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Post by yewtreemagic on Oct 1, 2022 14:20:09 GMT -6
One plugin that seems to have this effect to my ears is the Kazrog True Iron. The Western Electric setting(it's at 1 0clock on the dial) does some nice sizing up and spatial things. It's funny you should mention this, as some time ago for my own amusement and education I performed a whole raft of tests across various 'mojo' plug-ins to judge their 3d soundstage/width/depth capabilities, and Kazrog True Iron was one of the few that came out well during my 'forensic listening'.  However, acting on a hunch, I also ran some Mid/Side tests, and as I half suspected , True Iron measured a small 0.5dB increase in the RMS side level, which to me suggested that this is at least partly how it enhanced the '3d-ness' or 'air' of the sound, by 'opening it out' a little. Interestingly, one of the two plug-ins that had similar imaging and 3d 'focus' improvement was the Black Box Analog Design HG-2 plug-in, which once again measured a tiny increase in side signal, this time of 0.2dB RMS, but this time the side signal peaks increased by 0.5dB, perhaps tying in with slightly greater detail. Many of my other candidates exhibited little or change in either RMS or peak side levels, but Black Rooster Audio's VPRE-73 (1073 clone) once again showed a 0.5dB increase in side peak level. I'm certainly not saying this is the be all and end all of image improvement, but it could be a factor. Any thoughts? Martin P.S. I must try the same tests using Dan's suggested parameter settings for Klanghelm's SDRR2 |
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Post by Mister Chase on Oct 1, 2022 16:35:43 GMT -6
Indeed. Curious about its effect on spatial sense... I can speak to this if anyone wants. I've tried all the plugins mentioned. Honestly, they rarely get used and never on mix bus when they do. I have 8 Silver Bullets - 3 of the the newer mk2's, which are especially killer for height / width and dimension (the A and Aspect Ratio excell on this), and 5 of the originals which get used on individual instruments/vocals and busses primarily. I have the Manley VariMu which primarily gets used on Piano during mixing, and for mastering duties on final mixes pre SBmk2 (again) and Miad LCPQ4040's - very rarely to never on the mix buss during mixing. I have ZOD IDDI's which live on the 2 buss after the Silver Bullet mk2's 99% of the time during mixing. The ZOD IDDI's are incredible, insanely affordable for what they do, and they are used here constantly for lending that "tube" vibe. When I just need a tube vibe and don't need compression, they get the call over the Manley's, Coil CA70's, Locomotive 14B's, Weight Tanks, and 286A's, VComps, Tube EQP's, etc.. If I need to go very retro, the Coil's or VComps can come into play. The 14B's are very cool, but bring things to the front, which kind of works against me when mixing. Perfect for vocals for me. For instant mix goodness, the SBmk2's followed by the ZOD's instantly get me 150% further than anything I have ever tried ITB. Instantly - just my standard settings on the mk2 with the ZODs. So easy and simple it feels like cheating. Always easy, very rarely to never do they ever get in the way of the musical output. And rarely do I even have to twist a knob. They just work. I prefer the ZOD's over the Manley on the mix buss for size - although I must say, I've never tried the above technique of turning the threshold all the way up and not using it for compression - just box tone. That's sounds interesting, but I'm pretty familiar with the Manley's box tone, and for work flow and max dollar impact, I'd rather use the Manley on Piano and the ZOD's on mix buss. The Manley VariMu has been my absolute favorite piano compressor of all time. It's got high headroom so it doesn't crap out on transient hits, and it softens up ITB VSTi pianos that can easily get harsh. The softening it gives on the 2Bus in not what I'm looking for these days. The ZOD's give me some size that seems unique to tube gear, and the SB can open the mix up a bit more with it's AIR EQ if they get too "tubey" for a particular song. I have not tried the LTL Pentodes in the mk2's. I really should have. Nobody tell Brad. Hahaha! I'm enjoying the API>NEVE>SSL topology that it comes standard with though and am reticent to swap out the SSL for a tube mojo amp. Never been a big SSL fan, but honestly, the SSL circuit in the SB is pretty special for what it adds. The aspect ratio on the mk2 has really upped my mixing game considerably in terms of width/height - and I thought I was pretty good before mk2. LOL That's my thoughts. If you have any other questions, fire away. I use all the above every day when mixing. (Which is most days lately) I certainly do appreciate you taking the time to write your thoughts about this. So it seems to me like the SB might be in my future. It certainly sounds painstakingly thought out and designed. I've talked to Brad in the past and had some LTL stuff for the Color modules if I recall. Good guy and makes great stuff. I went down a bit of a rabbit hole this/last year with 2bus stuff and probably relying too much on it from the start. I feel like I have a better grasp on where the mix moves end and the 2bus should appropriately begin. The Silver Bullet seems to have some nice things it can do but not intending to replace any proper mix duties. That's sort of what I am looking for. I can mix until I'm blue in the face but a certain few things just aren't really doable in my opinion unless you put them on the whole mix. They are not, however, replacements for mixing. So finding that sweet spot where it all comes together is helpful. When you mention "that tube thing" with the IDDI, is it more of the depth of field and presence or tube thing as in more colored and thick? I seem to have heard both kinds in the tube realm. It sort of makes me wonder if the LTL pentode setup in the C-slot would have me covered... |
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Post by Mister Chase on Oct 1, 2022 16:39:27 GMT -6
One plugin that seems to have this effect to my ears is the Kazrog True Iron. The Western Electric setting(it's at 1 0clock on the dial) does some nice sizing up and spatial things. It's funny you should mention this, as some time ago for my own amusement and education I performed a whole raft of tests across various 'mojo' plug-ins to judge their 3d soundstage/width/depth capabilities, and Kazrog True Iron was one of the few that came out well during my 'forensic listening'. However, acting on a hunch, I also ran some Mid/Side tests, and as I half suspected , True Iron measured a small 0.5dB increase in the RMS side level, which to me suggested that this is at least partly how it enhanced the '3d-ness' or 'air' of the sound, by 'opening it out' a little. Interestingly, one of the two plug-ins that had similar imaging and 3d 'focus' improvement was the Black Box Analog Design HG-2 plug-in, which once again measured a tiny increase in side signal, this time of 0.2dB RMS, but this time the side signal peaks increased by 0.5dB, perhaps tying in with slightly greater detail. Many of my other candidates exhibited little or change in either RMS or peak side levels, but Black Rooster Audio's VPRE-73 (1073 clone) once again showed a 0.5dB increase in side peak level. I'm certainly not saying this is the be all and end all of image improvement, but it could be a factor. Any thoughts? Martin P.S. I must try the same tests using Dan's suggested parameter settings for Klanghelm's SDRR2 Interesting observations. I mean, all of this stuff has to be empirically describable, right? So it seems mid/side is being messed with as well as saturation, compression. All in one plugin. I'm not really a believer in magic stuff in audio, so it would make sense to me that those things are being futz'd with. If it sounds good, then great. I suppose I could make my own chain of FX with Pro-Q3 in mid side mode, some mid side compression and saturation too. I guess that is a lot of what it's about. Then again, if I can do it all in one plugin or piece of gear with less knobs, all the better, right? So yea, all that makes sense to me. There isn't any paranormal stuff happening in those plugins... |
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Post by drbill on Oct 1, 2022 19:27:32 GMT -6
I can speak to this if anyone wants. I've tried all the plugins mentioned. Honestly, they rarely get used and never on mix bus when they do. I have 8 Silver Bullets - 3 of the the newer mk2's, which are especially killer for height / width and dimension (the A and Aspect Ratio excell on this), and 5 of the originals which get used on individual instruments/vocals and busses primarily. I have the Manley VariMu which primarily gets used on Piano during mixing, and for mastering duties on final mixes pre SBmk2 (again) and Miad LCPQ4040's - very rarely to never on the mix buss during mixing. I have ZOD IDDI's which live on the 2 buss after the Silver Bullet mk2's 99% of the time during mixing. The ZOD IDDI's are incredible, insanely affordable for what they do, and they are used here constantly for lending that "tube" vibe. When I just need a tube vibe and don't need compression, they get the call over the Manley's, Coil CA70's, Locomotive 14B's, Weight Tanks, and 286A's, VComps, Tube EQP's, etc.. If I need to go very retro, the Coil's or VComps can come into play. The 14B's are very cool, but bring things to the front, which kind of works against me when mixing. Perfect for vocals for me. For instant mix goodness, the SBmk2's followed by the ZOD's instantly get me 150% further than anything I have ever tried ITB. Instantly - just my standard settings on the mk2 with the ZODs. So easy and simple it feels like cheating. Always easy, very rarely to never do they ever get in the way of the musical output. And rarely do I even have to twist a knob. They just work. I prefer the ZOD's over the Manley on the mix buss for size - although I must say, I've never tried the above technique of turning the threshold all the way up and not using it for compression - just box tone. That's sounds interesting, but I'm pretty familiar with the Manley's box tone, and for work flow and max dollar impact, I'd rather use the Manley on Piano and the ZOD's on mix buss. The Manley VariMu has been my absolute favorite piano compressor of all time. It's got high headroom so it doesn't crap out on transient hits, and it softens up ITB VSTi pianos that can easily get harsh. The softening it gives on the 2Bus in not what I'm looking for these days. The ZOD's give me some size that seems unique to tube gear, and the SB can open the mix up a bit more with it's AIR EQ if they get too "tubey" for a particular song. I have not tried the LTL Pentodes in the mk2's. I really should have. Nobody tell Brad. Hahaha! I'm enjoying the API>NEVE>SSL topology that it comes standard with though and am reticent to swap out the SSL for a tube mojo amp. Never been a big SSL fan, but honestly, the SSL circuit in the SB is pretty special for what it adds. The aspect ratio on the mk2 has really upped my mixing game considerably in terms of width/height - and I thought I was pretty good before mk2. LOL That's my thoughts. If you have any other questions, fire away. I use all the above every day when mixing. (Which is most days lately) I certainly do appreciate you taking the time to write your thoughts about this. So it seems to me like the SB might be in my future. It certainly sounds painstakingly thought out and designed. I've talked to Brad in the past and had some LTL stuff for the Color modules if I recall. Good guy and makes great stuff. I went down a bit of a rabbit hole this/last year with 2bus stuff and probably relying too much on it from the start. I feel like I have a better grasp on where the mix moves end and the 2bus should appropriately begin. The Silver Bullet seems to have some nice things it can do but not intending to replace any proper mix duties. That's sort of what I am looking for. I can mix until I'm blue in the face but a certain few things just aren't really doable in my opinion unless you put them on the whole mix. They are not, however, replacements for mixing. So finding that sweet spot where it all comes together is helpful. When you mention "that tube thing" with the IDDI, is it more of the depth of field and presence or tube thing as in more colored and thick? I seem to have heard both kinds in the tube realm. It sort of makes me wonder if the LTL pentode setup in the C-slot would have me covered... On the IDDI's - I'd call it depth and size. I would say no presence added. If anything they roll off a tad - which is easily made up for with the beautiful AIR EQ on the SB. I wouldn't really call them colored, although some might. Thick? Eh....I'd call it size, but we may be talking about the same thing. They make things bigger and deeper..... If I didn't have the SB working hand in hand with the IDDI's, they would probably get too thick or big sometimes, but that is easily controlled in conjunction with the SBmk2's - and honestly - I kind of view them as a team or in conjunction with each other. If I had only 1 - it would be the mk2. So versatile.....and yes, I must try the Pentodes in there!!! |
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Post by Mister Chase on Oct 1, 2022 19:39:09 GMT -6
I certainly do appreciate you taking the time to write your thoughts about this. So it seems to me like the SB might be in my future. It certainly sounds painstakingly thought out and designed. I've talked to Brad in the past and had some LTL stuff for the Color modules if I recall. Good guy and makes great stuff. I went down a bit of a rabbit hole this/last year with 2bus stuff and probably relying too much on it from the start. I feel like I have a better grasp on where the mix moves end and the 2bus should appropriately begin. The Silver Bullet seems to have some nice things it can do but not intending to replace any proper mix duties. That's sort of what I am looking for. I can mix until I'm blue in the face but a certain few things just aren't really doable in my opinion unless you put them on the whole mix. They are not, however, replacements for mixing. So finding that sweet spot where it all comes together is helpful. When you mention "that tube thing" with the IDDI, is it more of the depth of field and presence or tube thing as in more colored and thick? I seem to have heard both kinds in the tube realm. It sort of makes me wonder if the LTL pentode setup in the C-slot would have me covered... On the IDDI's - I'd call it depth and size. I would say no presence added. If anything they roll off a tad - which is easily made up for with the beautiful AIR EQ on the SB. I wouldn't really call them colored, although some might. Thick? Eh....I'd call it size, but we may be talking about the same thing. They make things bigger and deeper..... If I didn't have the SB working hand in hand with the IDDI's, they would probably get too thick or big sometimes, but that is easily controlled in conjunction with the SBmk2's - and honestly - I kind of view them as a team or in conjunction with each other. If I had only 1 - it would be the mk2. So versatile.....and yes, I must try the Pentodes in there!!! Gotcha. Size is the thing I want. I think thickness in my mind is more like pushing up low mid or lows or saturating to the point where it sounds more dense. Size is definitely the thing I am after. Very cool. Good to know. I hate to be a copycat, but I may have to try your setup with those two in conjunction. Could be a real winner. And those pentodes, too. Sheesh. Thanks for the info! Guess I'll save for a MKII first. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2022 5:19:03 GMT -6
Try this on your stereo bus with SDRR2 Starting settings:
HQ+ mode for linear phase oversampling filters
Desk mode
Stereo
Medium crosstalk
3 Stages
1-2 drive
try to hit 0 VU. Use the upper right thing to make it so you can hit 0vu on the meter without changing the volume levels.
You should notice a major veil and receding stereo image right away. that's your depth.
Now you dial it back or increase it.
The "stage" switch will bring forward the image. 2 is much less noticeable and 1 is subtle. 3 is instant depth/veil.
Dual mono instead of stereo will make it wider
more crosstalk will add a weird saturation type effect that can work.
drive will add more crunch. If too much crunch, reduce drive or input.
Nice. Just tried that. That is nice. Desk most seems to create some of that sense of space and depth just a bit in 3 stage mode. Thank you! Have you found the same thing to be possible with Tupe? So far I haven't gotten it. I can get nice saturation of course, but there seems to be more going on with image in SDRR and the Sebatron. Tupe on two bus? Never tried. It’s probably dope on some of the flatter models |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2022 5:21:16 GMT -6
Klanghelm is interesting in that it seems to do one of the things a desk does, which is add a bit of crosstalk which weirdly makes things wider but also more connected. But it doesn’t really have a “sound” or “box tone” to me I’ve been interested in grabbing another ZOD to use on a mix buss…and I guess a Silver Bullet 😆 It’s a constant chase for what we are wanting to hear I’m mixing a record and it’s been all in the box and for fun I thought I’d stem it out on a the Trident 80 at the studio. I liked the in the box mix better…which was a bit surprising and has kind of got me off the idea of a summing mixer and back to something like the Silver Bullet which just adds some tone and transformers. Eventually I’m going to get my Auditronics hooked up again. I will say with outboard/a console is it nice just grabbing an EQ and being like “that’s better”. The Auditronics would be good for that since it’s just a couple frequencies per band (if you’ve used the Purple Audio ODD that what they are based on). I remember the last time I had it hooked up I pulled up a session and just did a quick mix and was like “oh, that was easy” Anyway. If you want more of a sound than sdrr2 desk, try some of the various ray Dratwa plugs under their mix or master buss presets. Fuse vpres and Tcs-68 tascam 688 strip, the black rooster vpre 73 Neve, plugin alliance neold v76u73. You won’t get the crosstalk except in the Tascam strip but you will get color and depth effects |
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Post by yewtreemagic on Oct 4, 2022 11:26:33 GMT -6
Ah, that confirms my SDRR2 listening test results with your suggested settings the other day then Dan - I could definitely hear the change/improvement, but it was extremely subtle, so I assumed you must be recommending its use as a cumulative thing rather than a colour (like many people use Kazrog's True Iron, although I still tend to push its settings to use as individual track colour). Yes, I too tend to reach for the Ray's Fuse Audio Preamps and Tascam plug-in for colour. Actually I've just discovered his Instagram page, and didn't realise he was a drummer - that explains a lot to me about his modeling choices  |
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Post by kcatthedog on Oct 5, 2022 3:57:22 GMT -6
Just a thought, when @shadow ran some files through his Bettermaker limiter, it sounded sublime, that extra depth, space and euphonics: maybe you’d like it or can try one, not cheap, but nice, nice, very nice !
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Post by EmRR on Oct 5, 2022 11:29:38 GMT -6
My how times have changed, I didn’t notice a single reference to using anything vintage at all.
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Post by Mister Chase on Oct 5, 2022 11:31:06 GMT -6
Just a thought, when @shadow ran some files through his Bettermaker limiter, it sounded sublime, that extra depth, space and euphonics: maybe you’d like it or can try one, not cheap, but nice, nice, very nice ! Like it's name, it must be able to do some nice stuff! Good thought. I will look into one. Thanks! |
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Post by drbill on Oct 5, 2022 11:31:15 GMT -6
, not cheap, but nice, nice, very nice ! Ambrosia fan eh?  |
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Post by Mister Chase on Oct 5, 2022 11:33:45 GMT -6
Anyone like the SPL Stereo Vitalizer mk 2-T?
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Post by kcatthedog on Oct 5, 2022 13:58:11 GMT -6
, not cheap, but nice, nice, very nice ! Ambrosia fan eh? They were nice, nice, very nice! |
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Post by drbill on Oct 5, 2022 14:22:39 GMT -6
My how times have changed, I didn’t notice a single reference to using anything vintage at all. Back in the day you didn't NEED anything vintage on the 2 bus. No one put anything on the 2 bus. You had a console and a tape machine. A few dedicated folks still doing that,,,, |
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Post by nobtwiddler on Oct 5, 2022 14:48:47 GMT -6
"Anyone like the SPL Stereo Vitalizer mk 2-T?"
I use the SPL Vitalizer SX-2 (NON TUBE) on just about every mix!
Very understated piece.
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Post by AgnosticGospel on Oct 5, 2022 15:27:16 GMT -6
Indeed. Curious about its effect on spatial sense... I can speak to this if anyone wants. I've tried all the plugins mentioned. Honestly, they rarely get used and never on mix bus when they do. I have 8 Silver Bullets - 3 of the the newer mk2's, which are especially killer for height / width and dimension (the A and Aspect Ratio excell on this), and 5 of the originals which get used on individual instruments/vocals and busses primarily. I have the Manley VariMu which primarily gets used on Piano during mixing, and for mastering duties on final mixes pre SBmk2 (again) and Miad LCPQ4040's - very rarely to never on the mix buss during mixing. I have ZOD IDDI's which live on the 2 buss after the Silver Bullet mk2's 99% of the time during mixing. The ZOD IDDI's are incredible, insanely affordable for what they do, and they are used here constantly for lending that "tube" vibe. When I just need a tube vibe and don't need compression, they get the call over the Manley's, Coil CA70's, Locomotive 14B's, Weight Tanks, and 286A's, VComps, Tube EQP's, etc.. If I need to go very retro, the Coil's or VComps can come into play. The 14B's are very cool, but bring things to the front, which kind of works against me when mixing. Perfect for vocals for me. For instant mix goodness, the SBmk2's followed by the ZOD's instantly get me 150% further than anything I have ever tried ITB. Instantly - just my standard settings on the mk2 with the ZODs. So easy and simple it feels like cheating. Always easy, very rarely to never do they ever get in the way of the musical output. And rarely do I even have to twist a knob. They just work. I prefer the ZOD's over the Manley on the mix buss for size - although I must say, I've never tried the above technique of turning the threshold all the way up and not using it for compression - just box tone. That's sounds interesting, but I'm pretty familiar with the Manley's box tone, and for work flow and max dollar impact, I'd rather use the Manley on Piano and the ZOD's on mix buss. The Manley VariMu has been my absolute favorite piano compressor of all time. It's got high headroom so it doesn't crap out on transient hits, and it softens up ITB VSTi pianos that can easily get harsh. The softening it gives on the 2Bus in not what I'm looking for these days. The ZOD's give me some size that seems unique to tube gear, and the SB can open the mix up a bit more with it's AIR EQ if they get too "tubey" for a particular song. I have not tried the LTL Pentodes in the mk2's. I really should have. Nobody tell Brad. Hahaha! I'm enjoying the API>NEVE>SSL topology that it comes standard with though and am reticent to swap out the SSL for a tube mojo amp. Never been a big SSL fan, but honestly, the SSL circuit in the SB is pretty special for what it adds. The aspect ratio on the mk2 has really upped my mixing game considerably in terms of width/height - and I thought I was pretty good before mk2. LOL That's my thoughts. If you have any other questions, fire away. I use all the above every day when mixing. (Which is most days lately) Holy crap did you ever just send me on an expensive bunch of google searches! Thanks for all of this info and all of these products to check out. I'd never even heard of a silver bullet, but now I have to go listen to some YouTubes of it. |
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Post by drbill on Oct 5, 2022 15:36:47 GMT -6
I can speak to this if anyone wants. I've tried all the plugins mentioned. Honestly, they rarely get used and never on mix bus when they do. I have 8 Silver Bullets - 3 of the the newer mk2's, which are especially killer for height / width and dimension (the A and Aspect Ratio excell on this), and 5 of the originals which get used on individual instruments/vocals and busses primarily. I have the Manley VariMu which primarily gets used on Piano during mixing, and for mastering duties on final mixes pre SBmk2 (again) and Miad LCPQ4040's - very rarely to never on the mix buss during mixing. I have ZOD IDDI's which live on the 2 buss after the Silver Bullet mk2's 99% of the time during mixing. The ZOD IDDI's are incredible, insanely affordable for what they do, and they are used here constantly for lending that "tube" vibe. When I just need a tube vibe and don't need compression, they get the call over the Manley's, Coil CA70's, Locomotive 14B's, Weight Tanks, and 286A's, VComps, Tube EQP's, etc.. If I need to go very retro, the Coil's or VComps can come into play. The 14B's are very cool, but bring things to the front, which kind of works against me when mixing. Perfect for vocals for me. For instant mix goodness, the SBmk2's followed by the ZOD's instantly get me 150% further than anything I have ever tried ITB. Instantly - just my standard settings on the mk2 with the ZODs. So easy and simple it feels like cheating. Always easy, very rarely to never do they ever get in the way of the musical output. And rarely do I even have to twist a knob. They just work. I prefer the ZOD's over the Manley on the mix buss for size - although I must say, I've never tried the above technique of turning the threshold all the way up and not using it for compression - just box tone. That's sounds interesting, but I'm pretty familiar with the Manley's box tone, and for work flow and max dollar impact, I'd rather use the Manley on Piano and the ZOD's on mix buss. The Manley VariMu has been my absolute favorite piano compressor of all time. It's got high headroom so it doesn't crap out on transient hits, and it softens up ITB VSTi pianos that can easily get harsh. The softening it gives on the 2Bus in not what I'm looking for these days. The ZOD's give me some size that seems unique to tube gear, and the SB can open the mix up a bit more with it's AIR EQ if they get too "tubey" for a particular song. I have not tried the LTL Pentodes in the mk2's. I really should have. Nobody tell Brad. Hahaha! I'm enjoying the API>NEVE>SSL topology that it comes standard with though and am reticent to swap out the SSL for a tube mojo amp. Never been a big SSL fan, but honestly, the SSL circuit in the SB is pretty special for what it adds. The aspect ratio on the mk2 has really upped my mixing game considerably in terms of width/height - and I thought I was pretty good before mk2. LOL That's my thoughts. If you have any other questions, fire away. I use all the above every day when mixing. (Which is most days lately) Holy crap did you ever just send me on an expensive bunch of google searches! Thanks for all of this info and all of these products to check out. I'd never even heard of a silver bullet, but now I have to go listen to some YouTubes of it. Haha!! Sorry bout that. LOL. If you have any questions on any of it - fire away. I created the Silver Bullet with Brad @ louderthanliftoff.com. There are some older clips there of the mk1 version that will give you a rough idea. The mk2 is a significant step up IMO. |
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Post by AgnosticGospel on Oct 5, 2022 15:58:06 GMT -6
Holy crap did you ever just send me on an expensive bunch of google searches! Thanks for all of this info and all of these products to check out. I'd never even heard of a silver bullet, but now I have to go listen to some YouTubes of it. Haha!! Sorry bout that. LOL. If you have any questions on any of it - fire away. I created the Silver Bullet with Brad @ louderthanliftoff.com. There are some older clips there of the mk1 version that will give you a rough idea. The mk2 is a significant step up IMO. It sounds outstanding. I think like the OP, I am looking for something tubier. I play jazz and blues B3, so I'm always looking for something to give me that 50s-60s sizzle on the 2buss. I want something to make up for the fact that I'll never own a tape machine or an old Langevin Tube Console. Edit: So far I'm thinking either 2x V-Comps or 2x IGS Tubecore 500s. They have the transformers and tubes, plus compression. |
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Post by drbill on Oct 5, 2022 17:47:41 GMT -6
Haha!! Sorry bout that. LOL. If you have any questions on any of it - fire away. I created the Silver Bullet with Brad @ louderthanliftoff.com. There are some older clips there of the mk1 version that will give you a rough idea. The mk2 is a significant step up IMO. It sounds outstanding. I think like the OP, I am looking for something tubier. I play jazz and blues B3, so I'm always looking for something to give me that 50s-60s sizzle on the 2buss. I want something to make up for the fact that I'll never own a tape machine or an old Langevin Tube Console. Edit: So far I'm thinking either 2x V-Comps or 2x IGS Tubecore 500s. They have the transformers and tubes, plus compression. The V Comps will certainly do that - but they are not designed to work in stereo. I have tried them there before though. When they work, they are super cool. Mostly they don't work for that application for me - they don't tend to track well in stereo on program material. The ZOD's are not compression, but they ARE tube, and the have transformers in them as big as my fist. Those and a SBmk2 will take you way over the top. Also, you CAN put tubes inside the Silver Bullet - yielding what you probably are looking for. |
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Post by chipbuttie on Oct 5, 2022 19:22:04 GMT -6
What are you using to attenuate the signal going into the ZOD’s? I have one but I’ve only ever used it as a DI (and occasionally with dynamic mic’s) will try it as an insert when mixing!
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Post by drbill on Oct 5, 2022 19:59:34 GMT -6
What are you using to attenuate the signal going into the ZOD’s? I have one but I’ve only ever used it as a DI (and occasionally with dynamic mic’s) will try it as an insert when mixing! Dan makes an XLR adapter that changes the impedance for line level signals. Give him a shout. He probably has a shelf full of them, or he'll make one for you. They were not expensive. |
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Post by AgnosticGospel on Oct 5, 2022 20:17:14 GMT -6
It sounds outstanding. I think like the OP, I am looking for something tubier. I play jazz and blues B3, so I'm always looking for something to give me that 50s-60s sizzle on the 2buss. I want something to make up for the fact that I'll never own a tape machine or an old Langevin Tube Console. Edit: So far I'm thinking either 2x V-Comps or 2x IGS Tubecore 500s. They have the transformers and tubes, plus compression. The V Comps will certainly do that - but they are not designed to work in stereo. I have tried them there before though. When they work, they are super cool. Mostly they don't work for that application for me - they don't tend to track well in stereo on program material. Just curious a did you get the V-comps with the stereo link installed in the back? This is something Audioscape has been offering more recently, but I've yet to talk to anybody who actually has a) The stereo link installed and b) two of them!🤣 |
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Post by drbill on Oct 5, 2022 23:58:09 GMT -6
No stereo link here. I have the originals with NOS 6386 tubes.
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Post by mike on Oct 6, 2022 4:24:35 GMT -6
Edit: So far I'm thinking either 2x V-Comps or 2x IGS Tubecore 500s. They have the transformers and tubes, plus compression.
FWIW - Like the OP when I was looking for something for buss/tracking that had 3d soundstage/depth (and I agree with his comment that tubes can do a decent job of that effect), I came across a mastering compressor comparison on the purple site that had a link to 110 audio clips running the same couple song snippets through most of the well known mastering compressors to compare. While sonic preference is subjective, I really liked the IGS Tubecore 3U, and later also noticed a before and after clip through a friends 3U seemed to add both a polished finish and dimension to the audio. You mentioned being interested in 2x IGS Tubecore 500s above, so thought I'd suggest you can periodically find the IGS Tubecore 3U like I did used for about the same price as 2 new 500 series. The 3U has Bypass/Stereo/Mid/Side Modes - Sidechain HPF - and a Mix Wet/Dry knob to go along with its compressor settings using ELMA stepped switches, FWIW.
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