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Post by nomatic on Oct 4, 2021 9:51:41 GMT -6
That would be the sh!t.....
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Post by lando on Oct 4, 2021 9:53:24 GMT -6
I just heard from a friend in Austin who has seen the new machines from Apple engineers that the M1x units will be out in November. He was talking 10 Core with 64 Gigs of unified Ram as an option. Apparently these computers are unreal fast.... I will be getting a Laptop and running my world off it.. If that is true it is probably the biggest jump forward in laptop performance in many years. Decades maybe. Apple silicon is very cool indeed, and I’m super exited that they are fining their way back to the “pro” market after many incredibly frustrating years with super wierd hardware design choices 100% based on looks and size. Really hoping for the return of MagSafe and some more ports besides usb-c/thunderbolt.
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Post by gouge on Oct 4, 2021 15:21:23 GMT -6
I just heard from a friend in Austin who has seen the new machines from Apple engineers that the M1x units will be out in November. He was talking 10 Core with 64 Gigs of unified Ram as an option. Apparently these computers are unreal fast.... I will be getting a Laptop and running my world off it.. If that is true it is probably the biggest jump forward in laptop performance in many years. Decades maybe. Apple silicon is very cool indeed, and I’m super exited that they are fining their way back to the “pro” market after many incredibly frustrating years with super wierd hardware design choices 100% based on looks and size. Really hoping for the return of MagSafe and some more ports besides usb-c/thunderbolt. i can buy an intel 8 core with 64gig ram now from dell. thats been out for a while and can clock up around 5ghz in turbo. im not sure what more the mac brings to the table.
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Post by lando on Oct 4, 2021 15:56:46 GMT -6
If that is true it is probably the biggest jump forward in laptop performance in many years. Decades maybe. Apple silicon is very cool indeed, and I’m super exited that they are fining their way back to the “pro” market after many incredibly frustrating years with super wierd hardware design choices 100% based on looks and size. Really hoping for the return of MagSafe and some more ports besides usb-c/thunderbolt. i can buy an intel 8 core with 64gig ram now from dell. thats been out for a while and can clock up around 5ghz in turbo. im not sure what more the mac brings to the table. If M1 is anything to go by it might bring superior speed (when using programs coded for it) with exponentially less heat, so no throttling or loud fans, much more battery time while still being very slim. But it’s not out yet so who knows? That’s it least what I hope for. M1 was quite remarkable, looked like a bit of a generation change and that’s not something that at least I have seen for some years.
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Post by gouge on Oct 4, 2021 16:09:15 GMT -6
there are benchmarks online that enable comparison.
intel looks pretty good.
apple may be playing catch up.
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Post by jeremygillespie on Oct 4, 2021 16:18:05 GMT -6
If that is true it is probably the biggest jump forward in laptop performance in many years. Decades maybe. Apple silicon is very cool indeed, and I’m super exited that they are fining their way back to the “pro” market after many incredibly frustrating years with super wierd hardware design choices 100% based on looks and size. Really hoping for the return of MagSafe and some more ports besides usb-c/thunderbolt. i can buy an intel 8 core with 64gig ram now from dell. thats been out for a while and can clock up around 5ghz in turbo. im not sure what more the mac brings to the table. Stability for those with no interest in doing anything more than turning the computer on and getting to work. I’ve got no interest in taking time to deal with anything other than that. Hell I don’t even have any interest in knowing how it works.
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Post by kcatthedog on Oct 4, 2021 16:26:02 GMT -6
It’s been a while since I have seen an Intel machine outperform an equivalent m1.
In fact, quite the opposite, with the m1 outperforming the Intel. The soc architecture is just inherently more efficient, uses less electricity and runs cooler and quieter.
The next gen M series and pro configurations, bigger ram and more I/o, should be very appealing .
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Post by gouge on Oct 4, 2021 18:52:27 GMT -6
this is of interest for me atm as i'm toying with the idea of an upgrade and so considering both platforms. long time intel user with no stability issues. benchmarks are here. am not sure apple is in front which is what is claimed with the m1x in the media. www.cpu-monkey.com/en/cpu_benchmark-cinebench_r23_single_core-15i notice the intel can accept twice the ram.
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Post by OtisGreying on Oct 4, 2021 19:50:41 GMT -6
this is of interest for me atm as i'm toying with the idea of an upgrade and so considering both platforms. long time intel user with no stability issues. benchmarks are here. am not sure apple is in front which is what is claimed with the m1x in the media. www.cpu-monkey.com/en/cpu_benchmark-cinebench_r23_single_core-15i notice the intel can accept twice the ram. Well now almost a year later since M1, yes it looks like intel has caught up and surpassed with their most recent 12th gen. This obviously wasn’t the case when m1 came out. But now you’re intel offerings will just be PC. And M1x will be released most likely in the next 2 months, which may be even faster than intel 12th gen. Obviously every company is gonna be playing catch up to every company after they JUST release their fastest best offering. Intel will surely lose 1st place as soon as AMD and Apple release their next offering, just as it always has been. For me, going PC for a 15% power increase is a non-starter, I would never do it, especially considering the new silicon chips are way faster than anything I’ve used up till this point already. And in two months for all we know M1x could be benchmark better than 12th gen intel.
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Post by kcatthedog on Oct 4, 2021 21:22:26 GMT -6
I don’t think ram comparisons by size say 16 gig normal vs 16 gig soc apples to apples as the soc is more efficient. If that was the only difference in two computers the soc should should process more efficiently by design.
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Post by gouge on Oct 4, 2021 21:27:19 GMT -6
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Post by drumsound on Oct 4, 2021 23:09:46 GMT -6
i can buy an intel 8 core with 64gig ram now from dell. thats been out for a while and can clock up around 5ghz in turbo. im not sure what more the mac brings to the table. Stability for those with no interest in doing anything more than turning the computer on and getting to work. I’ve got no interest in taking time to deal with anything other than that. Hell I don’t even have any interest in knowing how it works. THIS!
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Post by Johnkenn on Oct 4, 2021 23:17:49 GMT -6
I'm waiting for the m4 because they said it would have a zero point energy generator and be able to read minds. #ban
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Post by rowmat on Oct 4, 2021 23:28:33 GMT -6
I'm waiting for the m4 because they said it would have a zero point energy generator and be able to read minds. Well I just hope they upgraded the Flux Capacitor to the 8th generation version.
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Post by OtisGreying on Oct 5, 2021 2:29:03 GMT -6
So what do you like about the benchmark as far as intel? It's 1% faster single core and slower multi core. If you come from a mac background, I see zero draw for going Intel. If you come from PC I see zero draw for going mac either. Seems like the (tiny) benchmark differences don't hold nearly as much importance as the workflow changes that may/may not come from whichever system choose.
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Post by kcatthedog on Oct 5, 2021 4:44:26 GMT -6
I think we all get used to our platform, OS and environment. When I switched from Win to Mac, at first I hated it, thought mac , gimmicky and stupid, but really zero problems, running tbolt, now I wouldn’t even think about switching back to Win.
Mac just works, hell I am still running a 2012, i7, 16g ram and 2 internal ssd. I bought an m1 mini but at the time had OS/big sur compatibility problems with my Aurora n, no probs with Catalina, so I returned m1: thought let’s see what next gen is like.
There will always be performance differences on paper: all that matters is we each get our work done and appreciate our systems.
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Post by popmann on Oct 5, 2021 15:03:55 GMT -6
I think the problem with silly Geekbench and Cinebenchs is---that's a specific DSP load. Mostly "full out", "how quickly can it go"...DSP load. Which other than an occasional* offline render, isn't even a factor in a DAW. If you look at a modern what PASSES for a "DAW" but isn't--a MIDI sequencing, VI hosting, amp sim hosting, music making software....raw DSP power is nearly never the bottleneck. I JUST had Windows update make my Mixbus32c sputtery visually (audio was fine)...WTF? 3 years in...first time that has really caused an issue. Cubase? Fine. Had to update the GPU driver. All fixed. But, my POINT in that isn't "oooh windows sucks"--it's that the GPU DRIVER...was THE...ONE...and only thing that caused my ONE DAW to stop working well.
I maintain that some UUUUgge percentage of peopel storing samples on external USB and FW drives...see their DAW DSP meter "over" and think an instrument is super CPU demanding. Because the meter is what again? Percentage of time it takes to fill the audio buffer. You have a 20ms buff and it takes 10ms to fill it, the read out is 50%...when you're using multiple vendor VIs streaming from various discs...OpenGL (ok NOW Metal on OSX) GPU calls being made by the DAW AND different vendor plug ins...ANY micro timing delay, increases that "DSP percentage"--bad GPU call that has to be then passed off to the CPU to render...slow disk retrieving a sample to stream...USB latency on external audio drive...running out of RAM and having to compress/decompress...all of the above makes that percentage go up.
The POTENTIAL of the Apple Silicon that they have the ABILITY to alleviate many bottlenecks and inconsistencies in more "whole system" performance--they don't need to match the DSP power exactly...and the COST of that...is that you will HAVE to buy your RAM and (sample) storage from Apple...PERIOD. Now--I don't mean you can't record audio to external TB/USBC drives...I mean that if you want to run VSL strings and Superior3 kits in every project, with this new level of performance, it will need to live on the integrated storage controller chips.
In the mean time...I'm considering installing Catalina on my tower. Last intel only version of OSX. Seems like a good time to do it.
*I mean offline render function vary app to app...and even between third party plug ins...
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Post by gouge on Oct 5, 2021 15:49:54 GMT -6
So what do you like about the benchmark as far as intel? It's 1% faster single core and slower multi core. If you come from a mac background, I see zero draw for going Intel. If you come from PC I see zero draw for going mac either. Seems like the (tiny) benchmark differences don't hold nearly as much importance as the workflow changes that may/may not come from whichever system choose. yeah i agree completely with your post. what i was liking about the apple is the idea of a big performamce boost. ive started using ipads in my work life so the operating system is no longer foreign. if the performance boost was real i would swap. i have been told by colleagues and read on forums to wait till the new apple chips come out as they will blitz intel etc etc. turns out not to be true.
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Post by sirthought on Oct 5, 2021 19:20:01 GMT -6
We've all seen the articles pointing to impressive speed and performance with the M1 chips.
Maybe there are faster Intel offerings now, but are those as heat efficient?
To me the main attraction is being able to track without fan noise becoming a concern. And M1 owners are all saying their systems aren't getting hot like previous options. Some Mac owners didn't have it, but a good portion did. My Intel Mini has been better than my older i7 MBP...which sounded like a jet plane was landing in the studio.
And there have also been ample tests showing huge projects in Logic and Final Cut taking on tasks faster than with the Intel chips. That's exciting to think that M1x could be even better.
I know you can build a better Intel machine than what Apple offered, but not with Mac OS, which handles thunderbolt interfaces a thousand times better and, IMHO, thunderbolt is the preferred carrier of tracking for a pro mobile system, which is often my gig. USB4 may very well change that, but for now Thunderbolt interfaces at the top for throughput.
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Post by gouge on Oct 5, 2021 22:18:03 GMT -6
do you have any data on mac being superior with thunderbolt?
isn't thunderbolt an intel thing? it's available on intel laptops
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Post by BenjaminAshlin on Oct 5, 2021 22:18:33 GMT -6
I don’t think ram comparisons by size say 16 gig normal vs 16 gig soc apples to apples as the soc is more efficient. If that was the only difference in two computers the soc should should process more efficiently by design. A VST won't necessarily benefit from this efficiency as they are loading all the samples into memory at once to allow the audio buffer to fill in time. Once the memory is full it will need to start using virtual memory.
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Post by gouge on Oct 5, 2021 22:36:04 GMT -6
the other thing ive always been unclear on is multi core v single core in respect to daw performamce
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Post by Mister Chase on Oct 5, 2021 22:36:38 GMT -6
do you have any data on mac being superior with thunderbolt? isn't thunderbolt an intel thing? it's available on intel laptops A little slower round trip latency on my new M1 Mac via Tbolt compared to my 5 year old Intel PC. less than a millisecond though. Comparable.
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Post by dok on Oct 5, 2021 23:14:59 GMT -6
this is of interest for me atm as i'm toying with the idea of an upgrade and so considering both platforms. long time intel user with no stability issues. benchmarks are here. am not sure apple is in front which is what is claimed with the m1x in the media. www.cpu-monkey.com/en/cpu_benchmark-cinebench_r23_single_core-15i notice the intel can accept twice the ram. You notice the Intel can accept twice the RAM, but not that the Apple performs just as well with half the RAM and half the power draw? Okay, LOL. Either way, I seriously have to question the benchmarks on a system that zero people have access to at the moment. There are literally zero claims about the m1x in the media right now because it hasn't even been announced. Nobody even knows what it will actually be called - "M1X" is only speculation.
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Post by kcatthedog on Oct 6, 2021 0:32:59 GMT -6
I don’t think ram comparisons by size say 16 gig normal vs 16 gig soc apples to apples as the soc is more efficient. If that was the only difference in two computers the soc should should process more efficiently by design. A VST won't necessarily benefit from this efficiency as they are loading all the samples into memory at once to allow the audio buffer to fill in time. Once the memory is full it will need to start using virtual memory. That's a good point but my understanding of the soc architecture is that it still processes faster: maybe it’s an on paper advantage ?
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