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Post by Johnkenn on Jun 23, 2015 10:43:47 GMT -6
3...2...1...
Can we just stop?
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Post by scumbum on Jun 23, 2015 11:00:32 GMT -6
3...2...1... Can we just stop? Can we just stop ...........trying to save the transients ? I agree , those pesky little devils need to be obliterated !!!!! |
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Post by drbill on Jun 23, 2015 11:11:05 GMT -6
3...2...1... Can we just stop? Can we just stop ...........trying to save the transients ? Scum you're killin me......  |
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ericn
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Balance Engineer
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Post by ericn on Jun 23, 2015 11:49:35 GMT -6
Can we just stop ...........trying to save the transients ? Scum you're killin me...... m Killing you OK But transients well Bill that's whole different story! Transients lives matter! |
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Post by scumbum on Jun 23, 2015 12:11:35 GMT -6
m Killing you OK But transients well Bill that's whole different story! Transients lives matter! PETA .....how about "PETT"..... People for the Ethical Treatment of Transients I think its time to start PETT.org |
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Jun 23, 2015 12:31:12 GMT -6
m Killing you OK But transients well Bill that's whole different story! Transients lives matter! PETA .....how about "PETT"..... People for the Ethical Treatment of Transients I think its time to start PETT.org Isn't that Larry Flynts private foundation! |
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Post by svart on Jun 23, 2015 12:31:56 GMT -6
PETA .....how about "PETT"..... People for the Ethical Treatment of Transients I think its time to start PETT.org Isn't that Larry Flynts private foundation! I don't want to hear about Larry Flynt's privates. |
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Post by Martin John Butler on Jun 23, 2015 12:36:45 GMT -6
But I bet his private parties were a blast.
Anyone else use an 1176 when tracking vocals?
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Post by svart on Jun 23, 2015 12:44:49 GMT -6
But I bet his private parties were a blast. Anyone else use an 1176 when tracking vocals? I used to. Now I just use an LA2A on tracking. Sometimes I still use an 1176 on mixdown along with the LA2A as well. |
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Post by Johnkenn on Jun 23, 2015 12:47:28 GMT -6
i'm using the Sta to track vocals, then the FC526 in the mix. I'm gonna try vice versa too.
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Post by Martin John Butler on Jun 23, 2015 12:49:00 GMT -6
I'd use the Sta if I had one. I like the 1176 on strummy guitars most, so I use the UAD LA2 on most every vocal.
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Post by drbill on Jun 23, 2015 13:06:49 GMT -6
But I bet his private parties were a blast. Anyone else use an 1176 when tracking vocals? Not usually unless it's in mix down. Too tweaky for me to get just right. I've jacked up a couple vocals (transients??? heh) that wouldn't have been with a slower comp. I like LA3A's, LA2A's, 661/651's, CL1B's for vocal tracking. |
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Post by Martin John Butler on Jun 23, 2015 13:50:13 GMT -6
I know some cats swear by the LA3A. I've never used one. Maybe santa will bring me a Sta Level for Christmas.
Compression with the 1176 is weird, when I'm tracking it sounds fine, when I listen back when a few tracks are done, it sounds like too much grip.
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Post by drbill on Jun 23, 2015 14:47:17 GMT -6
The 1176 does have a lot of "grip" or "grab" or "spank" or whatever you like to call it. No doubt about it. It's "imprint" on audio is what people like about it. And what people hate about it. It all depends on what you're after. But if you track with it, you got it. Period. Sometimes cool, sometimes not. A more transparent form of gain control when tracking vocals is what I'm after. Either the 3A or 2A used judiciously is a lot less "obvious" than a 76. Actually....i like riding faders to control vocals, but there are some singers who you just can't keep up with. :-) If you see Santa, tell him I want a sta-level too. :-) :-)
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Post by Bob Olhsson on Jun 23, 2015 16:30:03 GMT -6
I swear by the two la3as I bought in the '70s but have been very unimpressed by UA's reissues.
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Post by jazznoise on Jun 23, 2015 19:02:32 GMT -6
I agree 100%. But I wanted to touch on something else here as well. Distant "in the room" mic-ing with lots of air is becoming a lost art - and for a lot of styles, out of vogue. Everyone seems to be working in a compromised space, and so they mic things CLOSER. And in doing that, there are SOME transients that are completely un-needed. They are un-natural and not how we hear sound in real life. Nobody puts their ear up against a snare drum, nobody puts a cowbell right up against your ear, nobody puts their head up against a marshall stack with the guitarist doing pick harmonics..... But all too often, that's how we MIC these things - RIGHT up on the source. And to make matters worse, sometimes we use condensers which are very good at capturing those transients. In the old days, tape and analog electronics got rid of a huge amount of those before we ever hit "playback", but now, we have them in full razer sharp glory. Distant mixing, care of mic placement and gain staging helps tremendously, but sometimes there is not enough time to get things perfect, or sometimes we got the tracks from someone who wasn't so experienced, and sometimes, we just want that rounded off sound. So......shave away we must. :-) Amen. I know plenty of people who refuse to do anything but close mic everything - even stuff like working in a Cathedral, dry as a bone! In small rooms in particular you can work with reasonable distances of a foot or so without it starting to sound wet. But there's a phobia, the room ambience doesn't have a Wet/Dry knob in post, so people don't want the risk. Sadly when that close the dynamic range of most instruments is definitely unnatural. Which means its gotta go through the AE grinder machine before it's usable... rather than just backing off the mic 6 inchs. |
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Post by drbill on Jun 23, 2015 20:40:26 GMT -6
I agree 100%. But I wanted to touch on something else here as well. Distant "in the room" mic-ing with lots of air is becoming a lost art - and for a lot of styles, out of vogue. Everyone seems to be working in a compromised space, and so they mic things CLOSER. And in doing that, there are SOME transients that are completely un-needed. They are un-natural and not how we hear sound in real life. Nobody puts their ear up against a snare drum, nobody puts a cowbell right up against your ear, nobody puts their head up against a marshall stack with the guitarist doing pick harmonics..... But all too often, that's how we MIC these things - RIGHT up on the source. And to make matters worse, sometimes we use condensers which are very good at capturing those transients. In the old days, tape and analog electronics got rid of a huge amount of those before we ever hit "playback", but now, we have them in full razer sharp glory. Distant mixing, care of mic placement and gain staging helps tremendously, but sometimes there is not enough time to get things perfect, or sometimes we got the tracks from someone who wasn't so experienced, and sometimes, we just want that rounded off sound. So......shave away we must. :-) Amen. I know plenty of people who refuse to do anything but close mic everything - even stuff like working in a Cathedral, dry as a bone! In small rooms in particular you can work with reasonable distances of a foot or so without it starting to sound wet. But there's a phobia, the room ambience doesn't have a Wet/Dry knob in post, so people don't want the risk. Sadly when that close the dynamic range of most instruments is definitely unnatural. Which means its gotta go through the AE grinder machine before it's usable... rather than just backing off the mic 6 inchs. I'll make that a double AMEN! As an aside, the KM84 is a great mic for "reach" in a poor room environment. You can easily "tune" in the amount of room tone and get back off that instrument. |
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Post by Martin John Butler on Jun 23, 2015 21:14:50 GMT -6
The posts about how close miking being unnatural makes perfect sense, I never thought of it that way, but will now.
My friend's K84 does wonders for my shitty living room, but I can only borrow it so many times.. arrgghh..
That's interesting Bob. Strange that the same company, making the same product, can't seem to duplicate its own design. Maybe its like Pre-CBS Fenders.
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Jun 23, 2015 21:20:32 GMT -6
T.. arrgghh.. That's interesting Bob. Strange that the same company, making the same product, can't seem to duplicate its own design. Maybe its like Pre-CBS Fenders. But it's not really the same company,Urei was last a part of Harman! Same family yes but it's not like somebody was keeping the supply chain up to date and of course as always some of those parts that sounded great probably are not so great if we want to continue to breathe! Fender/CBS was about well we can do it cheaper! |
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Post by drbill on Jun 24, 2015 10:51:14 GMT -6
but I can only borrow it so many times.. arrgghh.. You know what the answer for that is don't you? LOL |
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Post by Martin John Butler on Jun 24, 2015 13:03:48 GMT -6
Yes indeed. Only problem is a new Apollo and a new computer must come first, so until then, I'll just keep wishing on a star.
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Post by wiz on Jun 24, 2015 15:10:59 GMT -6
Yes indeed. Only problem is a new Apollo and a new computer must come first, so until then, I'll just keep wishing on a star. nah 8) the 84 will change your (recording) life long before what a converter will do 8) Get the money saved up for the 84 and put it aside, then POUNCE when the right one comes up! Converters will always be around. cheers Wiz |
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Post by Bob Olhsson on Jun 24, 2015 18:03:22 GMT -6
Original UREI actually got pretty mixed reviews back in the day according to a couple people I know who worked at United/Western. Ultimately UREI got sold to Harman although my understanding is they only took over the sales/distribution and not the manufacturing.
UA was started by one of Bill Putnam's sons. To the best of my knowledge nobody from the original company has ever been involved. Harman still serviced the original gear at the JBL plant a decade ago and may still. My point is that UA is no more authentic than anybody else.
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Post by LesC on Jun 24, 2015 18:18:48 GMT -6
I'll make that a double AMEN! As an aside, the KM84 is a great mic for "reach" in a poor room environment. You can easily "tune" in the amount of room tone and get back off that instrument. I'm curious, are you aware of a currently manufactured mic that would share this characteristic with the KM84? |
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Post by jazznoise on Jun 24, 2015 19:05:52 GMT -6
I'll make that a double AMEN! As an aside, the KM84 is a great mic for "reach" in a poor room environment. You can easily "tune" in the amount of room tone and get back off that instrument. I'm curious, are you aware of a currently manufactured mic that would share this characteristic with the KM84? I think when most people say "good reach" they mean the polar pattern is suitable and the off axis response isn't crazy. Many cheap condensors make lousy mics for distance applications because their off axis response is extremely uneven - usually a scooped midrange response with a huge resonance around the 3-7Khz mark. Fig of 8 ribbons and omnis work great too, and can be had for much lower figures than very high quality cardioid condensers. I seriously think no recording arsenal is complete without at least a stereo pair of omnis. |
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