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Post by Tbone81 on Jul 10, 2021 12:08:00 GMT -6
Thanks for the replies so far. I’m demoing some fuse audio plugins right now, interested to see how they sound after all the hype. Already own some Tokyo dawn stuff but the only thing I’ve really dug into is the Nova eq, which I like a lot.
I think the question is now, do I pay for a UAD Satellite (current promo sounds great) or spend that same money on either: 1) native plugins 2) an even better computer or 3) both
The big unknown is do I need the extra dsp? With a new Mac M1x will I benefit from the extra processing power or am I fine running everything native (on top of my vsti’s etc)?
You guys who are running lots of vsti’s, how are you handling it?
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Post by gravesnumber9 on Jul 10, 2021 12:20:23 GMT -6
Thanks for the replies so far. I’m demoing some fuse audio plugins right now, interested to see how they sound after all the hype. Already own some Tokyo dawn stuff but the only thing I’ve really dug into is the Nova eq, which I like a lot. I think the question is now, do I pay for a UAD Satellite (current promo sounds great) or spend that same money on either: 1) native plugins 2) an even better computer or 3) both The big unknown is do I need the extra dsp? With a new Mac M1x will I benefit from the extra processing power or am I fine running everything native (on top of my vsti’s etc)? You guys who are running lots of vsti’s, how are you handling it? Is it feasible to buy the new computer before deciding? Then you can fire up a bunch of demos and see. Of course you won’t have the satellite but you could buy and return (or rent?). |
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Post by plinker on Jul 10, 2021 12:21:28 GMT -6
What DAW are you using?
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Post by Tbone81 on Jul 10, 2021 12:24:46 GMT -6
Thanks for the replies so far. I’m demoing some fuse audio plugins right now, interested to see how they sound after all the hype. Already own some Tokyo dawn stuff but the only thing I’ve really dug into is the Nova eq, which I like a lot. I think the question is now, do I pay for a UAD Satellite (current promo sounds great) or spend that same money on either: 1) native plugins 2) an even better computer or 3) both The big unknown is do I need the extra dsp? With a new Mac M1x will I benefit from the extra processing power or am I fine running everything native (on top of my vsti’s etc)? You guys who are running lots of vsti’s, how are you handling it? Is it feasible to buy the new computer before deciding? Then you can fire up a bunch of demos and see. Of course you won’t have the satellite but you could buy and return (or rent?). Well I’m waiting for the M1x to be released to decide which computer/configuration I’m going to get. I’m using this time to reconsider my whole setup (at least when it comes to cpu/dsp etc. |
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Post by Tbone81 on Jul 10, 2021 12:25:21 GMT -6
Cubase 9.5z. But really looking forward to updating, right now I’m as far as I can go on my machine though. |
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Post by phantom on Jul 10, 2021 13:06:18 GMT -6
I don't know about using VST Instruments, as I normally don't use that many, but having a current gen PC and using mostly Native Plugins on my sessions, I don't have any problem running as much plugins as I want.
I also don't remember any plugin that is a CPU Hog. PA, Fuse, Vertigo, Tokyo Dawn, Tone Projects, Klanghelm... they know how to optimize the code.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 10, 2021 14:32:48 GMT -6
Thanks for the replies so far. I’m demoing some fuse audio plugins right now, interested to see how they sound after all the hype. Already own some Tokyo dawn stuff but the only thing I’ve really dug into is the Nova eq, which I like a lot. I think the question is now, do I pay for a UAD Satellite (current promo sounds great) or spend that same money on either: 1) native plugins 2) an even better computer or 3) both The big unknown is do I need the extra dsp? With a new Mac M1x will I benefit from the extra processing power or am I fine running everything native (on top of my vsti’s etc)? You guys who are running lots of vsti’s, how are you handling it? Freeze tracks. Honestly unless you want capitol chambers, Neve 2254, or to track with Unisum pres or auto tune or an amp sim running on the interface, not really. And you can always use an Apollo and freeze. Molot GE FET style: Molot is linear like a FET comp, not logarithmic like a VCA. The DC8C3 input saturation is more fet like. Molot GE’s is based off of Valentin Zvukofor’s mastering tanhx saturator hardware. Molot is its own thing. It was Zvukofor who told me how to use DC8C3 like an 1176 set it to insane, 100% alpha, attack 1ms or faster, crank input as much as you can instead of lowering threshold sidechain high pass filter at 40hz or higher. You must enable it. Saturation on and dynamic feedback must be on Release instant or relaxed to taste experiment with dual stage release settings to get it to do exactly what you want. Sec attack is the charge rate for the secondary release, secondary release is the additional release time, attack mix causes the secondary attack to bleed into the main attack rate. Attack mix will stop Molot from vaporing the tracks when digging in. The ultra fast attack rates actually work. Insane shit happens. Use a shelf afterwards if Molot is eating the highs or lows. If an 1176 is Vietnam, Molot is Stalingrad. In insane mode, it is one of the few plugins capable of inconceivable sonic violence without sounding like a clipper or broken. |
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Post by Guitar on Jul 10, 2021 14:36:29 GMT -6
For VST instruments, I tend to need to freeze once the performance and editing is done, easy in Cubase, frees up a lot of CPU headroom.
Having a computer with a fast core speed (4 GHz ish) seems to be the way to go, and as many cores as you can afford. Intel seems to have a slight edge over AMD here for low latency performance. If you can easily afford the UAD satellite, I don't see why not to buy it, if you already know you'll be using some of the plugins. Not sure where MAC sits because I've never had one.
UAD DSP is not a big help to me, doesn't affect my workflow that much in terms of CPU load. I suppose I could try to use it more heavily to get more benefit. Or I could just use Massenburg EQ's, and so on and not worry about it. Maybe it would be smart to do your overdrive/distortion/saturation on UAD, since those plugins tend to eat up more CPU time by virtue of the need for oversampling to sound right.
With software instruments, using TDR Molot GE and PSP Oldtimer ME is a good way to make a pristine sample sound more "organic" and like a real recording, less perfect. I do this a lot with Superior Drummer to get them sounding more like real drums. They are good for series compression. They bring the darkness.
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Post by ragan on Jul 10, 2021 14:42:47 GMT -6
Thanks for the replies so far. I’m demoing some fuse audio plugins right now, interested to see how they sound after all the hype. Already own some Tokyo dawn stuff but the only thing I’ve really dug into is the Nova eq, which I like a lot. I think the question is now, do I pay for a UAD Satellite (current promo sounds great) or spend that same money on either: 1) native plugins 2) an even better computer or 3) both The big unknown is do I need the extra dsp? With a new Mac M1x will I benefit from the extra processing power or am I fine running everything native (on top of my vsti’s etc)? You guys who are running lots of vsti’s, how are you handling it? I don't know if it counts as "lots" but I always have an instance of SD3, usually a Diva, a couple of Keyscapes and an MTron Pro going. Then lots of plugins. I'm on the current Intel iMac and it handles it with ease. |
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Post by kcatthedog on Jul 10, 2021 14:52:44 GMT -6
Apple has an excellent return policy maybe get a current m1 with 16 gig of ram and demo it, then return for full refund .
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Post by indiehouse on Jul 10, 2021 16:41:24 GMT -6
UAD DSP was helpful to me in extending the life of my older computer. Now that I am on a new iMac, I am flush with native processing power. External DSP isn’t a necessity any longer. UAD plugins are good, but there are native plugins on the same level these days. So, I’d say unless you plan to go Apollo (and/or Luna), and would track through plugins, then it doesn’t make much sense to buy into UAD. Unless maybe you already own a bunch of UAD plugins. Just my experience having been a longtime Apollo user (MKI and MKII). I still have a satellite and a bunch of plugs, but would be just fine if I didn’t. UA’s marketing is killer, though. They got this whole cool kids club vibe. Every time I see an ad I want to go out and buy an Apollo X. And just about every studio shot I see an Apollo X somewhere in the racks. They are definitely popular.
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Post by kcatthedog on Jul 10, 2021 17:09:25 GMT -6
Uaresistance is futile!  |
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Post by ragan on Jul 10, 2021 18:18:44 GMT -6
UAD DSP was helpful to me in extending the life of my older computer. Now that I am on a new iMac, I am flush with native processing power. External DSP isn’t a necessity any longer. UAD plugins are good, but there are native plugins on the same level these days. So, I’d say unless you plan to go Apollo (and/or Luna), and would track through plugins, then it doesn’t make much sense to buy into UAD. Unless maybe you already own a bunch of UAD plugins. Just my experience having been a longtime Apollo user (MKI and MKII). I still have a satellite and a bunch of plugs, but would be just fine if I didn’t. UA’s marketing is killer, though. They got this whole cool kids club vibe. Every time I see an ad I want to go out and buy an Apollo X. And just about every studio shot I see an Apollo X somewhere in the racks. They are definitely popular. They are undisputedly the best at branding their stuff. I've often thought that if Slate would have branded that way instead of the Ed Hardy/Hot Topic/pop punk thing, the sky would be the limit. |
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Post by gravesnumber9 on Jul 10, 2021 19:47:04 GMT -6
UAD DSP was helpful to me in extending the life of my older computer. Now that I am on a new iMac, I am flush with native processing power. External DSP isn’t a necessity any longer. UAD plugins are good, but there are native plugins on the same level these days. So, I’d say unless you plan to go Apollo (and/or Luna), and would track through plugins, then it doesn’t make much sense to buy into UAD. Unless maybe you already own a bunch of UAD plugins. Just my experience having been a longtime Apollo user (MKI and MKII). I still have a satellite and a bunch of plugs, but would be just fine if I didn’t. UA’s marketing is killer, though. They got this whole cool kids club vibe. Every time I see an ad I want to go out and buy an Apollo X. And just about every studio shot I see an Apollo X somewhere in the racks. They are definitely popular. They are undisputedly the best at branding their stuff. I've often thought that if Slate would have branded that way instead of the Ed Hardy/Hot Topic/pop punk thing, the sky would be the limit. Honestly, I can’t give Slate a chance for this reason. Judge me. Call me shallow. I won’t argue with you, you’re right. I subscribe to the wine bottle theory. If I don’t like how the wine bottle looks good chance I won’t like the wine either. |
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jes
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Post by jes on Jul 10, 2021 21:44:38 GMT -6
I really like DMG trackcomp for my character compression . I was mostly using UA’s 1176 and LA2A and don’t miss them, or the other UA plus I lost when I upgraded my computer.
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Post by indiehouse on Jul 11, 2021 8:27:40 GMT -6
I really like DMG trackcomp for my character compression . I was mostly using UA’s 1176 and LA2A and don’t miss them, or the other UA plus I lost when I upgraded my computer. Trackcomp is awesome. |
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Post by phantom on Jul 11, 2021 8:41:32 GMT -6
I really like DMG trackcomp for my character compression . I was mostly using UA’s 1176 and LA2A and don’t miss them, or the other UA plus I lost when I upgraded my computer. I had forgotten about Trackcomp 2. Yes, I heard a shootout between the 1176 and LA2A on Trackcomp against UAD, a bunch of other plugins and even hardwares. TC was between the best ones. It's on my buy list since then. |
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Post by plinker on Jul 11, 2021 10:50:08 GMT -6
I just switched back to Logic -- been on Reaper forever.
Logic's EQ and compressor emulations seem to be in the ballpark, but I don't have recent experience with the hardware to be able to pass judgment.
Are other DAWs providing emulations with their in-built plugs? Does Cubase?
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Post by Tbone81 on Jul 11, 2021 11:14:48 GMT -6
I just switched back to Logic -- been on Reaper forever. Logic's EQ and compressor emulations seem to be in the ballpark, but I don't have recent experience with the hardware to be able to pass judgment. Are other DAWs providing emulations with their in-built plugs? Does Cubase? Cubase had a “vintage comp” that’s a 33609/2264 emulation. Not sure if they have anymore in version 11 (I’m on 9.5). Honestly I can get most stuff done (and do) with the stock plugins in Cubase. But personally really like using 1176/la2a’s on most stuff for the work flow. |
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Post by notneeson on Jul 11, 2021 11:44:26 GMT -6
Really loving the Noise Ash Pultec and a handful of Plugin Alliance stuff. Very much feeling productive with a “less is more” approach to plugin variety over here.
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Post by Tbone81 on Jul 11, 2021 11:49:23 GMT -6
Thanks for the replies so far. I’m demoing some fuse audio plugins right now, interested to see how they sound after all the hype. Already own some Tokyo dawn stuff but the only thing I’ve really dug into is the Nova eq, which I like a lot. I think the question is now, do I pay for a UAD Satellite (current promo sounds great) or spend that same money on either: 1) native plugins 2) an even better computer or 3) both The big unknown is do I need the extra dsp? With a new Mac M1x will I benefit from the extra processing power or am I fine running everything native (on top of my vsti’s etc)? You guys who are running lots of vsti’s, how are you handling it? I don't know if it counts as "lots" but I always have an instance of SD3, usually a Diva, a couple of Keyscapes and an MTron Pro going. Then lots of plugins. I'm on the current Intel iMac and it handles it with ease. Thanks Ragan, that’s what I needed to know. By “current intel” do you mean the trash cans or iMac? Thanks |
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Post by ragan on Jul 11, 2021 11:55:44 GMT -6
I don't know if it counts as "lots" but I always have an instance of SD3, usually a Diva, a couple of Keyscapes and an MTron Pro going. Then lots of plugins. I'm on the current Intel iMac and it handles it with ease. Thanks Ragan, that’s what I needed to know. By “current intel” do you mean the trash cans or iMac? Thanks Mine is the 2020 (and prob last?) Intel iMac. |
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Post by kcatthedog on Jul 11, 2021 14:54:26 GMT -6
No doubt, the new iMac m1x with 32 inch monitor, more ram and I/o will be killer but expensive .
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Post by jmoose on Jul 11, 2021 16:28:11 GMT -6
I think the question is now, do I pay for a UAD Satellite (current promo sounds great) or spend that same money on either: 1) native plugins 2) an even better computer or 3) both The big unknown is do I need the extra dsp? With a new Mac M1x will I benefit from the extra processing power or am I fine running everything native (on top of my vsti’s etc)? I don't think extra DSP is the question, at least not the main question. For me it's do you find the UAD processing to be useful or not? I've got a satellite and UAD is basically the main plug platform for a variety of reasons. For one I dig the quality of their stuff... I don't have hardware Distressors but the UAD is on every mix. The 140 plate is still unsurpassed next to a real one IMO and the Lexicon stuff sounds great too. The MXR flanger is the only ITB flanger I've ever liked... the Vari Mu also sees a lot of action to name a handful of things. Another reason is support. #1 with a bullet! As a working professional I find a lot of value in the way the whole system works. I want to demo and then buy something? Totally painless. By contrast last year I wasted time & money with another company that uses the ilok system. Should've been simple, I have other plugs from them but this one never got resolved... Had an album come in for mix where I took the guys whole Logic folder "as-is" and there was one particular plug he used that I didn't have and well, its on sale. For $29 I should just have it anyway... quit the session. Make the purchase. Had problems with the installer. Then ilok wouldn't recognize it. Spent about 3 or 4 hours going in circles which completely derailed the session that day. If your a home hobbyist maybe that's ok. Frustrating yeah but its not like you have deadlines and paying clients in the wings asking when things are going to get done. One of my friends has been with UAD basically since the beginning and through various DAW rigs... complete computer replacements etc over the course of 15 odd years he's rarely had a problem that wasn't resolved quickly. Its been one of, if not the most stable software platforms I can think of. Another factor is that I wanted to keep my new DAW rig lean and mean. Didn't want to get to the point I was at years ago with 2 dozen + different plug in companies which becomes a nightmare every time there's an upgrade or re-install. Its the time & simplicity thing again. Plus yeah, the marketing angle. Brand recognition. As a guy for hire what's better? Do you buy a Neumann or a mic that's probably as good but nobody has ever heard of? Absolutely there's a lot of other good stuff out there. Nobody "needs" UAD or Slate or whatever to make a record. Its not like the world is going to stop spinning 'cause you don't have the latest greatest fake Fairchild plugin... Comments about resale value & cost? I can't relate to those. I view the stuff as virtual outboard gear. A single physical Distressor is $1500. The plug in was like $150 on sale? Maybe? Total bargain from where I sit. I've also never sold a plug and don't plan on it since I don't "collect" them to begin with. How many different virtual 1176 does anyone need?! I've got one. Think its pretty good. So I use it and get on with the task at hand without a second thought. YMMV. |
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Post by Quint on Jul 11, 2021 16:42:37 GMT -6
I think the question is now, do I pay for a UAD Satellite (current promo sounds great) or spend that same money on either: 1) native plugins 2) an even better computer or 3) both The big unknown is do I need the extra dsp? With a new Mac M1x will I benefit from the extra processing power or am I fine running everything native (on top of my vsti’s etc)? I don't think extra DSP is the question, at least not the main question. For me it's do you find the UAD processing to be useful or not? I've got a satellite and UAD is basically the main plug platform for a variety of reasons. For one I dig the quality of their stuff... I don't have hardware Distressors but the UAD is on every mix. The 140 plate is still unsurpassed next to a real one IMO and the Lexicon stuff sounds great too. The MXR flanger is the only ITB flanger I've ever liked... the Vari Mu also sees a lot of action to name a handful of things. Another reason is support. #1 with a bullet! As a working professional I find a lot of value in the way the whole system works. I want to demo and then buy something? Totally painless. By contrast last year I wasted time & money with another company that uses the ilok system. Should've been simple, I have other plugs from them but this one never got resolved... Had an album come in for mix where I took the guys whole Logic folder "as-is" and there was one particular plug he used that I didn't have and well, its on sale. For $29 I should just have it anyway... quit the session. Make the purchase. Had problems with the installer. Then ilok wouldn't recognize it. Spent about 3 or 4 hours going in circles which completely derailed the session that day. If your a home hobbyist maybe that's ok. Frustrating yeah but its not like you have deadlines and paying clients in the wings asking when things are going to get done. One of my friends has been with UAD basically since the beginning and through various DAW rigs... complete computer replacements etc over the course of 15 odd years he's rarely had a problem that wasn't resolved quickly. Its been one of, if not the most stable software platforms I can think of. Another factor is that I wanted to keep my new DAW rig lean and mean. Didn't want to get to the point I was at years ago with 2 dozen + different plug in companies which becomes a nightmare every time there's an upgrade or re-install. Its the time & simplicity thing again. Plus yeah, the marketing angle. Brand recognition. As a guy for hire what's better? Do you buy a Neumann or a mic that's probably as good but nobody has ever heard of? Absolutely there's a lot of other good stuff out there. Nobody "needs" UAD or Slate or whatever to make a record. Its not like the world is going to stop spinning 'cause you don't have the latest greatest fake Fairchild plugin... Comments about resale value & cost? I can't relate to those. I view the stuff as virtual outboard gear. A single physical Distressor is $1500. The plug in was like $150 on sale? Maybe? Total bargain from where I sit. I've also never sold a plug and don't plan on it since I don't "collect" them to begin with. How many different virtual 1176 does anyone need?! I've got one. Think its pretty good. So I use it and get on with the task at hand without a second thought. YMMV. All of these things, plus I really like being able to monitor their plugs in the Apollo without ever having to worry about buffers, freezing, etc. |
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