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Post by gravesnumber9 on Nov 12, 2024 12:22:28 GMT -6
I say do it! If I were staring from scratch I’d be hard pressed to not go the same route. This is the exact problem though. I'm NOT starting from scratch. The real hesitation is that I'm just beginning overdubs and mixing on a 17 track album of my own and I also have two other mix projects this month. But my own album is going to take at least a couple months and it feels like now is the time if I'm going to do it, the rest of the stuff I can honestly do ITB if I need to. |
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Post by RealNoob on Nov 12, 2024 13:00:05 GMT -6
I have the UV500 EQ. I got it for about $500 or so when the price first fell.
The low end is very lean, has 2 mid bands and a decent top end. Nothing on it is euphoric but it is great for carving/fixing. Not much different from a plugin, honestly. Same with the EQs on the Big Six.
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Post by jaba on Nov 12, 2024 13:02:18 GMT -6
I have the 500ADAT running through a RME UFX and I'm truly loving the workflow with the Cranborne.
Having each module available as an insert in Cubase (with the ability to easily flip a switch or two have a chain of modules) is great.
Super easy to use the LH95s on channels, commit, then swap them as a pair to the 2-buss (with a hardware comp on their inserts). May not work for everyone but it suits the way I mix.
If/when the RME dies, I'll have to think about another RME (maybe as interface only as their reliability is hard to beat) but the Cranborne's conversion and features would make it tempting to just go their route.
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Post by jaba on Nov 12, 2024 13:06:23 GMT -6
They were like $400 or $500 back when they were on sale last year. I thought about buying one, but never did. The question is always "is this better than ITB EQ?" In this case I think there's value in sculpting the signal before it goes back to conversion. This would be receiving outboard compressed signals in many cases. Plus, I just like physical EQ knobs. That's worth something too. I find the SSL Violet to be fine but can't say it's much better than some of the great plugs. Said that, if you want something on a console's output to mix into that won't break the bank, go for it. But massively vibeful it ain't. |
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Post by gravesnumber9 on Nov 12, 2024 13:34:53 GMT -6
The question is always "is this better than ITB EQ?" In this case I think there's value in sculpting the signal before it goes back to conversion. This would be receiving outboard compressed signals in many cases. Plus, I just like physical EQ knobs. That's worth something too. I find the SSL Violet to be fine but can't say it's much better than some of the great plugs. Said that, if you want something on a console's output to mix into that won't break the bank, go for it. But massively vibeful it ain't. Bank is a factor here for sure. If I could afford it I'd stack RND or Iron Age but... I can't. And I already have my other rack stacked with high end stuff. |
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Post by gravesnumber9 on Nov 12, 2024 13:37:02 GMT -6
I have the 500ADAT running through a RME UFX and I'm truly loving the workflow with the Cranborne. Having each module available as an insert in Cubase (with the ability to easily flip a switch or two have a chain of modules) is great. Super easy to use the LH95s on channels, commit, then swap them as a pair to the 2-buss (with a hardware comp on their inserts). May not work for everyone but it suits the way I mix. If/when the RME dies, I'll have to think about another RME (maybe as interface only as their reliability is hard to beat) but the Cranborne's conversion and features would make it tempting to just go their route. That's another idea. A DigiFace USB and another Cranborne 500ADAT instead of 500R8. What would be the pros and cons there? One pro is that the 500ADAT can work with any unit. A con would be that the 500R8 has all kinds of monitoring functions that seem truly useful. |
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Post by vanguardaudiolabs on Nov 12, 2024 13:46:45 GMT -6
Cranborne is great, and the guys there know their stuff. A+ company.
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Post by jaba on Nov 12, 2024 14:36:51 GMT -6
I have the 500ADAT running through a RME UFX and I'm truly loving the workflow with the Cranborne. Having each module available as an insert in Cubase (with the ability to easily flip a switch or two have a chain of modules) is great. Super easy to use the LH95s on channels, commit, then swap them as a pair to the 2-buss (with a hardware comp on their inserts). May not work for everyone but it suits the way I mix. If/when the RME dies, I'll have to think about another RME (maybe as interface only as their reliability is hard to beat) but the Cranborne's conversion and features would make it tempting to just go their route. That's another idea. A DigiFace USB and another Cranborne 500ADAT instead of 500R8. What would be the pros and cons there? One pro is that the 500ADAT can work with any unit. A con would be that the 500R8 has all kinds of monitoring functions that seem truly useful. Honestly, I haven't thought too much about the pro/cons as the RME is still running 100% and hopeful will for some time. When it does come time to replace it, my experience with the Cranborne so far will definitely make me consider getting their R8 but I do trust RME in that regard. The additional mic pres on the RME do come in handy too though they don't get used for key tracks. I do remote recording sometimes so the RME's single rackspace footprint is a bonus. |
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Post by gravesnumber9 on Nov 12, 2024 17:42:09 GMT -6
Well boys... it's done. The deed is done.
Got my Sweetwater rep on the phone and actually worked a nice deal, about $800 off retail and I pulled the trigger on the following:
- Cranborne 500R8
- SPL BiG
- Elysia Nvelope
- Elysia Karacter
- Cranborne Camden Pre (2x)
I'm pretty pysched about the switch. This is gonna be an upgrade all over for both mixing and tracking since I can now move my 828ES to my tracking room and start tracking at 96khz thanks to the Thunderbolt.
And also, don't hold back on telling me "wtf were you thinking?" on any of these 500 units. They can always be returned! I've been eying the Elysia pieces for a while. But the SPL BiG was a bit of an impulse buy I must admit. I love wideners. Also, keep in mind in my other racks I have plenty of EQ's and compressors and normal stuff.
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Post by Tbone81 on Nov 12, 2024 18:33:36 GMT -6
Well boys... it's done. The deed is done. Got my Sweetwater rep on the phone and actually worked a nice deal, about $800 off retail and I pulled the trigger on the following: - Cranborne 500R8 - SPL BiG - Elysia Nvelope - Elysia Karacter - Cranborne Camden Pre (2x) I'm pretty pysched about the switch. This is gonna be an upgrade all over for both mixing and tracking since I can now move my 828ES to my tracking room and start tracking at 96khz thanks to the Thunderbolt. And also, don't hold back on telling me "wtf were you thinking?" on any of these 500 units. They can always be returned! I've been eying the Elysia pieces for a while. But the SPL BiG was a bit of an impulse buy I must admit. I love wideners. Also, keep in mind in my other racks I have plenty of EQ's and compressors and normal stuff. report back on the Elysia karacter please, I’ve had my eye on that piece for a long while now. |
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Post by gravesnumber9 on Nov 12, 2024 18:58:45 GMT -6
Well boys... it's done. The deed is done. Got my Sweetwater rep on the phone and actually worked a nice deal, about $800 off retail and I pulled the trigger on the following: - Cranborne 500R8 - SPL BiG - Elysia Nvelope - Elysia Karacter - Cranborne Camden Pre (2x) I'm pretty pysched about the switch. This is gonna be an upgrade all over for both mixing and tracking since I can now move my 828ES to my tracking room and start tracking at 96khz thanks to the Thunderbolt. And also, don't hold back on telling me "wtf were you thinking?" on any of these 500 units. They can always be returned! I've been eying the Elysia pieces for a while. But the SPL BiG was a bit of an impulse buy I must admit. I love wideners. Also, keep in mind in my other racks I have plenty of EQ's and compressors and normal stuff. report back on the Elysia karacter please, I’ve had my eye on that piece for a long while now. I track tons of VI organ. That's gonna be its first test. Some saturators don't grab electric organ unless it's really oscillating hard. We'll see! |
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Post by geoff738 on Nov 12, 2024 19:21:44 GMT -6
Man I almost went the Cranborne route myself a few years back. In the end I didnt in part because at the time there wasn’t a lot of feedback here. I atill am second guessing my decision not to, particularly because the reviews since have been pretty much all positive. It is what it is.
Cheers,
Geoff
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Post by gravesnumber9 on Nov 12, 2024 19:50:33 GMT -6
Man I almost went the Cranborne route myself a few years back. In the end I didnt in part because at the time there wasn’t a lot of feedback here. I atill am second guessing my decision not to, particularly because the reviews since have been pretty much all positive. It is what it is. Cheers, Geoff Never too late! I almost went Full C a few years ago but instead backed out last minute. I'll let you know how it goes. A bit nervous I may have screwed up a workflow I've spent years refining but I really think this is a natural fit for my style. |
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karlo
Full Member
Posts: 42
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Post by karlo on Nov 12, 2024 22:14:04 GMT -6
500r8 doesn’t have totalmix. Just saying.
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Post by jaba on Nov 13, 2024 7:42:23 GMT -6
500r8 doesn’t have totalmix. Just saying. This is an excellent point. |
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Post by gravesnumber9 on Nov 18, 2024 13:15:43 GMT -6
Ok, well as always the same "problem" in judging the Cranborne conversion. The headphone amps are so good that I can't tell if what I'm hearing is better headphone amps or better D/A. I don't really have the energy to set up my monitors through my A/B splitter to test the two systems with monitors but with headphones going back and forth between the 828ES and the Cranborne 500R8, volume matching the best I can... wow.
Where I can hear it most is that the lows and low-mids are just so much more distinct on the Cranborne.
This really could be just the amp though, it takes a lot to drive my K701's and all the Cranborne amps have enough power to make an armadillo go deaf.*
*Armadillos have terrible hearing for all the non-Texans out there... get it? So loud even an armadillo would go deaf. Whatever. You'll all move here eventually. Search your feelings, you know it to be true.
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Post by gravesnumber9 on Nov 19, 2024 14:15:31 GMT -6
Now that I've got this all setup, my quick thought is... I should have done this a long time ago. There are cons though, I'll start with those since the pros are pretty overwhelming.
A couple cons...
- The latency is way worse than MOTU 828ES. We're talking 5ms RTL at 16 samples. This is what happens when you don't write your own drivers.
At 512 samples Studio One's low latency mode makes it workable but even S1's magic can't quite get it perfect, there's still that slight latency. Vast majority of people it wouldn't bother, me it does. It's fine because I can use the artist monitor (analog path) and it's very elegantly built in to the system, but sometimes if I'm being lazy I want to just monitor direct from the DAW, won't do that with this setup. Haven't tested how well S1's VI low latency works yet. Fingers crossed.
- You lose a really great feature if you run at 2x sample rates which is the MIX L/R out and DAW2 input. This is my favorite features so far so it's a bummer. The summing is so simple at 48khz. The box automatically sums the signals and puts them on its own dedicated output (separate from AUX and monitor out). That can then go through analog processing and come back through a DAW2 input which allows me to get the signal back into the system without having to use a 500 slot pair. At 88khz and above the channel sacrifices throw DAW2 input to the sample rate gods.
Now the pros...
- Welp... copy and paste! The summing is so simple at 48khz. The box automatically sums the signals and puts them on its own dedicated output (separate from AUX and monitor out). That can then go through analog processing and come back through a DAW2 input which allows me to get the signal back into the system without having to use a 500 slot pair. Finally analog summing that is not a hassle!
- I already loved being able to send 8 channels in and out through 500 series with a few clicks. Someone having 16 just feels very, very complete.
- The monitoring and headphone routing is dead simple and sounds great. The D/A conversion? The headphone amps? Don't know, don't care. All I know is my monitors sound great and so do my headphones.
- The setup was the easiest I've ever done. The DAW reads the inputs and labels them perfectly, plug it in and your done. That's the advantage of not having any software I guess. So, so simple.
- Oh yeah... and I realized I can use my MOTU 828ES as a standalone converter! So I took a few minutes to set up some different routing paths in MOTU's weird mix app and, BOOM! Super flexible. Fair trade for being stuck at 48khz.
And the biggest pro is that, just as I hoped, it's as fun to record as it is with a tape four track which to me is the pinnacle of fun. All the joy and convenience of a console without the bulk and maintenance of a console. This wouldn't work for my primary tracking room, but for mixing/overdubs it's perfection. So far.
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Post by gravesnumber9 on Nov 19, 2024 14:21:05 GMT -6
I'll post about the 500 units I got in a different thread at some point. Here's the TLDR...
- SPL BiG... what didn't you guys like about this? I see negative comments. I had the advantage of reading about how it actually works (SPL was vague at first) so I had a better idea of how to use it maybe. It only works on the side channels and it really needs the delta between L/R signals to be not just significant but also worth highlighting. I like it.
- Elysia Karacter and Nvelope... everything it's cracked up to be. You can tell they really thought through the 500 series format as opposed to just cramming their tech into a smaller footprint.
- Camden... jury is out. As a color box I'm not sure yet. Sounded good on kick. Did not work for adding grit to vocals, by the time I could hear it, it ruined the vocal. Still haven't tracked through it.
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Post by gravesnumber9 on Nov 19, 2024 17:32:09 GMT -6
Quick update. VI latency is totally manageable with S1 dual buffer. Maybe because the MIDI controller goes through it's own USB port? Idk, but it's fine.
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Post by gravesnumber9 on Nov 19, 2024 18:57:46 GMT -6
Camden instrument input is really great. It's a nice DI for sure. I ran a hollow body through it and chained that to a second Camden and then to Elysia Karacter. Took the DI signal from the first Camden mostly clean and then also took the dirty signal. Knock the sample rate up to 1024 and blend the DAW sound and the direct MIX sound and you've got perfect slapback for tracking. Fun and easy. No need for worry about amp sim latency, I can add sim later.
Starting to figure out the sweet-spot on the Camdens.
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Post by paulnajar on Nov 21, 2024 4:02:18 GMT -6
edit: sorry just saw you’ve already gone R8..
As a 3 x 500Adat owner I would not go with the R8. Instead I would go with an interface with better drivers. If you’re on Mac my understanding is the R8 is class compliant and does not have its own driver. This all but guarantees the RTL will be poor and at the same time the cpu hit is also worse.
My solution was an RME UFX 3 and an older RME Madi to 8 x Adat ports ADI-648. I know, lots more $$$ but I think you get what you pay for. Do you work at 2x sample rates? If you do then 8 Adat ports will only cover 4 x 500adat’s. If you don’t use 2x sample rates then get an RME digiface and add up to 4 500Adats.
The Cranborne gear is great and great value but the lack of R8 drivers is a weak point in their ecosystem. Why hobble an otherwise great system by scrimping on the audio transport part of the equation.
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