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Post by delcampo on Jun 23, 2022 8:50:08 GMT -6
One small unexciting point. The songs I’ve produced that sounded the biggest, most full, dynamic and all round awesome …. where the songs not necessarily made with the best gear but the songs that had the best arrangements. Quoted again for emphasis. As much as love the console, cool HW etc & the depth it usually brings to a good track (albeit after the all the routing & tweak work it takes to add the HW mix stage for a lazy person like me) ...This ^ always. Arrangement is the best big-ifier. Also, balancing too much loss of transient detail when going through the later HW stages (after you worked so hard to get & maintain the ITB working mixes to be solid) can at least to me, be a tricky juggling act. But whatever get ya there.
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Post by tasteliketape on Jun 23, 2022 11:21:59 GMT -6
Ok so I’m going to say you absolutely do not ! But I sure as hell love my Capi summing!!
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Post by delcampo on Jun 23, 2022 13:59:55 GMT -6
Ok so I’m going to say you absolutely do not ! But I sure as hell love my Capi summing!! If I didn’t have a console and wanted to get a summing solution, after owning a few boxes in the past, the Capi would be the one.
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Post by thehightenor on Jun 24, 2022 2:41:04 GMT -6
Does anyone own a Neve 8816?
I do think this summer has some of the vibe of the 88RS desk having similar topology.
But I have read many times about poor build quality and dodgy pots .... is that true or just the internet rumour mill in action?
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Post by bentley on Jun 24, 2022 13:23:27 GMT -6
Does anyone own a Neve 8816? I do think this summer has some of the vibe of the 88RS desk having similar topology. But I have read many times about poor build quality and dodgy pots .... is that true or just the internet rumour mill in action? Had an 8816 quite a while back. Only issue I had was the recall software never worked. Definitely had a sound to it and the monitoring section was a great feature. Width knob was pretty cool. Sold it only because I needed to raise some funds for other things and my workflow no longer justified keeping it.
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Post by thehightenor on Jun 24, 2022 13:44:31 GMT -6
Does anyone own a Neve 8816? I do think this summer has some of the vibe of the 88RS desk having similar topology. But I have read many times about poor build quality and dodgy pots .... is that true or just the internet rumour mill in action? Had an 8816 quite a while back. Only issue I had was the recall software never worked. Definitely had a sound to it and the monitoring section was a great feature. Width knob was pretty cool. Sold it only because I needed to raise some funds for other things and my workflow no longer justified keeping it. Cool - thanks for that. I watched this TV show about Dave Gilmour and his amazing house boat studio on the Thames (near London) and in it he had a Neve 88RS desk. I love the sound of his solo albums (even though I write very different music to him) they sound very 3D and great depth. There's no way I can afford or have room for an 88RS of course. There's the Neve 8424 which is very compact but still cost with flying fader $30K + and you really need a $1K a year warranty subscription which is fine if you have very high paying clients. So that bring brings me to the Neve 8816 as a poor mans Neve desk (so to speak) Still with decent converters and all the looming - it won't be a cheap project if I decided to go own this route!
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Post by nobtwiddler on Jun 25, 2022 4:39:13 GMT -6
I've had one (8816) since it was released.... Use it everyday. Had one problem, which I did have to send it back for repair. But, as long as you have the latest software / firmware, the unit works as it should as does the recall.
For the money, and its size, with the Fader Pack it's really an amazing little unit. Packs a lot of great features in it's small size! And it sounds wonderful, to boot.
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Post by Johnkenn on Jun 25, 2022 18:56:14 GMT -6
I promise I'm not trying to sound mean and this isn't really aimed at you anyway. On a more direct note Greg, not everyone sees it as "freeing"..
I don’t see at as mean at all and the shoe does fit me. I had to learn the lesson for myself. I should have qualified the “freeing” part as To, me it has been freeing. When I made the decision that my time and money was better spent hiring a mixer and spending my time writing and tracking, I have been much happier. We all find happiness in different ways and I was not trying to imply that anyone was being constricted by their own musical journey. I completely get this. I think I’m just now getting to the point where I’d be ok with tracking (playing) AND mixing my own stuff. It’s overwhelming. Hey David Bowie didn’t play the guitar part in Let’s Dance. He didn’t mix it. He didn’t master it.
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Post by Johnkenn on Jun 25, 2022 18:57:46 GMT -6
One small unexciting point. The songs I’ve produced that sounded the biggest, most full, dynamic and all round awesome …. where the songs not necessarily made with the best gear but the songs that had the best arrangements. I’d add that the best songs are the ones that sound the best. I guess you can eff up a great song, but it’s less likely than making a shitty one sound great.
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ji43
Junior Member
Posts: 60
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Post by ji43 on Jun 29, 2022 5:58:04 GMT -6
What's a high quality solution to bring line level down to mic level on the 2 bus. Would like to explore running a mix through a pair of tube preamps for "makeup gain". The preamps I have have a 20db pad, though I'm not sure that's enough padding...thoughts?
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Post by Guitar on Jun 29, 2022 7:28:02 GMT -6
What's a high quality solution to bring line level down to mic level on the 2 bus. Would like to explore running a mix through a pair of tube preamps for "makeup gain". The preamps I have have a 20db pad, though I'm not sure that's enough padding...thoughts?
DIYRE Line 2 Pre or whatever they call it, basically a reamp. I copied this design. I have 4 here along with something like a "Folcrom," just a simple summing mixer.
Compared to a summing mixer, there is very little difference, when using the same preamps for makeup gain. Like Dr. Bill has said, most of the tone really is that makeup gain.
In reality? I don't use either one of them. But they can be neat.
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Post by EmRR on Jun 29, 2022 11:56:56 GMT -6
What's a high quality solution to bring line level down to mic level on the 2 bus. Would like to explore running a mix through a pair of tube preamps for "makeup gain". The preamps I have have a 20db pad, though I'm not sure that's enough padding...thoughts? Resistive pad. If you’re worried about absolute balance and noise rejection (theoretical) it points to precision metal film resistors, 1% or better through manual selection. You could go the other way and use carbon comp, would you tell a diff? Who knows. Probably not. I get away with the 20 dB pad all the time. Need more, Shure and others make line->mic pads in the 40-50dB range. There’s no particular “high quality” aspect to shop for. You can also do something like put a pair of 2k7-4k7 resistors in an in-line barrel and use it in combination with the 20dB pad, you’d simply be increasing the attenuation. Exact value to your needs. Punk rock version, dual 5k linear pot in combo with the 20 pad. You can also just lower your master into the 20 pad.
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Post by svart on Jun 29, 2022 12:14:56 GMT -6
What's a high quality solution to bring line level down to mic level on the 2 bus. Would like to explore running a mix through a pair of tube preamps for "makeup gain". The preamps I have have a 20db pad, though I'm not sure that's enough padding...thoughts? Resistive pad. If you’re worried about absolute balance and noise rejection (theoretical) it points to precision metal film resistors, 1% or better through manual selection. You could go the other way and use carbon comp, would you tell a diff? Who knows. Probably not. I get away with the 20 dB pad all the time. Need more, Shure and others make line->mic pads in the 40-50dB range. There’s no particular “high quality” aspect to shop for. You can also do something like put a pair of 2k7-4k7 resistors in an in-line barrel and use it in combination with the 20dB pad, you’d simply be increasing the attenuation. Exact value to your needs. Punk rock version, dual 5k linear pot in combo with the 20 pad. You can also just lower your master into the 20 pad. Carbon composition resistors are another semi-myth. "Noisy", yes, but such noise is so low you only notice when amplified quite a lot. Biggest issue with carbon composition is that they drift with current/heat and tend to absorb water over time also causing drift.
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Post by EmRR on Jun 29, 2022 13:12:33 GMT -6
Resistive pad. If you’re worried about absolute balance and noise rejection (theoretical) it points to precision metal film resistors, 1% or better through manual selection. You could go the other way and use carbon comp, would you tell a diff? Who knows. Probably not. I get away with the 20 dB pad all the time. Need more, Shure and others make line->mic pads in the 40-50dB range. There’s no particular “high quality” aspect to shop for. You can also do something like put a pair of 2k7-4k7 resistors in an in-line barrel and use it in combination with the 20dB pad, you’d simply be increasing the attenuation. Exact value to your needs. Punk rock version, dual 5k linear pot in combo with the 20 pad. You can also just lower your master into the 20 pad. Carbon composition resistors are another semi-myth. "Noisy", yes, but such noise is so low you only notice when amplified quite a lot. Biggest issue with carbon composition is that they drift with current/heat and tend to absorb water over time also causing drift. yeah old carbon is a great way to make noise in high Z circuits. There's a paper that shows carbon produces much larger amounts of 2nd harmonic when there's a large voltage differential across it, not so much when it's low. So........if you have quiet carbon in a tube circuit in positions with large voltage differentials, you may perceive greater 2nd, if it's absorbed humidity and noise has risen you will also get.....higher noise..... I frequently replace carbon cathode and plate resistors that measure in spec in old gear and lower noise significantly, like 6-12dB. OTOH, tubes themselves are also frequently noisier than the carbon surrounding them.... Party on.....do what thou wilt as the satanists say.....
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Post by allbuttonmode on Jul 1, 2022 1:57:49 GMT -6
Does anyone own a Neve 8816? I do think this summer has some of the vibe of the 88RS desk having similar topology. But I have read many times about poor build quality and dodgy pots .... is that true or just the internet rumour mill in action? I had the 8816 some years ago. Sounded great, but the build quality/design was a nightmare. Bad pots and buttons, stereo image moving. A totally unreliable piece of gear. Sent it back to AMS Neve to get it fixed. Came back the same. I gave up on it, and sold it at a colossal loss. Because of that one, and the way they handled the repair, I’ve never considered another piece of AMS Neve gear.
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Post by Quint on Jul 1, 2022 9:09:19 GMT -6
Does anyone own a Neve 8816? I do think this summer has some of the vibe of the 88RS desk having similar topology. But I have read many times about poor build quality and dodgy pots .... is that true or just the internet rumour mill in action? I had the 8816 some years ago. Sounded great, but the build quality/design was a nightmare. Bad pots and buttons, stereo image moving. A totally unreliable piece of gear. Sent it back to AMS Neve to get it fixed. Came back the same. I gave up on it, and sold it at a colossal loss. Because of that one, and the way they handled the repair, I’ve never considered another piece of AMS Neve gear. I've heard that about the 8816 elsewhere too. For whatever reason, contemporary AMS Neve stuff just doesn't interest me. Build quality. Price for what you get. The knowledge that Rupert isn't actually involved. Whatever. It just turns me off for some reason. Contemporary API gives me the same vibe too. RND makes cool stuff though. CAPI too. (Insert some of the other high quality clones available these days too.)
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Post by sirthought on Jul 6, 2022 22:24:50 GMT -6
What's a high quality solution to bring line level down to mic level on the 2 bus. Would like to explore running a mix through a pair of tube preamps for "makeup gain". The preamps I have have a 20db pad, though I'm not sure that's enough padding...thoughts? The Rolls Music RMS 216 Folcrom might do the trick pretty well. It's been a number of years ago, but F. Reid Shippen wrote a review in Tape Op about doing this very thing. He ran outs to a Folcrom and then into two tube preamps and then back into the box. TLDR: He thought it was a great option. vintageking.com/roll-music-systems-rms216-folcrom
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Post by notneeson on Jul 6, 2022 22:57:44 GMT -6
What's a high quality solution to bring line level down to mic level on the 2 bus. Would like to explore running a mix through a pair of tube preamps for "makeup gain". The preamps I have have a 20db pad, though I'm not sure that's enough padding...thoughts? The Rolls Music RMS 216 Folcrom might do the trick pretty well. It's been a number of years ago, but F. Reid Shippen wrote a review in Tape Op about doing this very thing. He ran outs to a Folcrom and then into two tube preamps and then back into the box. TLDR: He thought it was a great option. vintageking.com/roll-music-systems-rms216-folcromAlso, DW Fearn makes a pad for this use case, I believe. Probably sounds similar to the Folcrom if you use the same preamp, now that I think about it. Edit: Avedis makes one too.
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