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Post by kcatthedog on Aug 10, 2015 18:27:00 GMT -6
you should get about 50% of retail but check out the iLok transfer fee costs first.
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Post by LesC on Aug 10, 2015 19:16:06 GMT -6
From the iLok website: "Note that a $US25 per license/bundle fee applies for transferring licenses to another iLok.com account, but each License Transfer order has a maximum charge of $US50".
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Post by Johnkenn on Aug 10, 2015 19:21:54 GMT -6
Yeah, I could live without everything but VCC.
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Post by kcatthedog on Aug 10, 2015 19:30:37 GMT -6
From the iLok website: "Note that a $US25 per license/bundle fee applies for transferring licenses to another iLok.com account, but each License Transfer order has a maximum charge of $US50". so you will pay $25 to transfer each plug to the buyer's account but if one person buys 2 or more plugs from you, you will pay a max of $50 so its best for you if fewer people buy more plugs. |
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Post by LesC on Aug 10, 2015 19:44:04 GMT -6
Yes, I will try to sell all of them together. I've had a lot of luck with Kijiji, sold about $12,000 worth of stuff in the last year, I'll give it a try.
Getting back to the original point of the thread, I think $20/month is quite reasonable for all the current plugs plus new ones that are developed. Yes, I think it shits all over existing customers, but really $1000 sunk cost isn't going to kill anybody. I wish I could say that's the most I've wasted in my previous software and hardware purchases.
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Post by kcatthedog on Aug 10, 2015 19:59:52 GMT -6
Its interesting, as other than offering people no more than 6 months of free use of the plugs they don't already own or$120 bucks in brave new world plug cost money, Steven is acknowledging that long term customers have anything to be upset about or that there should be a tiered cost structure to the subscription service.
So if you already own slate plugs you are paying the same price per month as someone who hasn't put a cent into them ?
I respect Steven a lot and do feel he really tries to square the circle when he can but I don't understand why he is having trouble getting his head around a tiered cost structure ?
Why isn't it a simple percentage ,if the total price equals x, then each plug is a certain percent, if you won 40% of the plugs why isn't your price 60% ? Why is it 100% after no more than 6 months ?
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Post by LesC on Aug 10, 2015 20:47:36 GMT -6
I can understand why he wouldn't do that kind of tiered structure. If I have 100% of his plugs, I wouldn't expect my monthly price to be 0, which would be getting all his future plugs free. What I WOULD expect is to be credited for a fair percentage of the amount already purchased. For example, if you've spent $800 on plugins, you get a $400 credit which translates to 20 free months. If he did something like that, I would be a happy camper. I think this would be a winning strategy for him in the long run.
I've defended Steven for just about everything he's done in the past. The only exception I can think of is when MJB purchased a plug based on a direct Slate promise that wasn't kept. But this really frosts my balls. It's not even the money, it's just the principle of the thing. As you said, Steven doesn't seem to acknowledge why his most loyal customers might be upset.
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Post by Bob Olhsson on Aug 11, 2015 10:56:09 GMT -6
If Slate ever wants to do an IPO, he needs to move to this exactly the way Avid, Apple, Adobe and Microsoft have. Upgrade discounts are over for public companies due to the securities laws. It's only legal to offer free upgrades, completely new purchases or subscriptions due to accounting requirements.
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Post by wiz on Aug 11, 2015 17:20:19 GMT -6
If Slate ever wants to do an IPO, he needs to move to this exactly the way Avid, Apple, Adobe and Microsoft have. Upgrade discounts are over for public companies due to the securities laws. It's only legal to offer free upgrades, completely new purchases or subscriptions due to accounting requirements. Hey Bob I didn't know that. Ahhhhh (sound of penny dropping) thats why this is going the way it is. cheers Wiz |
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Post by popmann on Aug 11, 2015 18:57:07 GMT -6
Someone laughed at me the other day because I don't have Netflix. I'm like "I've had it many times....but, if I ever keep it longer than a couple months, I run out of anything to watch--so, I simply turn it off until there's a handful of movies/docs/originals I want to see....turn it back on"--I've got nothing against subscription services except they're never worth it....EVER....if you pay every month. Their business model IS based around people getting lazy--it's why Slate's service is $25/mo and Waves doesn't offer a $500/mo--people would SO use that for a month and shut it off....$25/mo at a certain income level....ehh....that's why the streaming subscriptions were always doomed. To pay artists and labels' traditional backend, they'd have to charge like $75/mo....and even the most rabid music fans don't tend to spend $75/mo buying new CDs. Well, maybe the MOST....but, you know what I mean--the most rabid won't want mp3s streamed....and those less than the biggest fanatics won't fathom paying $75/mo for music....I mean that's like half their TV bill!  |
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Post by timmyboy on Aug 15, 2015 21:19:07 GMT -6
So, I got booted off the other forum for bringing this up. Please just let me know if you guys are also against this kind of discussion. I'm doing the subscription. I've signed up and I love it. I particularly like the Reverb plugin. I was however disappointed by how Slate has handled the issue of Trigger. I'm not sure if everyone here knows the history of Trigger, but when I asked Steven why Trigger was removed from the Slate Digital lineup at the exact same time as the subscription service was announced - his version of events is that Trigger was actually a 'STEVEN SLATE DRUMS' product, but had been sold on the 'SLATE DIGITAL' store for a small portion of time, until his accounting department decided it was too much hassle and removed it about 2 years ago. A user on the other forum used The 'way back machine' website to demonstrate that Trigger was not removed 2 years ago from the 'SLATE DIGITAL' store, but in fact was removed at the exact same time as NAMM - when the subscription service was announced. Slate quickly apologized for his error and explained that unbeknownst to him - Trigger had returned to the 'SLATE DIGITAL' store for a short time more recently. Now - I have no problem if Slate Decides that he doesn't want to include one of his products in the subscription service (he's already including a lot for the price). What I DO have a problem with - is a false revision of history by Steven (in other words: a lie). I did a little more searching using the 'way back machine' to see if Steven's narrative is correct (as it's not how I remember it happening). We'll visit August 2012.... wayback.archive.org/web/20120812065853/http://www.stevenslatedrums.com/store^ Steven Slate Drums was not even selling trigger! The only 2 products available were 'Steven Slate drums EX' and 'Steven Slate Drums platinum' Meanwhile in the Slate Digital Store.... web.archive.org/web/20120805060952/http://www.slatedigital.com/products^ What is this? 'Trigger Advanced Drum Replacer'? Nice Let's jump forward to March 2013.... wayback.archive.org/web/20130312050012/http://www.stevenslatedrums.com/store/Apart from 'Steven Slate Drums 4' being released - we suddenly have a decision to include Trigger in the Steven Slate Drums Store - but - it looks like Trigger has a new name - "Slate Digital Trigger".... I wonder what that means? Could they be trying to make sure that people understand that this is a 'Slate Digital' product being sold in 2 different stores? I think so (it's pretty obvious). Also - there is an expansion pack available - "Steven Slate Deluxe Drum Sample Pack - For Slate Digital's Trigger".... Whoa! Getting pretty sure at this point (given the apostrophe ) that Trigger is a Slate Digital product NOT a Steven Slate Drums product. June 2013 - web.archive.org/web/20130629170211/http://www.slatedigital.com/products^3 months later over at the Slate Digital store - "Trigger" is still called "Trigger Advance Drum Replacer", but there is no attempt to clarify it as "SSD Trigger Advanced Drum Replacer" or anything similar. June 2014 - wayback.archive.org/web/20140625090240/http://stevenslatedrums.com/store/^ At this stage , Trigger 2 is released , but the chosen name for the Steven Slate Drums store is "Slate Digital Trigger 2". While in July 2014 - web.archive.org/web/20140702102417/http://www.slatedigital.com/products.... The product is simply known as "Trigger 2 Advanced Drum Replacer" This I'm afraid is undeniable proof that Trigger not only started as a Slate Digital Product - but has a long history (spanning years) of being available on both store with a conscious effort made to make a distinction to customers that they were buying a 'Slate Digital' product. This ONLY changed when the subscription service was announced, and it is VERY clear that it was a conscious decision to keep trigger (and its expansions) out of the subscription service while maintaining the marketing angle of getting "All of Slate Digital's product range" included in the subscription service. Being a customer who previously purchased Trigger under the belief that I was buying it from Slate Digital, it is VERY disappointing that I cannot get Expansion packs in my subscription service when I was led to believe that I would be getting all of SD's products included. The dishonesty baffles me more than the decision not to include Trigger. This might not seem like a big deal to many people. But I do care about the ethics of the companies I purchase from , and it's 'bittersweet' that Slate Digital make such great products, but feel that lying to their customers is a fair way of doing business |
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Post by Bob Olhsson on Aug 15, 2015 21:31:29 GMT -6
It's certainly possible he has different financial partner/investors for some products.
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Post by timmyboy on Aug 15, 2015 21:46:43 GMT -6
It's certainly possible he has different financial partner/investors for some products. Absolutely. And considering that Trigger is a lot older than most of the other products, it wouldn't surprise me if it was made by someone else and licensed. There could be a multitude of reasons why Trigger just can't be included, and for all we know - maybe Steven himself would love to be able to include it. I just wish he could be honest about the reason rather than making up stories. |
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Post by porkyman on Aug 15, 2015 23:20:31 GMT -6
i dont ever remember trigger being slate digital. its always been part of slate drums in my memory. i know for sure it was back when i bought blackbird because i was torn between ssd4 and trigger. but long before that i had been eyeing the two. i never thought trigger was part of the plan or wondered why it wasnt.
it also doesnt bother me whatsoever if youre right. if anything he did the right thing by removing it from digital before he announced at namm so ppl wouldnt get confused. not sure what the problem is.
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Post by timmyboy on Aug 16, 2015 0:09:30 GMT -6
i dont ever remember trigger being slate digital. its always been part of slate drums in my memory. i know for sure it was back when i bought blackbird because i was torn between ssd4 and trigger. but long before that i had been eyeing the two. i never thought trigger was part of the plan or wondered why it wasnt. it also doesnt bother me whatsoever if youre right. if anything he did the right thing by removing it from digital before he announced at namm so ppl wouldnt get confused. not sure what the problem is. Just the lie, that's all |
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Post by timmyboy on Aug 16, 2015 2:14:55 GMT -6
I don't think there is any disHONESTY behind it, but I do get the feeling that there is a lot of disORGANIZATION behind "SLATE" He's got Slate Drums (but that's really Yellow Matter Records/Entertainment) who make the 'drum stuff' when you buy it, you get your downloads in your one and only "slate" account but that's really drumclassroom.net and you have to use a keyfile to authorize it (except for Trigger which has an Ilok asset assigned by Slate Digital) then there is a company called SLATE DIGITAL which is a partnership with Fabrice Gabriel (co-owners) VMR, VCC, FG-X, VTM, you buy that stuff from them but then your licenses are at the same drumclassroom and they are all iLok'd (using Slate Digital assets) then there is a company called SLATE PRO AUDIO which makes the hardware like Quad, dragon, etc. then there is a company called SLATE MEDIA TECHNOLOGY that makes the Raven but also makes software (Batch Commander), license under the same umbrellas (drumclass/ilok asset from SLATE DIGITAL) there is a partnership with Paul Wolf (who may just be the designer of) the Slate Monitor Controller which was said to be shipping November 2014 but isn't out yet and now this partnership with Relab (although I'm pretty sure it's just distribution) Making it all more confusing is that all the Slate companies share ONE public face/voice (Steven) and ONE Facebook, twitter, etc, account (Slate Digital) his instagram is also for personal use (not complaining - he makes homemade bacon, and bbq and his girlfriend is quite attractive  ) so when Steven writes "NO NEW PRODUCTS TIL FG-X is OUT!" then immediately releases a new product, it's because STEVEN (DIGITAL) was saying no new DIGITAL products before DIGITAL releases FG-X but, in the meantime, DRUMS will release Blackbird and MEDIA will release Batch Commander... gets a lot of folks butthurt and seems unnecessarily confusing... Long story short, I think they grew really fast and are trying to get things under control now. I'm glad I'm not their accountant (although they should be equally glad I'm not their accountant!) EDIT: I totally remember Trigger being on the Slate Digital store... I may even have purchased it from there during a black friday sale or something Yes - I purchased Trigger from Slate Digital during a Black Friday sale too. I totally understand the confusion that happens due to the multitude of Slate companies, and that Steven often gets things a little backward himself - with no dishonesty intended. Trigger was not only on the Slate Digital store (before being anywhere else), but was also referred to on the Steven Slate Drums store as 'Slate Digital's Trigger' - seemingly as a way to let people know that even though the package included samples from 'Steven Slate Drums' - that it was in fact a 'Slate Digital' product. I think it's completely fine not to include Trigger in the subscription bundle (especially for me as I already own Trigger), but why try and claim that it was never a Slate Digital product when it clearly was? I do think it has something to do with the fact that he's offering the 'Complete lineup of slate digital products' for a monthly price , and that is only true if he pretends that Trigger isn't a Slate Digital product. Don't mistake this as looking like I am massively upset. It's just hardly the first time Slate has claimed things that are simply not true, and I'm curious as to why he gets a free pass Edit: Have a look at this archive of the Slate Digital website from October 2009 (when it first began) - there is only 2 products for sale: FG-X and Trigger - have a look at the write-up for Trigger (they make it pretty clear that Trigger is by Slate Digital. - web.archive.org/web/20091012030309/http://www.slatedigital.com/ |
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Post by RicFoxx on Aug 16, 2015 6:31:05 GMT -6
I don't take the Slate videos seriously anymore or product announcements. What exactly did GS ban you for???
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Post by timmyboy on Aug 16, 2015 7:24:04 GMT -6
I don't take the Slate videos seriously anymore or product announcements. What exactly did GS ban you for??? Well , I wasn't banned from the entire forum. Just kick from that discussion. Slate said that Trigger was never a Slate Digital product, had always been a Steven Slate Drums product , and had merely (on and off) spent 'some' time on the Slate Digital store. The moderator over at GS private messaged me, told me that Slate has now adequately explained the situation, deleted every post related to the situation with Trigger, and banned my username from posting in the thread (he didn't do the normal procedure of leaving a blank post with a message explaining why the post was deleted - he wiped the messages in a way that looks like they were never posted). I wasn't the only one talking about it either , and there was no insults, name calling, swearing, or anything that broke any forum rules by anyone that spoke about it. Slate is pretty well looked after over at GS it seems. |
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Post by swurveman on Aug 16, 2015 8:00:27 GMT -6
Now - I have no problem if Slate Decides that he doesn't want to include one of his products in the subscription service (he's already including a lot for the price). Unless I did something wrong during the download process, his Virtual Console Collection wasn't included in the subscription service demo period either. For me, who only owned his VTM, all I got was the Mix/Master FX Bundle and the Relab. |
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Post by ragan on Aug 16, 2015 8:18:54 GMT -6
Now - I have no problem if Slate Decides that he doesn't want to include one of his products in the subscription service (he's already including a lot for the price). Unless I did something wrong during the download process, his Virtual Console Collection wasn't included in the subscription service demo period either. For me, who only owned his VTM, all I got was the Mix/Master FX Bundle and the Relab. VCC is now a VMR module. Is it not in your VMR? |
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Post by swurveman on Aug 16, 2015 9:01:26 GMT -6
Unless I did something wrong during the download process, his Virtual Console Collection wasn't included in the subscription service demo period either. For me, who only owned his VTM, all I got was the Mix/Master FX Bundle and the Relab. VCC is now a VMR module. Is it not in your VMR? Thanks for the tip. I'll check it out tomorrow and let you know. |
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Post by timmyboy on Aug 16, 2015 19:00:02 GMT -6
VCC is now a VMR module. Is it not in your VMR? Thanks for the tip. I'll check it out tomorrow and let you know. Yeah - VCC is definitely part of the Virtual Mix Rack. On top of that you should have Virtual Bus Compressors (2 separate compressor plugins + a rack plugin that has both compressors in it), the Virtusl Tape Machine plugin, the FG-X plugin, and of course the Relab reverb plugin. |
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Post by Johnkenn on Aug 16, 2015 19:44:45 GMT -6
I don't take the Slate videos seriously anymore or product announcements. What exactly did GS ban you for??? Well , I wasn't banned from the entire forum. Just kick from that discussion. Slate said that Trigger was never a Slate Digital product, had always been a Steven Slate Drums product , and had merely (on and off) spent 'some' time on the Slate Digital store. The moderator over at GS private messaged me, told me that Slate has now adequately explained the situation, deleted every post related to the situation with Trigger, and banned my username from posting in the thread (he didn't do the normal procedure of leaving a blank post with a message explaining why the post was deleted - he wiped the messages in a way that looks like they were never posted). I wasn't the only one talking about it either , and there was no insults, name calling, swearing, or anything that broke any forum rules by anyone that spoke about it. Slate is pretty well looked after over at GS it seems. I haven't looked, but I'm sure Slate pays a pretty penny for advertising over at GS. So, I would imagine they are protecting their investment...and hence the reason this forum was created. |
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Post by timmyboy on Aug 16, 2015 20:39:53 GMT -6
Well , I wasn't banned from the entire forum. Just kick from that discussion. Slate said that Trigger was never a Slate Digital product, had always been a Steven Slate Drums product , and had merely (on and off) spent 'some' time on the Slate Digital store. The moderator over at GS private messaged me, told me that Slate has now adequately explained the situation, deleted every post related to the situation with Trigger, and banned my username from posting in the thread (he didn't do the normal procedure of leaving a blank post with a message explaining why the post was deleted - he wiped the messages in a way that looks like they were never posted). I wasn't the only one talking about it either , and there was no insults, name calling, swearing, or anything that broke any forum rules by anyone that spoke about it. Slate is pretty well looked after over at GS it seems. I haven't looked, but I'm sure Slate pays a pretty penny for advertising over at GS. So, I would imagine they are protecting their investment...and hence the reason this forum was created. No way! What a conspiracy theory! |
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Post by timmyboy on Aug 17, 2015 6:28:36 GMT -6
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) so when Steven writes "NO NEW PRODUCTS TIL FG-X is OUT!" then immediately releases a new product, it's because STEVEN (DIGITAL) was saying no new DIGITAL products before DIGITAL releases FG-X but, in the meantime, DRUMS will release Blackbird and MEDIA will release Batch Commander... gets a lot of folks butthurt and seems unnecessarily confusing... 
