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Post by mrholmes on Jul 30, 2015 13:23:14 GMT -6
To make a long story short. There is a reason for this thread. I went in circles about the Hybrid vs. ITB thing about the wish to have everything in one computer. Some mixes turn out good ITB but sometimes, like at the moment, I do not get the dimension I want. Its not the first time, I switch on the console and it sounds much more like a record. With this Jim is right. Do what I did a few years ago. I bought 16 out converter and a Allen and Heath ZED 14. Plus two Midiverbs and a Yamaha REV 500 I had outboard before which was hardwired to my converter. So its also worth the thing if you only use the ZED 14 for summing. It sounds different.... PS: Airwindows Console is something that helps with the depth and dimension ITB. But its really nothing against the console. And the ZED 14 is a cheap console.... I mean why not buying one if it makes you happy.... Speaking towards mixing only - not tracking which is a completely different ball game - this has not been my experience. I mix on average at least 20 pieces of music a month. This month I have to fly back east to mix a huge project for Disney. They are paying all my expenses and a silly daily rate that I couldn't turn down. They gave me a choice : I've got an HDX rig or a V series Neve to do it on. I'll be using the HDX rig. In my own studio, summing out to a console was easy for me. The DAW was normaled via my patch bay to the console, the console was normaled back into the DAW, I had 32 channels of i/o on the DAW and 48 / 96 channels on the console with 12 stereo returns for FX. The console was AUTOMATED. All my outboard was normaled to aux sends/returns or easily patched into inserts. Super easy to make the decision to go OTB and thru the mixer if I wanted to. But the mixer was CLEAN. D&R clean. And my experience was it wasn't adding enough most of the time to go to the hassle of exiting the DAW. So I've gone hybrid, with some CHOICE pieces (not all analog is good stuff guys) and I'm happy with that. Happier and mixing better than when I went OTB. If I had an older 2488 or 8068, yeah, I'd probably use it for summing OTB SOMETIMES. But I don't think a console is "the magic answer". There are other ways to accomplish the same result. Some of which I've had the pleasure of being involved with during their development. Don't get me wrong, I love consoles dearly. But in 2015, there's little time, room or money for them in most peoples business, workflow or lives. They are mostly a dream way of working that harkens back to an era that's passed, and most likely will never return. (Although I sadly wish it would.) And honestly, I don't think they are necessary anymore for "mixing". As I said earlier, tracking is another story completely. I'm doing better mixes now that I ever did on the console. And to make matters even more confusing, this "console / OTB" thing has gotten so out of control that people think think that summing thru ANY crappy console will make their mixes better. This is crazy. I'd much rather mix ITB than thru the majority of cheap consoles people are raving about these days. Actually, SOME people NEED a console to mix. They are old school to the bone. I get that and it's cool. But I don't believe that it is a stock "your mixes will be better" answer to peoples mixes that don't meet their expectation. What will get you there? Learning to mix different and better. Good luck - that's a lifelong journey. I'm still trying to get better with every mix. No reason to freak out I just said it sounds diffrent, I never said its the magical tool or anything like this. And btw. the specs of the ZED sereis are not bad, they are good sounding small mixers. Tell us more about it that is what the thread is about. |
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Post by drbill on Jul 30, 2015 13:35:49 GMT -6
Speaking towards mixing only - not tracking which is a completely different ball game - this has not been my experience. I mix on average at least 20 pieces of music a month. This month I have to fly back east to mix a huge project for Disney. They are paying all my expenses and a silly daily rate that I couldn't turn down. They gave me a choice : I've got an HDX rig or a V series Neve to do it on. I'll be using the HDX rig. In my own studio, summing out to a console was easy for me. The DAW was normaled via my patch bay to the console, the console was normaled back into the DAW, I had 32 channels of i/o on the DAW and 48 / 96 channels on the console with 12 stereo returns for FX. The console was AUTOMATED. All my outboard was normaled to aux sends/returns or easily patched into inserts. Super easy to make the decision to go OTB and thru the mixer if I wanted to. But the mixer was CLEAN. D&R clean. And my experience was it wasn't adding enough most of the time to go to the hassle of exiting the DAW. So I've gone hybrid, with some CHOICE pieces (not all analog is good stuff guys) and I'm happy with that. Happier and mixing better than when I went OTB. If I had an older 2488 or 8068, yeah, I'd probably use it for summing OTB SOMETIMES. But I don't think a console is "the magic answer". There are other ways to accomplish the same result. Some of which I've had the pleasure of being involved with during their development. Don't get me wrong, I love consoles dearly. But in 2015, there's little time, room or money for them in most peoples business, workflow or lives. They are mostly a dream way of working that harkens back to an era that's passed, and most likely will never return. (Although I sadly wish it would.) And honestly, I don't think they are necessary anymore for "mixing". As I said earlier, tracking is another story completely. I'm doing better mixes now that I ever did on the console. And to make matters even more confusing, this "console / OTB" thing has gotten so out of control that people think think that summing thru ANY crappy console will make their mixes better. This is crazy. I'd much rather mix ITB than thru the majority of cheap consoles people are raving about these days. Actually, SOME people NEED a console to mix. They are old school to the bone. I get that and it's cool. But I don't believe that it is a stock "your mixes will be better" answer to peoples mixes that don't meet their expectation. What will get you there? Learning to mix different and better. Good luck - that's a lifelong journey. I'm still trying to get better with every mix. No reason to freak out I just said it sounds diffrent, I never said its the magical tool or anything like this. And btw. the specs of the ZED sereis are not bad, they are good sounding small mixers. Tell us more about it that is what the thread is about. Not freaked out, sorry if it sounded that way. Kind of rough morning here. And no comment specifically on the ZED. Never used or tried one. Cheers, bp |
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Post by mrholmes on Jul 30, 2015 17:09:26 GMT -6
drbillNo reason to freak out I just said it sounds diffrent, I never said its the magical tool or anything like this. And btw. the specs of the ZED sereis are not bad, they are good sounding small mixers. Tell us more about it that is what the thread is about. Not freaked out, sorry if it sounded that way. Kind of rough morning here. And no comment specifically on the ZED. Never used or tried one. Cheers, bp Would you like to write about the development you have been involved in to get the same thing? |
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Post by drbill on Jul 30, 2015 17:53:24 GMT -6
I've shared that multiple times on this board, and I think on this thread if I'm not mistaken. I"m hybrid now, but honestly, my methods may not work for the next guy. We each have to find our own way.
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