kbb
Junior Member
Posts: 82
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Post by kbb on Jan 7, 2023 22:35:53 GMT -6
Howdy,
I've been searching for a vocal/general purpose condenser for about a year. Years back, I had a Peluso 2247le, and borrowed a Lawson (47 type), and a U87ai to do vocals for a record. I stopped recording much for some years, and when I came back to it, I liked the AEA R84 ribbon best, and lived out of one for years. In the last year, I decided to expand the mic collection, and for some reason, got really interested in a U87ai. I bought a mint used one, and liked it on vocals, but it sounded harsh on my acoustic guitars and pretty much everything else (except vocals), so I sold it and got a Flea. It's a classy sounding mic, but I still missed the way the U87ai seemed to cut on vocals.
So, if you're still reading, I bought another used U87ai, and I'm surprised at how different it sounds to the previous one. The newest one (to me) isn't nearly as strident or high mids peaky. It actually sounds the way people describe them - low mid forward, very warm, but somehow not cloudy. Neither is what I'd describe as patently "bright", but the new one definitely sounds flatter to me. I like it. What I'm beginning to appreciate about the U87ai is how musical and articulate those low mids are - I haven't tried yet, but I'm skeptical that I could add eq to a different mic to achieve something similar.
Have you heard significantly different sounding contemporary U87ais? I assume (maybe wrongly) that QA is pretty tight on an expensive German mic such as this. I'm wondering if I'm forgetting something about the way I used it before that might have led to the difference.
What sucks is that now I want the U87ai AND the Flea. Very different sounding mics, both wonderful. The flea is more relaxed in the mids but has a really great balanced response and a lot of non-sibilant detail and articulation. Certainly a little more open sounding than the neumann.
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Post by tkaitkai on Jan 7, 2023 22:49:26 GMT -6
Since you bought both 87s used, it’s possible they were from two different production runs, used for different purposes, and/or kept in different environments, and thus aged differently. But you may have unknowingly changed out something else that’s making a bigger difference than you would expect. Mic pres, converters, outboard, room treatment, mic placement, and even cables can have the exact kind of effect you’ve described. Unless you’re totally certain everything else is identical, that would be my guess. Oh, and my vote goes to keeping the Neumann and the Flea.  |
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kbb
Junior Member
Posts: 82
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Post by kbb on Jan 7, 2023 22:57:26 GMT -6
Since you bought both 87s used, it’s possible they were from two different production runs, used for different purposes, and/or kept in different environments, and thus aged differently. But you may have unknowingly changed out something else that’s making a bigger difference than you would expect. Mic pres, converters, outboard, room treatment, mic placement, and even cables can have the exact kind of effect you’ve described. Unless you’re totally certain everything else is identical, that would be my guess. Oh, and my vote goes to keeping the Neumann and the Flea. Wise words and observations, thank you!! What I'm certain of is that never should have put much stock in the U87ai hate I read on the internet lol. At least for my voice, anyway, and well, duh, every one is different. It's also starting to make sense why Kare Carpenter used the u87...it would elevate the mid warmth of a voice like that so well! |
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Post by dok on Jan 8, 2023 0:43:52 GMT -6
There are actually at least 5 versions of the U87AI according to Klaus Heyne. repforums.prosoundweb.com/index.php?topic=37455.0I had the 04 with the dreaded daughter board and it was real sibilant on me. I swapped the circuitry for a TLM67 and it's lovely now. Put that one on your list if you're looking. |
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kbb
Junior Member
Posts: 82
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Post by kbb on Jan 8, 2023 1:25:40 GMT -6
There are actually at least 5 versions of the U87AI according to Klaus Heyne. repforums.prosoundweb.com/index.php?topic=37455.0I had the 04 with the dreaded daughter board and it was real sibilant on me. I swapped the circuitry for a TLM67 and it's lovely now. Put that one on your list if you're looking. Thank you! |
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Post by chessparov on Jan 8, 2023 1:43:19 GMT -6
And Karen's U87i @ A&M was kept in a safe there. The selector was broken, so it was always... "Stuck in Omni"!  Chris |
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kbb
Junior Member
Posts: 82
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Post by kbb on Jan 8, 2023 2:16:17 GMT -6
And Karen's U87i @ A&M was kept in a safe there. The selector was broken, so it was always... "Stuck in Omni"! Chris whoa...stuck in omni for real?? |
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Post by chessparov on Jan 8, 2023 2:23:04 GMT -6
Si Senor. Chris |
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Post by wiz on Jan 8, 2023 4:43:02 GMT -6
And Karen's U87i @ A&M was kept in a safe there. The selector was broken, so it was always... "Stuck in Omni"! Chris whoa...stuck in omni for real?? I use mine exclusively in fig 8 for vocals |
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Post by thehightenor on Jan 8, 2023 5:09:23 GMT -6
Howdy, I've been searching for a vocal/general purpose condenser for about a year. Years back, I had a Peluso 2247le, and borrowed a Lawson (47 type), and a U87ai to do vocals for a record. I stopped recording much for some years, and when I came back to it, I liked the AEA R84 ribbon best, and lived out of one for years. In the last year, I decided to expand the mic collection, and for some reason, got really interested in a U87ai. I bought a mint used one, and liked it on vocals, but it sounded harsh on my acoustic guitars and pretty much everything else (except vocals), so I sold it and got a Flea. It's a classy sounding mic, but I still missed the way the U87ai seemed to cut on vocals. So, if you're still reading, I bought another used U87ai, and I'm surprised at how different it sounds to the previous one. The newest one (to me) isn't nearly as strident or high mids peaky. It actually sounds the way people describe them - low mid forward, very warm, but somehow not cloudy. Neither is what I'd describe as patently "bright", but the new one definitely sounds flatter to me. I like it. What I'm beginning to appreciate about the U87ai is how musical and articulate those low mids are - I haven't tried yet, but I'm skeptical that I could add eq to a different mic to achieve something similar. Have you heard significantly different sounding contemporary U87ais? I assume (maybe wrongly) that QA is pretty tight on an expensive German mic such as this. I'm wondering if I'm forgetting something about the way I used it before that might have led to the difference. What sucks is that now I want the U87ai AND the Flea. Very different sounding mics, both wonderful. The flea is more relaxed in the mids but has a really great balanced response and a lot of non-sibilant detail and articulation. Certainly a little more open sounding than the neumann. Having tried both the 87ai and BLUE Kiwi as the general purpose LDC I ended up buying the BLUE Kiwi, which I think is a superior mic. I noticed the highly respected mic aficionado jj Blair saying the exact same thing - so I’m not the odd one out in my preference between these two mics. Now a vintage 87 - all bets off - I’ll take a great vintage 87 all day every day. I have a Wunder CM7 (high end 47 clone) and an AEA R92, so similar mics to you, and the BLUE Kiwi is the perfect contrast to these two mics. |
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kbb
Junior Member
Posts: 82
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Post by kbb on Jan 8, 2023 12:06:08 GMT -6
Howdy, I've been searching for a vocal/general purpose condenser for about a year. Years back, I had a Peluso 2247le, and borrowed a Lawson (47 type), and a U87ai to do vocals for a record. I stopped recording much for some years, and when I came back to it, I liked the AEA R84 ribbon best, and lived out of one for years. In the last year, I decided to expand the mic collection, and for some reason, got really interested in a U87ai. I bought a mint used one, and liked it on vocals, but it sounded harsh on my acoustic guitars and pretty much everything else (except vocals), so I sold it and got a Flea. It's a classy sounding mic, but I still missed the way the U87ai seemed to cut on vocals. So, if you're still reading, I bought another used U87ai, and I'm surprised at how different it sounds to the previous one. The newest one (to me) isn't nearly as strident or high mids peaky. It actually sounds the way people describe them - low mid forward, very warm, but somehow not cloudy. Neither is what I'd describe as patently "bright", but the new one definitely sounds flatter to me. I like it. What I'm beginning to appreciate about the U87ai is how musical and articulate those low mids are - I haven't tried yet, but I'm skeptical that I could add eq to a different mic to achieve something similar. Have you heard significantly different sounding contemporary U87ais? I assume (maybe wrongly) that QA is pretty tight on an expensive German mic such as this. I'm wondering if I'm forgetting something about the way I used it before that might have led to the difference. What sucks is that now I want the U87ai AND the Flea. Very different sounding mics, both wonderful. The flea is more relaxed in the mids but has a really great balanced response and a lot of non-sibilant detail and articulation. Certainly a little more open sounding than the neumann. Having tried both the 87ai and BLUE Kiwi as the general purpose LDC I ended up buying the BLUE Kiwi, which I think is a superior mic. I noticed the highly respected mic aficionado jj Blair saying the exact same thing - so I’m not the odd one out in my preference between these two mics. Now a vintage 87 - all bets off - I’ll take a great vintage 87 all day every day. I have a Wunder CM7 (high end 47 clone) and an AEA R92, so similar mics to you, and the BLUE Kiwi is the perfect contrast to these two mics. I'll have to check that one out! A couple of Soyuz mics also got attention recently. 👍🏼 |
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