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Post by antbar on Sept 27, 2024 14:14:24 GMT -6
Yep. And ask Chad what he thinks of the stock Warm 67.  Gene Michael Hall “knew” their 47jr. was wrong for my usual Voice. First listen!  It's funny what can work - or not - right? I've got an Oktava 219 that cost me maybe $70. Haven't used it for vocals in ages, but when I did, it really worked when it worked. I can't describe it in tech terms, but it captured a very "real" version of my voice, or of ME, really. There was something confessional about that mic. It didn't suit many songs, but when it fit, it was fab. |
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Post by chessparov on Sept 27, 2024 15:02:13 GMT -6
Got stock 219 (and 319*)
HUGE dip in my Sibilance Zone.
Lispy unless you hit it with at least strong Compression.
And/or add EQ-of course.
So “in-built” De-Esser for Hard Rock!
*If my Elly is the “10” Capsule.
The exceptional (for a 219/319) 319 I have is around “8.5”.
The funky stock Circuitry, probably docks it a .5.
But still best one I’ve ever heard.
Flukey. For a stock Octava.
Chris
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
Posts: 16,083 
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Post by ericn on Sept 27, 2024 15:06:40 GMT -6
Matt beat me to it, of course I did sell his mentor 3 Gefell’s so I will still take credit for it 😁 Seriously with a handful of decent 87 clones out there you don’t need to have Neumann gon the mic, find a good dealer who will work with you. The other option is to contact either Ben @ Beesneez or Chad a Signal Arts and see what they can dial up just for you. I've got two of those mics headed this way right now. I can’t remember what the 3 I sold him were, they were before the diaphragm material change. I’m glad they ended up with someone who understands what they are. Enjoy my friend I know Ian would be happy! |
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Post by yotonic on Sept 27, 2024 17:35:14 GMT -6
A good Neumann vintage U87 is the sound of popular rocknroll from the 60s, 70s, 80s, 90s. I can’t think of a more prolific vocal mic when it comes to famous singers and their hits. It sits in a recording so well, and good Neumann mics are in a league of their own. I own many great mics that aren’t Neumanns but I have to tip my hat to the impact Neumann has had on recorded music.
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Post by russellcreekps on Sept 27, 2024 17:47:54 GMT -6
An 87 will always work, and always retain its value or even accrue value. So just get an 87. If you have some money, get a really good vintage U87. There are a couple of sellers on here that have a few extras. Otherwise, you have three stellar options: 1. BeesNees BU87c is fantastic and MUCH less money. Ridiculously cheap, and mics is our friend. 2. Serrano 87 is also ridiculously awesome and cheap, and has all three patterns and cserrano is our friend 3. chessparov was selling his Soundelux U195 which is pretty much a dead ringer for an 87. Wouldn't hurt to ask. This…Both great 87 options! I also swear by the BU67 (I have the B67-269 v2). It is my #1 go to mic, gets auditioned before anything else. I don’t think you could go wrong with it, like chessparov said 4 voicings! |
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Post by robo on Sept 27, 2024 23:04:48 GMT -6
I agree with Ward. If you want a 87 get an 87. Luckily we’ve got excellent recreations for well under a grand nowadays, so unless you’re trying to impress someone, there’s no need to spend thousands on a vintage one.
I’ve got the Serrano and it just works on everything.
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Post by Vincent R. on Sept 28, 2024 7:13:25 GMT -6
The U87 is a nice workhorse microphone when it is set up with the right signal chain. With the wrong chain it can be a touch bright or strident. While I think there are other options out there, if the U87 is the sound you want, go for it. If you are trying to buy a U87ai used, go through a real vendor. There is an amazing looking Chinese POS clone being passed off as the real thing. So go to Guitar Center’s used page or the like and buy there. At least if there is an issue you can return it.
There are also some really nice clones out there too; Serrano, Stam, Beesneez all make one. Check them out in the shootout below. I was surprise that it was the U87ai that stood out to me, but I own one and may just be used to its sound.
Other options worth considering; Blue Kiwi has a similar voicing to the U87, but more a touch more clarity, and definitely wants for a good Tube preamp. Lauten Atlantis is an amazing workhorse with 3 different voicings. It’s probably closer to variations on a FET U47 than a U87, but man does it have a nice sound. I love the Beesneez B67/269 V. II and in the modern 269 mode with the S2 engaged, it will give the U87 a good run for its money, with a touch more high end, and that warm tube goodness we all love.
Also, if you are coming into a little bit of money, treat your space. Honestly, a U87 is going to reveal how good or bad your room really is. It’s an extremely sensitive microphone and you will hear everything. The GIK stuff is worth the money, or DIY it. You won’t realize how bad your room’s sound actually is until you’ve treated it.
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Post by nnajar on Sept 28, 2024 9:46:25 GMT -6
I’m selling a klaus modded 67 that is particularly exquisite…..
I’m keeping the klaus 87
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Post by damoongo on Sept 28, 2024 11:45:04 GMT -6
An 87 will always work, and always retain its value or even accrue value. So just get an 87. If you have some money, get a really good vintage U87. This. |
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Post by chessparov on Sept 28, 2024 14:30:54 GMT -6
For most of us (again) with the skyrocketing of Vintage 87 prices.., Getting an excellent alternative 87 Style is more pragmatic. FWIW Eventual 67 Reissue? Off my Fantasy List, by having the BU67. Chris |
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Post by keymod on Sept 29, 2024 6:22:35 GMT -6
We just used a u87ai yesterday on a BGV session with two male tenors singing simultaneously, about three feet back from the mic, in cardiod. Great results. Didn't hurt that the vocalists are top-notch and can harmonize like crazy.
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Post by antbar on Nov 21, 2024 16:15:53 GMT -6
I appreciate that a few peeps here have said "If you want the 87, get the 87." At this point, if I do go for an 87, it would be an ai model, probably second-hand. I have the Beesneez 67 and the Soyuz fet 017 on my radar as well.
I've been doing my own VERY unscientific 87/67 shootout, digging up various vocal tracks I've done on said mics at different studios. There was a vintage Klaus'd 87 from my time in Berlin that sounded gorgeous. The engineer recorded with a bass boost in, so I had to cut that, but once I did, what a sound. A couple other 87 vocal tracks, also vintage, I have to assume, were a little distorted/dirty. No idea if it was the mic, pre or board etc, but funny and startling to hear these "unclean" tracks. Not problematic, and the vox work in the song, but still...
Even the recent recordings I did at my pal's place on his 87ai were different one from the next. Different days and my voice/the song might've had to do with it, or the signal chain was maybe tweaked differently etc. Generally, Neumann mics have always been kind to my very variable voice.
The only U67 tracks I have access to (I have albums recorded with the Moody Blues "holy grail" 67, but no access to the individual ADAT/PT/Logic tracks), show either a mic or board in need of cleaning. The gist of the 67 tone still wraps its arms around my sound, but hard to hear the forest for the glitchy trees in this case. I'd already recorded a vocal with the Roswell for one of the songs I tracked w U67 and while the Roswell required a bit of EQ after the fact, it turned out great. Roswell K67 > U67 shocker! On that note, I'm still getting great vocal sounds from my Roswell K87. Might take it up the hill to A/B w his 87ai one of these days.
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Post by chessparov on Nov 21, 2024 20:18:41 GMT -6
Metaphorically…
My $$ would think the Board needs work 😉
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Post by rowmat on Nov 21, 2024 22:24:40 GMT -6
If you can manage to find a Neumann U77 for a reasonable price I would take it over ANY Neumann U87 in a heartbeat.
My desert island LDC.
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Post by keymod on Nov 22, 2024 4:14:35 GMT -6
I appreciate that a few peeps here have said "If you want the 87, get the 87." At this point, if I do go for an 87, it would be an ai model, probably second-hand. I have the Beesneez 67 and the Soyuz fet 017 on my radar as well. I've been doing my own VERY unscientific 87/67 shootout, digging up various vocal tracks I've done on said mics at different studios. There was a vintage Klaus'd 87 from my time in Berlin that sounded gorgeous. The engineer recorded with a bass boost in, so I had to cut that, but once I did, what a sound. A couple other 87 vocal tracks, also vintage, I have to assume, were a little distorted/dirty. No idea if it was the mic, pre or board etc, but funny and startling to hear these "unclean" tracks. Not problematic, and the vox work in the song, but still... Even the recent recordings I did at my pal's place on his 87ai were different one from the next. Different days and my voice/the song might've had to do with it, or the signal chain was maybe tweaked differently etc. Generally, Neumann mics have always been kind to my very variable voice. The only U67 tracks I have access to (I have albums recorded with the Moody Blues "holy grail" 67, but no access to the individual ADAT/PT/Logic tracks), show either a mic or board in need of cleaning. The gist of the 67 tone still wraps its arms around my sound, but hard to hear the forest for the glitchy trees in this case. I'd already recorded a vocal with the Roswell for one of the songs I tracked w U67 and while the Roswell required a bit of EQ after the fact, it turned out great. Roswell K67 > U67 shocker! On that note, I'm still getting great vocal sounds from my Roswell K87. Might take it up the hill to A/B w his 87ai one of these days. We have the transformer versions of the Roswell mics you mentioned, and they are indeed very nice mics for the price. |
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Post by thehightenor on Nov 22, 2024 6:09:14 GMT -6
Vintage 70's 87's can sound truly sublime on vocals - especially male vocals.
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Post by moeses on Nov 22, 2024 19:03:39 GMT -6
I have never used a U87
Vintage or new
But I tell you that United Twin87 is good stuff in both voicings
it's not beautiful, but always sounds REALLY good
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Post by Ward on Nov 23, 2024 10:50:52 GMT -6
Vintage 70's 87's can sound truly sublime on vocals - especially male vocals. Mine do as well. Are they really quiet? No. Are they sometimes noisy? Yes. Is there some distortion? Yes. And that's all part of the sound and the magic! |
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Post by jaba on Nov 23, 2024 11:26:58 GMT -6
Vintage 70's 87's can sound truly sublime on vocals - especially male vocals. Mine do as well. Are they really quiet? No. Are they sometimes noisy? Yes. Is there some distortion? Yes. And that's all part of the sound and the magic! Over the years I've used three different old U87s and they're great workhorses. Sometimes absolutely perfect on a vocal, guitar, drums. There's no way I'm spending the money for an OG but if one of the new tributes have that sound, I'm definitely interested. Are they mostly based on the vintage 87s? Do some have the same tone and distortion characteristics? I have and trust Beesneez but I so often use the various patterns that it's unfortunately out of consideration due to it being cardioid only. |
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Post by chessparov on Nov 23, 2024 14:21:47 GMT -6
AFAIK they’re still making the Multi-Pattern version/87i. Chris EDIT: Yep! Looks like 20% off too. |
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Post by chessparov on Nov 23, 2024 14:24:46 GMT -6
Vintage 70's 87's can sound truly sublime on vocals - especially male vocals. AND Karen Carpenter! |
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Post by crillemannen on Nov 23, 2024 14:32:38 GMT -6
Wops sold my U87 again haha.. I do like it the only thing that bothers me a bit is the lowmid resolution which is lacking around 400hz. I guess it's the FET design that does it because the U67 doesn't have that problem. If you have a higher pitched voice with not so much going on in the low range then it's great! The u87 vintage is still the most affordable way to get that lovely vintage Neumann sound.
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Post by Ward on Nov 23, 2024 18:03:16 GMT -6
Wops sold my U87 again haha.. I do like it the only thing that bothers me a bit is the lowmid resolution which is lacking around 400hz. I guess it's the FET design that does it because the U67 doesn't have that problem. If you have a higher pitched voice with not so much going on in the low range then it's great! The u87 vintage is still the most affordable way to get that lovely vintage Neumann sound. I'm tending to turn back towards them now . . . and thinking they really were the upgrade to the 47 and 67 |
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