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Post by Guitar on Jul 15, 2017 17:47:32 GMT -6
Jeez, I don't think it's quite like that!
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Post by rowmat on Jul 15, 2017 17:58:31 GMT -6
Jeez, I don't think it's quite like that! At $299 retail for a Pultec tube equaliser Music Group will have no choice but to squeeze costs to the bone. There's a lot more hand labor involved in manufacturing something like a rackmount tube EQ than an iPhone mostly which is manufactured on automated production lines. I can't see manufacturers like Warm Audio surviving if they are just making clones of vintage gear. Granted they brought well priced decent quality stuff to the market but I think that may now be not for much longer. Now that Uli has jumped into the vintage clone market companies like Warm Audio will need to produce new and innovative stuff as trying to compete with a bemoth like Music Group is a race to the bottom and oblivion. Of course Behringer has a history of copying other companies products and quickly bringing them to market and stupidly low prices so I guess nothing has really changed. If Bryce ever imagined he might become the next 'Uli' I think he might be reconsidering his plans.
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Post by jcoutu1 on Jul 15, 2017 18:33:14 GMT -6
I still have trouble seeing how Uli is the Devil and Bryce is the second coming. Both products are being made in China and both probably have questionable labor practices. Same with the shoes I'm wearing and the shrimp I ate the other day. Stuff comes from China. I can't afford to not use Chinese made products, and even if I could afford it, I'd struggle to find the products I'm looking for (mostly electronics).
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Post by rowmat on Jul 15, 2017 18:50:33 GMT -6
I still have trouble seeing how Uli is the Devil and Bryce is the second coming. Both products are being made in China and both probably have questionable labor practices. Same with the shoes I'm wearing and the shrimp I ate the other day. Stuff comes from China. I can't afford to not use Chinese made products, and even if I could afford it, I'd struggle to find the products I'm looking for (mostly electronics). Affordable versus undercutting the competition into oblivion is the issue IMO. I have a pair of EQP-WA's and a pair of WA-76's. I could not have afforded the real things either. I'm assuming $299 for the KT Pultec is probably a limited special. However when things become too cheap at some point something has to give. The quality is reduced, the competition goes out of business, then the price goes up again etc. The fact that a company the size of Music Group is buying up 'names' and obviously intends to hit the market with a lot of new cheap clones might appear attractive in short term but it may be less so for market diversity and choice in the longer term.
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Post by jcoutu1 on Jul 15, 2017 19:03:04 GMT -6
rowmat, didn't Warm undercut the competition into oblivion with the WA76? At $600, they undercut everyone by 50%. That's why I have a pair.
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Post by rowmat on Jul 15, 2017 19:17:48 GMT -6
rowmat , didn't Warm undercut the competition into oblivion with the WA76? At $600, they undercut everyone by 50%. That's why I have a pair. Yes indeed but $4,300 AUD for a 'genuine' UA1176 was 'taking the piss' at the other extreme. www.turramusic.com.au/pages/CatalogueItem.aspx?CIID=1693That's why Warm Audio has had the success they had. My issue is what is 'too cheap'? My last 'real' job was managing production of RFID access control products. When buying components in the 100's of 1000's fractions of a cent per component does add up. My job included sending out quotation requests to up to a dozen different electronic component suppliers. I was always looking how to cut production costs in every possible area. In the end my boss decided it was our wages that could be cut. The rest is history...
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Post by kcatthedog on Jul 15, 2017 19:19:51 GMT -6
Undercut or demonstrate excessive profit margins?
I question whether the wa-EQP and this less expensive one actually have the same part quality ?
Another obvious implication is they can't sell these at the normal price so they are blowing them out? There is only so much margin when you still have to pay your manufacturing cost, distribution wholesale and retail mark up.
Perhaps this is an unfair trade practise:Behringer doesn't really have much of a good rep or street cred: does it ?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 15, 2017 20:45:44 GMT -6
Anybody out there who may be part of the Sweetwater affiliate program should flog the ever loving shit out their link to that piece. At that price they're gonna fly off the shelves. I've been tempted to buy one all day and I don't even need one.
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Post by EmRR on Jul 15, 2017 21:06:48 GMT -6
It is a weird turn that these are available at a price less than a DIY'er can even begin to buy the parts pile.
Purple site folks report this deal hasn't been seen in EU.
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Post by ragan on Jul 15, 2017 21:15:17 GMT -6
Wow. That's an aggressive move.
Taking a loss to try and put the squeeze on Warm?
Not selling well and dumping them off for good?
Hard to say. I sure do miss my pair of EQP-Wa. Not un-tempting, this deal, if they're any good.
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Post by indiehouse on Jul 15, 2017 21:20:32 GMT -6
No doubt. Man, I don't like buying junk and would rather shell out a few more dollars for better quality. But damn, this is tempting. I wasn't really even in the market. Hmmm....
So, this is a price drop and not an 'on sale' item? So, these are now $299 for good?
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Jul 15, 2017 21:27:07 GMT -6
Here's my semi educated theory, most current KT Dealers are SR / installers, no demand for this kind of product, it's doing OK for the big boys no traction in the small dealers. They cut a sweet limited deal with Sweetwater, it starts just as summer NAMM starts, the show for the smaller dealers, Guys at the small stores are calling their bosses in Nashville going WTF, people are talking about KT ! I'll bet Music Group doesn't even have a booth!
Just a theory, but I have seen stunts like this before.
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Post by drbill on Jul 15, 2017 21:48:32 GMT -6
I've also seen drops like this to hyper-hype products. Then, when there are enough out there, and the word gets out the price goes back up. Obviously these are the same units designed to retail @ $600 a few months ago. They are not new units with compromised parts to meet a $299 price point.
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Post by reddirt on Jul 15, 2017 23:31:40 GMT -6
This is a bit like a big chain store coming into town and luring custom by selling e.g. milk at $1.00 for a 2 lire bottle because they have the size to absorb losses. The ultimate result is the diverse little stores with real investment in the community i.e the owner and family live there and thus profits go back to that community by and large, gets squeezed to the wall ; I'm sure you know what I mean.
Diversity and choice are killed because there's a shark in the pond with no conscience or raison d'etre other than making money for shareholders
Try getting Warm's one on one and attention to detail response out of Music Group ' it ain't gonna happen.
If that's the community we want then buy that product. Don't ever hope to get a reasonable wage again as extrapolation will tell us that if we all purchase in this way then there will be no domestic industries unless we sell our labour at Asian rates. The truth is probably that this is how it will end up and the life we remember is exactly that...a memory.
It seems glib to say cheers but anyway - Cheers, Ross
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Post by drbill on Jul 16, 2017 0:48:52 GMT -6
It's essentially what Warm did to UA and other companies, albeit in a more aggressive way. I don't see a difference other than in the "scale" of the price war, and the "size" of the companies.
Ultimately, we have to decide if we want to purchase in a free market or a regulated one.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 16, 2017 5:02:10 GMT -6
seems waaaay overpriced in Europe now - still pretty much 700 euros.
Wonder how the guys who put their faith behind the KT brand and paid $700 for the original release feel now?
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Post by Ward on Jul 16, 2017 7:08:33 GMT -6
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Post by Ward on Jul 16, 2017 7:17:03 GMT -6
I wonder how "innovative" Warm audio should be considered... Well, innovative insomuch as they (and others, like Stam) were able to figure out ways to achieve the classic results for pennies on the dollar, and make gear that was just as (or more) reliable than the originals. And on that note, I just bought two of the KT Pultec clones and will see if they're as good or better than the WA-EQ ones I own, which aren't quite as solid as other warm products.
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Post by rowmat on Jul 16, 2017 7:47:23 GMT -6
I believe this is Starfucks™ Covfefe rowmat . But do you get a free KT Pultec EQ with every cup?
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Post by Guitar on Jul 16, 2017 8:21:31 GMT -6
No doubt. Man, I don't like buying junk and would rather shell out a few more dollars for better quality. But damn, this is tempting. I wasn't really even in the market. Hmmm.... So, this is a price drop and not an 'on sale' item? So, these are now $299 for good? What I have noticed is that B&H Photo Video is actually the sort of under-the-radar retailer that puts out sneaky slashed price deals from time to time. My first UH-7000 came with a FREE pair of Audio Technica ATH-M50x headphones, brand new in box. They have other deals like this, etc. I have noticed every time they slash prices on something, Sweetwater doesn't want to be undercut so they match the price. B&H must be enough of a competitor for it to be significant. "Price Drop" is a Sweetwater term that basically means sale. The price could just as easily go back up over time. For example, I've been watching the price point rise and fall on the Clarett 8PreX and Presonus DP88 interfaces over the past year or so. Down significantly, then back up again. Right now those are the only two big stores with the $299 price point that I am aware of. It remains to be seeen if this will become the new standard price for the EQP-KT.
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Post by subspace on Jul 16, 2017 9:09:40 GMT -6
I ordered a pair through SW, or back ordered a pair to be more accurate. I've been wanting a Pultec 'style' EQ to follow my mix bus comp for a long while and was mulling the 500 options, DIYRE, TK-ilizer, Bettermaker. Figured I'd roll the dice on the K-T clone at that price. It could be an anomaly like the $100 560As that went back to $200, and I was happy with those.
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Post by ericn on Jul 16, 2017 9:53:37 GMT -6
It's summer NAMM, and all anybody is talking about is SW, Behringer and KT! They moved product and it's cheaper than a Booth ! It's called Brilliant! !!!
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Post by nick8801 on Jul 16, 2017 10:06:47 GMT -6
I'm holding out till they are 99 bucks a piece:)
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Post by ericn on Jul 16, 2017 11:07:24 GMT -6
I'm holding out till they are 99 bucks a piece:) A man can Dream!
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Post by michaelcleary on Jul 16, 2017 11:20:34 GMT -6
Does anyone have and like them or are people buying on spec ? Yes, I have and like and have posted about this and the KT1176. I will be grabbing at least one more at this price...
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