollo with all your plug-ins. I could see why UAD wouldn't want boatloads of used plug-ins out there and would set a limit to the number of times the plug-ins could convey, with or without the hardware, but you are not forced to sell the plug-ins when you sell the hardware are you?
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Post by kcatthedog on Dec 19, 2017 18:45:33 GMT -6
the plot thickens from ua forum:
"I believe there are people abusing the system which has caused UA to look more closely at the accounts of users. My guess is some users with a fair amount of plugs are allowing others to add their devices to their accounts, thereby authorizing plugs, and then transferring back. Once transferred back the person has access to all of the plugs as long as they do not update the authorizations. Remember, the authorizations are tied to the device. There is no way for UA to police this activity. Users can just keep transferring back and forth as many times as they want. I can see why UA would institute a policy to discourage this activity. However, I don't think this policy will impact "honest" users because UA can clearly see how often transfers occur in a user's account and they have already stated that they will honor transfers beyond the stated limit if you contact them directly."
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Post by kcatthedog on Dec 19, 2017 18:49:08 GMT -6
donr, the owner chooses to transfer (all) or not to transfer their purchased plugs ins with hardware that they sell. You have to specify this on the transfer page and info about the new owner: hard to get wrong !?
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Post by svart on Dec 19, 2017 19:28:59 GMT -6
This stuff and bullshit like dongles and license servers, and all that are just pieces of why I look back at my choice to stay hardware and don't do anything but smile.
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Post by donr on Dec 19, 2017 19:37:03 GMT -6
donr , the owner chooses to transfer (all) or not to transfer their purchased plugs ins with hardware that they sell. You have to specify this on the transfer page and info about the new owner: hard to get wrong !? Ah. I still have my PCIe 1 and a 2 quad, and a T-bolt Octo and an Apollo Twin. Never sold any of it. Seems like UAD is in a bit of a bind with their high dollar plug model. They're squeezed from both sides, the better/cheaper native CPU's and the better/cheaper native plugins. I also wonder why no one has made a multichannel AD/DA interface with built-in intel CPU for running iLok plugins and VI's with superlow latency and outputing analog or digital.
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Post by NoFilterChuck on Dec 19, 2017 19:45:08 GMT -6
I also wonder why no one has made a multichannel AD/DA interface with built-in intel CPU for running iLok plugins and VI's with superlow latency and outputing analog or digital. because everyone has different opinions as to what AD/DAs should sound like. Also, Intel vs AMD. Also iLok vs Cubase Dongle.
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Post by donr on Dec 19, 2017 19:51:40 GMT -6
If someone made a decent DAW interface that enabled no/low latency tracking with any plugin or VI (VST, say, and/or AU,) and doubled as a playback DSP engine, that'd be something people might want. Just thinking..
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Post by Johnkenn on Dec 19, 2017 20:04:07 GMT -6
the plot thickens from ua forum: "I believe there are people abusing the system which has caused UA to look more closely at the accounts of users. My guess is some users with a fair amount of plugs are allowing others to add their devices to their accounts, thereby authorizing plugs, and then transferring back. Once transferred back the person has access to all of the plugs as long as they do not update the authorizations. Remember, the authorizations are tied to the device. There is no way for UA to police this activity. Users can just keep transferring back and forth as many times as they want. I can see why UA would institute a policy to discourage this activity. However, I don't think this policy will impact "honest" users because UA can clearly see how often transfers occur in a user's account and they have already stated that they will honor transfers beyond the stated limit if you contact them directly."They are more than welcome to come scour my last four computers (since 2003). There has been nothing afoul here. They’re just going to have to deal with the fact that they can’t police the ONE instance that people might bill them - welcome to EVERY other software company’s world in 2018.
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Post by Johnkenn on Dec 19, 2017 20:07:03 GMT -6
Plus, if I’m transferring to another user, that means I’m NOT pulling that scam. I’ve only ever had one Apollo at a time on my account.
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Post by yotonic on Dec 19, 2017 20:39:39 GMT -6
I know people are still making good music, and I'm sure there are some good recordings being made, I just don't hear them. What little time I have to listen to recorded music is an MP3 or some other digital file off my computer in the midst of a busy day. I think I hear more live music today than recorded. But nonetheless I just can't understand the appeal of UAD. If I had an artist worth recording there a several studios in my town with lovely outboard and the engineers who know how to use them properly. Seems like UAD is for "overkill demos" and self recorded artists. I suspect the manufacturers all know this too, based upon the way they have ravaged these semi-pro chat boards and paid accomplished engineers to push plug-ins like opiates.
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Post by c0rtland on Dec 19, 2017 21:21:56 GMT -6
I'd bet that they are relying on the hundreds of new Apollo Twin customers these days over folks that need Apollo 16s or whatever. Apogee went the same route, looking for customers who only need to spend under $1000. and Apple
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Post by NoFilterChuck on Dec 19, 2017 21:51:06 GMT -6
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Post by donr on Dec 19, 2017 21:59:52 GMT -6
Chuck! I LOVE MH. I have one of every interface they've made, and still use the ULN-8 as main interface alongside the SVART Box and the Apollo Twin as my recording tools. I was thinking about a box that could host all the third party DAW plugins in a UAD style super-low latency situation. I've never tracked with MH's capable software, 'cause I don't have to, I can apply it anytime, without DSP penalty depending on how you route it.
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Post by Johnkenn on Dec 19, 2017 23:36:23 GMT -6
I know people are still making good music, and I'm sure there are some good recordings being made, I just don't hear them. What little time I have to listen to recorded music is an MP3 or some other digital file off my computer in the midst of a busy day. I think I hear more live music today than recorded. But nonetheless I just can't understand the appeal of UAD. If I had an artist worth recording there a several studios in my town with lovely outboard and the engineers who know how to use them properly. Seems like UAD is for "overkill demos" and self recorded artists. I suspect the manufacturers all know this too, based upon the way they have ravaged these semi-pro chat boards and paid accomplished engineers to push plug-ins like opiates. I take some offense to your post...Vance Powell, Dave Cobb, Michael Brauer, Jacquire King...and pretty much every professional I know would beg to differ. I would venture to say that 80% of what is out there has UAD on it.
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Post by Johnkenn on Dec 19, 2017 23:38:23 GMT -6
That being said, if they don’t dump this policy, I won’t be buying any more UA products. Great tools, shitty policy.
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