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Post by levon on Feb 18, 2021 9:27:43 GMT -6
I didn't include the Nu Mu on the list because in the only side by side comparison I was able to find, while the Nu Mu was puchier, it didn't enhance the depth of the mix like the Vari Mu. It could have been a bad comparison. I haven't heard the Nu Mu, but I love the Vari Mu. If you can swing it, go for it. Any chance to rent one and try it out first?
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Post by timcampbell on Feb 18, 2021 9:40:43 GMT -6
Since the Manley and the Gyraf cost the same and Gyraf's distributor has demo units he will lend, you ought to at least try it. As I said ICP has both. Once they got the Gyrafs they prefered by a large margin. They compared the Gyrafs to their original Fairchild 670 and said it sounded the same but cleaner and more adjustable. onefsound.com/
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Post by mamm7215 on Feb 18, 2021 12:07:44 GMT -6
I love mine, I've thought of selling it as some vst comps are getting pretty good but I just can't let go. For me the secret to the Manley Vari Mu is the Dual Input knob. I can get gooey to hardly noticeable using just that with the rest of the knobs pretty static. As previously mentioned, 1-3 db of reduction (usually no more than 2) and using the input knob to taste gives it a lot more range than some folks give it credit for.
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Post by drbill on Feb 18, 2021 16:31:17 GMT -6
using the input knob to taste gives it a lot more range than some folks give it credit for. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
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Post by Deleted on Feb 18, 2021 18:12:19 GMT -6
If you’re unsure of what to buy, don’t want to spend a ton, and want tubes, the Drawmer 1968 is a fet comp with Fairchildish timings and 12ax7 output stage. It still sounds good.
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Post by brenta on Feb 18, 2021 19:11:10 GMT -6
If you’re unsure of what to buy, don’t want to spend a ton, and want tubes, the Drawmer 1968 is a fet comp with Fairchildish timings and 12ax7 output stage. It still sounds good. Yep, and it can work well for tracking, mixing, and mastering. Only a handful of comps are good at all three IMO. If you get it, get the MKII version. I really liked the 1968 mkii but sold mine to get the Wesaudio Dione because I'm all about no-fuss recalls these days. Which is exactly why I would be looking very hard at the Tegeler Schwerkraftmaschine over all the other comps mentioned. I've always loved the Manley too, but I imagine the Tegeler to sound similar to the Manley, except with instant recall.
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Post by Ward on Feb 18, 2021 19:31:15 GMT -6
I had a Manley VariMu for a few years. Just didn't work for me at all. But other people, including the guy I sold it too, absolutely love it.
You have to try everything before you buy anything - within reason of course !
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Post by jmoose on Feb 18, 2021 21:00:13 GMT -6
Drawmer 68/69 sound good yes but don't sound anything like a mu or Fairchild. Too clean & not grabby enough. Don't like the word much but too transparent.
Those Drawmers were actually designed by Dave Hill of Cranesong fame. Dave was also the guy behind the Summit DCL200 which has a similar architecture with the 990s and tubes. I've had a DCL for years and like it but, its certainly no Fairchild imitator and not much of a "color box" like the Manley.
If its goopy color then might as well throw the Chandler TG1 in the ring too... 2254 diode bridge types?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 18, 2021 21:14:09 GMT -6
Drawmer 68/69 sound good yes but don't sound anything like a mu or Fairchild. Too clean & not grabby enough. Don't like the word much but too transparent. Those Drawmers were actually designed by Dave Hill of Cranesong fame. Dave was also the guy behind the Summit DCL200 which has a similar architecture with the 990s and tubes. I've had a DCL for years and like it but, its certainly no Fairchild imitator and not much of a "color box" like the Manley. If its goopy color then might as well throw the Chandler TG1 in the ring too... 2254 diode bridge types? The color of the Drawmers depends on how you gainstage them to hit the diode and the tubes. You can get a sick amount of lofi tube wallop and crazy highs off of it. of course it’s not a Varimu though. The demos of the retro revolver sounded sick when i heard them a long time ago. Enough to where I prob would’ve copped it blind like that if I had the dough.
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Post by brenta on Feb 18, 2021 21:45:24 GMT -6
Drawmer 68/69 sound good yes but don't sound anything like a mu or Fairchild. Too clean & not grabby enough. Don't like the word much but too transparent. Those Drawmers were actually designed by Dave Hill of Cranesong fame. Dave was also the guy behind the Summit DCL200 which has a similar architecture with the 990s and tubes. I've had a DCL for years and like it but, its certainly no Fairchild imitator and not much of a "color box" like the Manley. If its goopy color then might as well throw the Chandler TG1 in the ring too... 2254 diode bridge types? Huh, I thought I remember Fletcher stating a few times that he had a heavy influence in the design of the 1968. I agree it sounds nothing like the Manley.
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Post by jmoose on Feb 18, 2021 21:45:38 GMT -6
As an ex Mercenary guy I'm pretty familiar with the drawmers and nope, sorry dont hear it.
We could set an SSL quad comp to the same time constraints as a Fairchild but that don't make it so...
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Post by jmoose on Feb 18, 2021 21:55:40 GMT -6
Huh, I thought I remember Fletcher stating a few times that he had a heavy influence in the design of the 1968. I agree it sounds nothing like the Manley. Fletcher had tremendous input but he also couldn't layout a PCB with a gun to his head. None of us could. He called Dave Hill who did all the actual circuit design & layout. More or less started with a clean sheet of paper... IIRC the conversation was like Dave, take this box throw everything away and when you come up with something that fits and sounds good send it over.
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Post by jcoutu1 on Feb 18, 2021 23:51:03 GMT -6
As an ex Mercenary guy I'm pretty familiar with the drawmers and nope, sorry dont hear it. We could set an SSL quad comp to the same time constraints as a Fairchild but that don't make it so... Are you in New England?
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Post by stormymondays on Feb 19, 2021 7:56:45 GMT -6
Huh, I thought I remember Fletcher stating a few times that he had a heavy influence in the design of the 1968. I agree it sounds nothing like the Manley. Fletcher had tremendous input but he also couldn't layout a PCB with a gun to his head. None of us could. He called Dave Hill who did all the actual circuit design & layout. More or less started with a clean sheet of paper... IIRC the conversation was like Dave, take this box throw everything away and when you come up with something that fits and sounds good send it over. I got one and I like it! It's the latest version, post-Mercenary. I have it parked on the drum buss, just because. But it could work on anything.
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Post by jmoose on Feb 19, 2021 14:21:26 GMT -6
Not anymore no. I lived in North Attleboro while I was up there... These days I'm in northern NJ outside of NYC & plotting my escape from the area. Still travel a lot w/ production work... or at least did before the rona. I don't own any Mercenary edition gear, wish I did. And FWIW I actually like the standard Drawmer 1960. Never used it across the 2 mix but I dig 'em for tracking. Used one not too long ago after burning through all the pres on a Neve desk in a huge session. Had to raid outboard for overdubs, put up an 87 > 1960 and it just worked for everything I put in front of it.
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Post by timcampbell on Feb 19, 2021 14:40:26 GMT -6
Funny that Drawmer would get mentioned in a Vari Mu thread. We used to own some drawmer compressors and they were everyone's least favorite kit.
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Post by jcoutu1 on Feb 19, 2021 14:40:52 GMT -6
Not anymore no. I lived in North Attleboro while I was up there... These days I'm in northern NJ outside of NYC & plotting my escape from the area. Still travel a lot w/ production work... or at least did before the rona. I don't own any Mercenary edition gear, wish I did. And FWIW I actually like the standard Drawmer 1960. Never used it across the 2 mix but I dig 'em for tracking. Used one not too long ago after burning through all the pres on a Neve desk in a huge session. Had to raid outboard for overdubs, put up an 87 > 1960 and it just worked for everything I put in front of it. Bummer. I'm right up the road from Attleboro in Milford.
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Post by timcampbell on Feb 19, 2021 14:49:14 GMT -6
Not anymore no. I lived in North Attleboro while I was up there... These days I'm in northern NJ outside of NYC & plotting my escape from the area. Still travel a lot w/ production work... or at least did before the rona. I don't own any Mercenary edition gear, wish I did. And FWIW I actually like the standard Drawmer 1960. Never used it across the 2 mix but I dig 'em for tracking. Used one not too long ago after burning through all the pres on a Neve desk in a huge session. Had to raid outboard for overdubs, put up an 87 > 1960 and it just worked for everything I put in front of it. Bummer. I'm right up the road from Attleboro in Milford. I find myself in Stoneham from time to time
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Post by ab101 on Feb 19, 2021 16:33:35 GMT -6
Since the Manley and the Gyraf cost the same and Gyraf's distributor has demo units he will lend, you ought to at least try it. As I said ICP has both. Once they got the Gyrafs they prefered by a large margin. They compared the Gyrafs to their original Fairchild 670 and said it sounded the same but cleaner and more adjustable. onefsound.com/Anyone have knowledge of the U.S. Distributor for Gyraf? The Gyraf G22 looks very interesting. Thank you.
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Post by EmRR on Feb 19, 2021 16:44:46 GMT -6
Another thought, I'd certainly recommend a dedicated stereo unit versus a pair that can be linked, if you're at all critical of stereo image solidity and the perils of gain and gain reduction alignment. The differences in curves of gain reduction tubes can make for a swimmy experience, at worst timing can actually seem different, then there's dialing in matching input and output levels, doable, but it can add a bunch of alignment time to the process. I've done links on some very old var-mu before, and it's a frustrating experience, even when you've taken the time to confirm and match out component values, tubes, voltages, etc. They're generally crude beasts and they do their own organic thing. Get something that is stereo, it's more likely to have been set up properly with matching tubes, and have adjustments built in for alignment to different tube sets. If it's all rock & roll and you don't care about no stinkin' high falutin' 'procedures', ignore this!....and be prepared to have your mastering guy ask if K/S/vcl are supposed to be at 10º to one side of center.
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Post by timcampbell on Feb 19, 2021 19:03:24 GMT -6
ab101 the link is right there in my post -----> onefsound.com/ One F Sound
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Post by delcampo on Feb 20, 2021 11:09:58 GMT -6
Another thought, I'd certainly recommend a dedicated stereo unit versus a pair that can be linked, if you're at all critical of stereo image solidity and the perils of gain and gain reduction alignment. The differences in curves of gain reduction tubes can make for a swimmy experience, at worst timing can actually seem different, then there's dialing in matching input and output levels, doable, but it can add a bunch of alignment time to the process. I've done links on some very old var-mu before, and it's a frustrating experience, even when you've taken the time to confirm and match out component values, tubes, voltages, etc. They're generally crude beasts and they do their own organic thing. Get something that is stereo, it's more likely to have been set up properly with matching tubes, and have adjustments built in for alignment to different tube sets. If it's all rock & roll and you don't care about no stinkin' high falutin' 'procedures', ignore this!....and be prepared to have your mastering guy ask if K/S/vcl are supposed to be at 10º to one side of center. Good points. I've been 1/2 considering selling one of my BG2 pairs to put towards a more dedicated stereo tube unit for that reason but, I can't yet convince myself it's a good idea. (beware of emotional connections to gear) The pair of them really are pretty special after the console & before, or after the Foote P4 though. That said, the Gyraf G22 does look interesting. I generally match them at mix time via tones. Also, getting a more specifically matched pair of 6BC8 tubes for them might be a good idea some day. But heck, yeah it's mostly rock-ish / folk-ish kinda end result goals here, and if it sounds good...
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Post by ab101 on Feb 22, 2021 21:42:36 GMT -6
Beautiful Gyraf G22 demo:
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Post by srb on Feb 22, 2021 23:12:48 GMT -6
Happy IGS Tubecore 3U owner here. I use it mostly in mastering in conjuction with a SS compressor. Love the wet/dry control, and the M/S function as well. I tend to keep my gain staging in check, and I don't hit the input too terribly hard. 2-4dB showing on GR, with wet/dry around 40-50 percent.
This actually the second unit I've had. The first began to exhibit a 0.5-1dB gain offset (drop) in the right channel. When I first heard it, I thought perhaps I'd worked a little too long that day. But it was still there the next morning. It came and went in the days following. Sent it back to my dealer, and the unit tried to make a 'liar' out of me. It eventually proved me right, and back to Poland it went. Igor replaced it. Took about 3 months to get it all turned around.
No issues since. That's been a couple years ago now. Despite the inconvenience, I do recommend it.
I've collected some 5670 tubes and a pair of the new JJ 6386, but I've yet to try either in the unit. I'll get around to it at some point.
I also have an Anamod 670 here. It's used for various stereo duties at times (instrument buss/mix/master); depends on the material. I really like it for tracking vocals and with bass (and other guitars) in mixing.
My favorite mix buss compressor, though, is the RND Master Buss Processor. I really am a fan of built-in parallel processing. The stereo field manipulation is handy, too.
Edited to add: I had a Manley at one point, and just never really took to it.
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Post by Blackdawg on Feb 23, 2021 0:27:32 GMT -6
Beautiful Gyraf G22 demo: I want one. Will hopefully get one day for the mastering rig.
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