|
|
Post by Johnkenn on Apr 27, 2015 13:56:38 GMT -6
Despite Blackspade not liking me very much, I have to say, their new mics look great... blackspademics.com/ |
|
|
|
Post by guitfiddler on Apr 27, 2015 15:50:58 GMT -6
From what I have heard, and I have heard the UM17R. Sounded really nice, and yes, they look great! If you mind me asking, What did you do for Blackspade to not like you very much? If I remember correctly Cowboy has this mic, not sure if he still does, and I know that MJB has a Blackspade also. It sounded really nice from what I heard.
|
|
|
|
Post by Johnkenn on Apr 27, 2015 16:35:35 GMT -6
It was somewhat of a mixup I think...They advertised that they had Tim Campbell specially design their CK12 caps to meet their design. I emailed Tim and he emailed back that he had never heard one. Well, that wasn't quite how they had portrayed it...I asked on GS wtf was going on considering BS's hyperbolic marketing...At the very least, the relationship was overplayed. Maybe Tim can comment - I'm sure it was a matter of them buying capsules and placing them in their mics - hey - he sells a fantastic product to anyone that pays for it...he was just being honest.
Fast forward to starting this site...I emailed BS and invited them to participate. I was politely told to shove it up my ass. Which makes me wonder...why the hell am I offering them any publicity at all? Good question...maybe I'll delete the thread.
|
|
|
|
Post by Johnkenn on Apr 27, 2015 16:37:07 GMT -6
Regardless of how I personally feel towards them, it looks like they offer a good product. I heard one of the UM25 proto's and it was a nice mic. I would venture to guess that these new ones with the Thiersch will sound even better. This place is about good sounding audio, not personal vendettas. BTW - I wonder what they're using in the other two mic? Looks like the info isn't up yet.
|
|
|
|
Post by category5 on Apr 27, 2015 17:35:26 GMT -6
The new stuff BS is doing looks absolutely killer, including their custom metalwork.
|
|
|
|
Post by Johnkenn on Apr 27, 2015 17:43:33 GMT -6
@cat5 you know anything about the 251 types? That metal work looks great.
|
|
|
|
Post by cowboycoalminer on Apr 27, 2015 18:53:35 GMT -6
From what I have heard, and I have heard the UM17R. Sounded really nice, and yes, they look great! If you mind me asking, What did you do for Blackspade to not like you very much? If I remember correctly Cowboy has this mic, not sure if he still does, and I know that MJB has a Blackspade also. It sounded really nice from what I heard. I sold mine and instantly regretted it. But these new ones with the BV08's look nicer. Probably are. Looking forward to hearing some feedback. They are voiced like a M49. Great vocal mic. MJB put the blue line in his and it's top shelf. |
|
|
|
Post by guitfiddler on Apr 27, 2015 19:28:54 GMT -6
What do the Blackspades sell for? I don't know anyone that stocks them in the states. I have my eye on a Bock 251! If only I could get that amazing sound for less. Does anyone know of anyone building these mics? I have seen pics inside the Bock 251, and it looks like it takes the less is more approach. I have never heard such velvety, smooth, airy, warm, and thick, all at the same time! A truly amazing mic, there is magic there in that mic! After using one, I just can't imagine having another mic that sounds that good. No wonder they cost $6000. I am almost ready to put down that much to never even care about a vocal mic again from now on! Can someone build one for a lot cheaper and get the same results? I know that people are building these, and I would love to get on board and build a couple, if they sound anything like Bocks. Ok, I changed the thread to Bock 251 mics John K.
|
|
|
|
Post by Johnkenn on Apr 27, 2015 19:46:24 GMT -6
I think you could do a DIY as good as the bock for half of what it costs.
|
|
|
|
Post by kidvybes on Apr 27, 2015 20:03:37 GMT -6
What do the Blackspades sell for? I don't know anyone that stocks them in the states. I have my eye on a Bock 251! If only I could get that amazing sound for less. Does anyone know of anyone building these mics? I have seen pics inside the Bock 251, and it looks like it takes the less is more approach. I have never heard such velvety, smooth, airy, warm, and thick, all at the same time! A truly amazing mic, there is magic there in that mic! After using one, I just can't imagine having another mic that sounds that good. No wonder they cost $6000. I am almost ready to put down that much to never even care about a vocal mic again from now on! Can someone build one for a lot cheaper and get the same results? I know that people are building these, and I would love to get on board and build a couple, if they sound anything like Bocks. Ok, I changed the thread to Bock 251 mics John K. These current Blackspade mics are all completely new, including the revised UM17B...only the UM17B has anything in common with the previous collaboration with Oiver Archut, and even there, I believe only the metalwork is the same...they are clearly upping their game...nice guys and very serious about what they are doing...I demo'ed the original UM17 (serial #10) when they were first introduced...nice mic! As far as getting a world-class 251-style mic, you need to talk to Shannon Rhoades at Mic Rehab...he has been doing these 251-style builds based on the MataChung GDIY C12 kit, and as JK said, for a fraction of the cost of the Bock...he just finished one for an AE I recommended (and it turned out amazing!) and he's currently advising another friend looking for more of the same... |
|
|
|
Post by guitfiddler on Apr 27, 2015 20:11:21 GMT -6
I think I will call Shannon. I want a Bock bad, but if I can get a 251 that is very close to the Bock for a lot cheaper I might just go for that option. Thanks guys.
|
|
|
|
Post by kidvybes on Apr 27, 2015 21:05:12 GMT -6
I think I will call Shannon. I want a Bock bad, but if I can get a 251 that is very close to the Bock for a lot cheaper I might just go for that option. Thanks guys. Oh, you will most definitely...the first guy I recommended already has the Bock, so this was his second "251" and he told Shannon to do his best possible version...even with Shannon's own C12 capsule build, I don't believe the mic it totaled half the cost of the Bock...but he can give you the specifics...ask him about that one he just built for Kerry (pics below)...it was based on this GDIY build: groupdiy.com/index.php?topic=51377.0The "251-style" body/headbasket assembly was purchased from BeesNeez: beesneezmicrophones.com.au/mic-kits/Attachments:
|
|
|
|
Post by Johnkenn on Apr 27, 2015 21:15:58 GMT -6
I know at one point, Shannon had talked about doing a dead on replica...but that was gonna be pricey.
|
|
|
|
Post by guitfiddler on Apr 27, 2015 21:30:17 GMT -6
you guys are killing me...
|
|
|
|
Post by kidvybes on Apr 27, 2015 21:47:55 GMT -6
I know at one point, Shannon had talked about doing a dead on replica...but that was gonna be pricey. That's exactly what he's been talking about doing for my other friend, who posted this thread about his "251 quest": realgearonline.com/thread/3137/251-type-mic-quest |
|
|
|
Post by timcampbell on Apr 28, 2015 1:26:37 GMT -6
It was somewhat of a mixup I think...They advertised that they had Tim Campbell specially design their CK12 caps to meet their design. I emailed Tim and he emailed back that he had never heard one. Well, that wasn't quite how they had portrayed it...I asked on GS wtf was going on considering BS's hyperbolic marketing...At the very least, the relationship was overplayed. Maybe Tim can comment - I'm sure it was a matter of them buying capsules and placing them in their mics - hey - he sells a fantastic product to anyone that pays for it...he was just being honest. Fast forward to starting this site...I emailed BS and invited them to participate. I was politely told to shove it up my ass. Which makes me wonder...why the hell am I offering them any publicity at all? Good question...maybe I'll delete the thread. Well John I'm sorry to have been part of any bad feelings. My dealings with Blackspade were completely conducted through Oliver Archut. I didn't find out until later that it was at Blackspade's request. Oliver bought one of my capsules, measured it in the mic, and asked me to make mechanical and tonal changes so it would suit his preference. We went back and forth a bit until he was satisfied and then I manufactured that specific capsule only for them. I repeatedly asked Oliver if I could borrow a mic in order to hear the final product especially after hearing the horrible clip-o-lator sample. Oliver could at times be hard to figure out. He wouldn't for various mysterious reasons agree to lend me one so until just recently I never heard one. Just 2 weeks ago I got a UM25 on my bench that a client wanted upgraded to a UM25C. All I can say is that when I changed the capsule out the resulting mic sounded as good as any 250/251 I've ever heard.Speaking with Blackspade in the past few months I mentioned Oliver's unwillingness to lend me a mic. They couldn't understand his reasoning and said they would have gladly lent me a mic if they had known. |
|
|
|
Post by Johnkenn on Apr 28, 2015 6:59:49 GMT -6
I'm sorry I was a part of it too - and sorry I dragged you into it. I was a potential customer and just wanted to know more information and I asked why the two pieces of information weren't adding up.
Yeah, those clipolator clips of the UM25C were really, really bright for some reason. Didn't really match what I had heard from the regular 25C.
|
|
|
|
Post by Johnkenn on Apr 28, 2015 8:33:35 GMT -6
Wow. That looks great.
|
|
|
|
Post by Martin John Butler on Apr 28, 2015 8:41:34 GMT -6
Just for the record, at every juncture, Mike at Blackspade has gone the extra mile to help me out. There was a mixup of the body of my UM17, and Mike was on the case with the swiftest replies during a weekend until we figured out what was going on.
Oliver had decided the body he had been using wasn't up to standard, so he pulled one out of stock and used that, and the serial number was 007. The thing was, the MkII UM17's were supposed to begin at serial number 52, so I at first thought they'd sent a previous version by accident. Mike helped me to open up the mic and check, something I'd never done in my life, and when we discovered what had happened, we all had a good laugh. So now, my mic can rightfully be called Bond if I wanted to give it a name, but I'd rather name it after one of the Bond girls if I did that sort of thing.
Let's see, uhh.. Galore, Pussy Galore, Octopussy? hmm.. I think maybe Honey Rider.
Mike also was a great help when I ordered the Thiersch capsule through him. This was all a new thing to me. Prior to that, I just bought a mic, plugged it in, and used it for ten years without thinking about it again.
I've loved and coveted the new MK-U47's, but so far the best mic I've ever personally used was an original C12, so the thought of a super duper Elam 251 design is exciting, and will one day be on my must have list, I'm sure. First, I have to go check on my lottery ticket.
|
|
|
|
Post by category5 on Apr 28, 2015 8:44:30 GMT -6
@cat5 you know anything about the 251 types? That metal work looks great. I think they are using Haufe's transformer and they are either using Tim's or Josephson's capsules (both are premium options). From the details and images I've seen they are building these to a performance metric rather than a price metric. That means they won't be cheap but they will be world class. I think the previous Blackspade mics were somewhat cost influenced. That's not to say they aren't great mics. Often the difference in performance doesn't equate to the difference in price when cost is thrown aside, but as you all know some of us can get obsessive, and that last few precious % is worth it. As I mentioned before, the new designs are even using custom metalwork instead of the popular Chinese T11 platform we all know so well. This is surely in an effort to control resonances and provide better overall consistency (not to mention aesthetic). It's cumbersome and expensive to go that route, but it's one of the few areas left to gain performance. Looks like the UM17 will remain as a lower cost option (still based on the famous Chinese platform), but clearly these new designs are positioned at a different, higher-end market. As much as I like to see cost competitive options that put quality in the hands of more musicians, it's also refreshing to see a manufacturer take the premium approach. My guess is Oliver was a big part of the original Blackspade designs, and now they are operating autonomously. Tim can tell us if they are using his capsules in the new designs. It would certainly fit the no-compromise approach. EDIT: Noticed BS and TC are in the house with answers. Those mics look beautiful, no? |
|
|
|
Post by kidvybes on Apr 28, 2015 10:41:33 GMT -6
@cat5 you know anything about the 251 types? That metal work looks great. Looks like the UM25 will remain as a lower cost option (still based on the famous Chinese platform), but clearly these new designs are positioned at a different, higher-end market. As much as I like to see cost competitive options that put quality in the hands of more musicians, it's also refreshing to see a manufacturer take the premium approach. My guess is Oliver was a big part of the original Blackspade designs, and now they are operating autonomously. ...I think you meant UM17 rather than UM25...yes Oliver was essentially building the original Blackspade UM17 and UM25 mics in Gaylord, using his own circuit configurations and AMI transformers (rumor has it his wife was the soldering master!)...the Blackspade/Oliver Archut collaboration came about shortly after Oliver parted company with Telefunken Elektroakustik, and his design/component contributions to the RFT AK-47 became the inspiration for the first-round UM17... ...I look forward to hearing more about these new Blackspade designs, as I know how serious these guys are about getting it right...I'm sure we'll be hearing much more once these new upgraded additions hit the ground running!... |
|
|
|
Post by category5 on Apr 28, 2015 10:51:01 GMT -6
Oops. Thanks kidvybes. Corrected.
I think the AMI situation has grown a little messy and that may be why they have moved to the Haufe transformers. They're certainly premium transformers though, so probably the right move given the variables. I wonder if the UM17 will remain on the list, or also get the full ultimate-grade treatment as well.
|
|
|
|
Post by Shannon on Apr 28, 2015 11:23:58 GMT -6
I just took a quick look(y). From what I saw they look great. I'm not sure if the website is up fully functional yet. I may have to check out one of those body kits.
Nice job
I went back to the site It must have been my end Comcast sucks
|
|
|
|
Post by Johnkenn on Apr 28, 2015 13:24:59 GMT -6
I didn't see that they were selling the body kits...that's cool.
|
|
|
|
Post by category5 on Apr 28, 2015 13:32:25 GMT -6
I didn't see that they were selling the body kits...that's cool. Not yet. Sinsay and I are just hoping.  |
|
