Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 7, 2021 14:22:40 GMT -6
Not channel strips. Those are cool and Infinistrip is probably the most flexible one and the Plugin Alliance ones the cleannest with any vibe but what works magic on a stereo bus? What’s best? What gives you the warmth and center image?
I’ve tried:
SDRR2 Desk, HQ+ on for linear phase oversampling, two stages, medium cross talk on stereo bus. This gives me a solid center image with some drive but can be gritty in the upper mids. Slight aliasing.
Lindell 80 bus: this has the warmth, width, and crispness but not the thickness. I love it on drum bus but I don’t get it on guitars and vocals. If you don’t choose a good channel pair or link them, TMT can cause big stereo drift.
Waves NLS: No solid central image but super wide and gritty when pushed. It sounds like if a cheap digital console had analog components and you could break up.
Britson bus: now this is what I’m talking about. It has the gooey gel and the fatness but affects depth in a not great way. Aliasing in the air?
Waves CLA: Mixhub. Wtf is this?
Slate VCC bus: Has the central image and sheen but depth isn’t great. Sounds too digital.
Fuse TCS-68: This is so cool but so lofi. It’s pretty much instant good 80s-90s demo quality that got pressed. Drive it right and turn on crosstalk on anything stereo and you can get the sides to just fold in a super cool way. Think Wu-Tang and Darkthrone.
Any others worth checking out? Noiseash Neve? UAD Luna? I hope Goodhertz Tupe is great
Background: This project I’m working on only has two L and R guitar tracks. Well randomly sticking SDRR 2 desk as the final plugin on low drive feeding into the above settings on the bus saved me a ton of time carefully setting delays. I got the guitars to fill the image in a nice wall of sound cranked amp style. But want a less pushed / harsh alternative for future projects and am not 100% satisfied with anything I’ve tried.
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Post by Guitar on Jan 7, 2021 14:44:28 GMT -6
I don't think many of them are emulating analog summing, since that happens in the DAW, digitally, but some bus plugins do L/R crosstalk? I'm not sure if any channel strips "talk to each other." Other than CLA MixHub which gives you a "console" mouse area to do mixing on lots of different channels.
I've used NLS on a heavy album, really distorted, the band is GREEN if you want to check them out, if you can find their bancamp, album is called "Weight Of The Cord." They are from northern Virginia.
I know Luna and Harrison Mixbus are doing "something" but I don't know "what." It would be nice if it could be demystified, black boxed.
Cubase channels can do the visual compare thing, same thing iZotope stuff does, but free inside the DAW already.
I don't pay attention to most of it because most of it seems to either be a channel strip, or a bus color box, which I use anyway.
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Post by Drew @ UA on Jan 7, 2021 14:52:20 GMT -6
LUNA's summing Extensions aren't plugins. They're coded into the mixer and include the fader taper and pan law of the emulated console.
You put these on buses and the main out and when combined with channelstrip plugins placed on each track and Unison plugins on the way in, you get a full end to end console emu.
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Post by tkaitkai on Jan 7, 2021 15:00:50 GMT -6
Britson is where it's at. Hard to beat that one. The "Master Bright" setting can be really useful on the right material.
I wouldn't use CLA Mixhub on the stereo bus, but Mixdown is a different story. If you're ever working on modern rock/pop punk/metal and you want to sound like CLA, Mixdown will do that for you. You do have to be gentle with it.
Most of the models in VCC never really gelled with me, but I've always loved RC-Tube on the stereo bus.
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Post by mrholmes on Jan 7, 2021 15:28:02 GMT -6
Not channel strips. Those are cool and Infinistrip is probably the most flexible one and the Plugin Alliance ones the cleannest with any vibe but what works magic on a stereo bus? What’s best? What gives you the warmth and center image? I’ve tried: SDRR2 Desk, HQ+ on for linear phase oversampling, two stages, medium cross talk on stereo bus. This gives me a solid center image with some drive but can be gritty in the upper mids. Slight aliasing. Lindell 80 bus: this has the warmth, width, and crispness but not the thickness. I love it on drum bus but I don’t get it on guitars and vocals. If you don’t choose a good channel pair or link them, TMT can cause big stereo drift. Waves NLS: No solid central image but super wide and gritty when pushed. It sounds like if a cheap digital console had analog components and you could break up. Britson bus: now this is what I’m talking about. It has the gooey gel and the fatness but affects depth in a not great way. Aliasing in the air? Waves CLA: Mixhub. Wtf is this? Slate VCC bus: Has the central image and sheen but depth isn’t great. Sounds too digital. Fuse TCS-68: This is so cool but so lofi. It’s pretty much instant good 80s-90s demo quality that got pressed. Drive it right and turn on crosstalk on anything stereo and you can get the sides to just fold in a super cool way. Think Wu-Tang and Darkthrone. Any others worth checking out? Noiseash Neve? UAD Luna? I hope Goodhertz Tupe is great Background: This project I’m working on only has two L and R guitar tracks. Well randomly sticking SDRR 2 desk as the final plugin on low drive feeding into the above settings on the bus saved me a ton of time carefully setting delays. I got the guitars to fill the image in a nice wall of sound cranked amp style. But want a less pushed / harsh alternative for future projects and am not 100% satisfied with anything I’ve tried.
I just stacked up what my ear liked the most without comparing it to the analog world.
Chain goes:
SONNOX INFLATOR, just a light touch of it.
SPL IRON in MS-MODE just a few dbs of reduction.
LF up to 350 HZ goes all in Mono Subtle stereo widening. Settings to taste special the Rectifier setting is interestin, it can change the whole attitude of the compressor
Softube Tape the needles barely move, and I use the crosstalk knob very subtle.
Have fun.
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Post by superwack on Jan 7, 2021 22:42:54 GMT -6
Have you ever tried the Airwindows consoles? The latest one Console7 has people raving even if the workflow is a little convoluted - I haven't tried it yet but I have used previous AirWindows console with good results.
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bwoe
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Post by bwoe on Jan 7, 2021 22:59:05 GMT -6
Increasing the oversampling can make a discernible difference for this plugin, so if you have the CPU horsepower, crank it up to 16x and A/B It against the default 2x.
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Post by Quint on Jan 8, 2021 10:56:51 GMT -6
What about the Acustica Acqua stuff? Some of their channel strips even have multiple preamps of the same type sampled to recreate varying tolerances.
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Post by the other mark williams on Jan 8, 2021 11:04:21 GMT -6
What about the Acustica Acqua stuff? Some of their channel strips even have multiple preamps of the same type sampled to recreate varying tolerances. Yeah, their stuff sounds great for this, but it obviously murders your CPU. Gold (Neve), Pink (API), and Cream (EMI) are especially good at this b/c they have a lot of different channels/pres sampled. But again, impractical for most of us (unless just pre-processing all your tracks through the various pres/line amps).
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Post by christopher on Jan 8, 2021 12:16:23 GMT -6
Reason SSL emulation is really good. Reason can run as a plugin I think? And I think Reaper can run as a plugin now? So I’ve been thinking about running one inside the other at some point to use the Reason SSL. Not so much for summing, mostly the EQ. But the summing seems to be working, at least the stuff my buddy sends me.
Airwindows would also be on the list
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Post by mjheck on Jan 8, 2021 16:03:56 GMT -6
If I recall, the Nebula console libraries from Alex B modeled different mic and line channels, different busses, etc. for a good two dozen discrete options for a bunch of different consoles. It wasn't as debilitating as some of their more intensive stuff, but I don't recall if that was due to these being light versions of each, or if they used less kernels or what. These did eventually max out my computer, but at the time is was a quad core 2012 I7 iMac - not bad, but not top of the line by any stretch.
I tried versions of this with the PA SSL E strip (randomizing the channels) and with the Airwindows encode/decode console too. I also tried using a variety of different takes on the same flavor to get a 'same but different" vibe going (i.e. UAD 1073, Airwindows Neve Channel 4, Kush Transformer N, Logic vintage EQ, etc.).
I eventually just lost interest and moved on I guess, as I don't recall coming to any sort of conclusion or "ah-ha" moment.
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Post by viciousbliss on Jan 9, 2021 11:13:56 GMT -6
I'd been using NLS, the PA consoles, and Britson, often all 3 on the same mix. Then when I followed some of Dan's advice about rolling back to 44k and upsampling stuff where needed, I tried working without that stuff. I'm a heavy Cranesong user and it's sounding like I don't really need these other ones. But I still use the Lindell 80 channel on busses and some stereo tracks. There's a lot that these console emus do really well, but they all seem to have drawbacks. I'm gonna have to break out SDRR again soon. Shame the Cranesong stuff is so expensive and not ported to VST.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2021 15:24:11 GMT -6
I'll definitely check out Britson again if it ever gets updated. Lindell API is coming out this year too. Getting that solid, deep, and clear stereo center without any unwanted drawbacks is always tough.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2021 15:24:51 GMT -6
LUNA's summing Extensions aren't plugins. They're coded into the mixer and include the fader taper and pan law of the emulated console. You put these on buses and the main out and when combined with channelstrip plugins placed on each track and Unison plugins on the way in, you get a full end to end console emu. Does it have the crosstalk and analog summing non-linearities from those old circuits? If so, that's super cool.
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Post by Johnkenn on Jan 9, 2021 16:30:59 GMT -6
LUNA's summing Extensions aren't plugins. They're coded into the mixer and include the fader taper and pan law of the emulated console. You put these on buses and the main out and when combined with channelstrip plugins placed on each track and Unison plugins on the way in, you get a full end to end console emu. Hey so the Luna meters are showing output, right? I wish there was a way to show input and output. I believe at one point they showed input right? I tended to like it better that way as it confirmed what I was hearing as things started to crunch more. So the output knob is completely just that? Gain?
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Post by Martin John Butler on Jan 9, 2021 17:57:53 GMT -6
I haven't tried Luna's summing yet, in fact, I have little desire to try Luna anyway. It seems I'll need two satellites to do what I want. If I could use it as a stand alone plug-in I'd try it.
It's console tone and effect we're looking for here, so I'll pass this along, The Black Box Analogue Design HG-2 plug-in does a damn good job of bringing some width, tone and cohesion to tracks. It's kind of like 30% or more of what the console mix bus does. It made a recent track much more finished, easily. I'd take a look at that while you're at it.
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Post by schmalzy on Jan 10, 2021 0:59:33 GMT -6
I just mixed with Console1 on a punk mix. I used it on EVERY channel including my pre-master bus (which I hadn't done previously - I used it only on the channels I was processing...others like two different guitar amp mics, some blended sources like snare top and bottom, or the individual mics of a stereo pattern didn't get it)) and my mix turned out significantly different. I was aiming for dirtier than my normal mix - that's why I used it on every channel and went a little heavier on the drive control - but what I got was a mix that seemed to gel, glue, sag, and stay together MORE even though my automation moves were bigger and the decisions I made seemed to be more drastic than they had been previously.
...plus my mix was accidentally WAY louder than it normally would have been. Like...3db LUFS louder prior to mastering-style plugs.
Edit: I should re-state that. My mix wasn't "louder" - I pay attention and keep my room SPL in a few different specific spots - as much as my peak-to-average was narrower than average effectively making it "louder" if I pushed it up near 0dbfs.
I don't know what console summing sounds like in a recording situation. I've never been lucky enough to use something analog that sounded the same or BETTER when things were summed together. But I thought this result was good enough to mention soooooooo...use that info however you'd like!
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Post by theshea on Jan 10, 2021 1:48:29 GMT -6
put klanghelm‘s sdrr in desk mode on a recent mix. haven‘t done that in a while. and yes, with x-talk switch in the middle it sounded nice with a little bit more space/depth in the mix. it‘s a nice plugin that with the addition of the transient, bass and treble knobs it‘s super useful for additionally shaping. i almost never use the comp or the drive knob. i almost forgot this plugin. will use it more often again.
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Post by Drew @ UA on Jan 10, 2021 7:48:48 GMT -6
LUNA's summing Extensions aren't plugins. They're coded into the mixer and include the fader taper and pan law of the emulated console. You put these on buses and the main out and when combined with channelstrip plugins placed on each track and Unison plugins on the way in, you get a full end to end console emu. Hey so the Luna meters are showing output, right? I wish there was a way to show input and output. I believe at one point they showed input right? I tended to like it better that way as it confirmed what I was hearing as things started to crunch more. So the output knob is completely just that? Gain? It's a trim. Be sure to submit Feedback. I do think early on it showed in. I personally the way it is now.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 12, 2021 7:43:49 GMT -6
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Post by Guitar on Jan 12, 2021 7:50:42 GMT -6
I'm really glad they went "modular" with that one, to get more options crammed in. Guess I'll have to set up a test session soon. I'll be comparing to UAD API EQ collection and Waves API 2500.
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Post by superwack on Jan 12, 2021 9:12:25 GMT -6
I’m really excited about this but I’ll probably wait to demo it until it’s $79 or something in a couple of months. Hope they optimized the oversampling or, better yet, added an offline OS option. Speaking of that, did you see the latest DDMF Metaplugin has increased its IIR/FIR OS options - adding 16x and also offline OS up to 64x? Could be interesting/useful
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Post by Deleted on Jan 12, 2021 9:32:33 GMT -6
I'm really glad they went "modular" with that one, to get more options crammed in. Guess I'll have to set up a test session soon. I'll be comparing to UAD API EQ collection and Waves API 2500. Once again from the demos, it sounds like I'll dig it on drums but not on guitars and vocals. I'd buy it right now if it was 50-100 bucks and never on sale. These Lindell plugins are mostly very good but the lack the super distinct hardware sound. The intro price is insane and more than the recent PSP Infinistrip, which does more and uses pretty much no CPU. Plugin Alliance pricing strategy is just stupid and costs them sales. I want this API and the Phil's Cascade right now for a project but they're $300 and $250. I don't need them so it's stupid to buy them now. The Goodhertz Tupe is 80 bucks and coming out soon. So I don't know if I'll ever buy the API and will pick up Phil's Cascade dirt cheap on sale + a voucher. They just lose money and get my money slower. I would've bought that AMEK EQ too for 50 bucks because it shits out in a very cool way but 400 bucks for a dirty eq to sell subscriptions to make you pay 300 a year for 250 in plugin is ridiculous.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 12, 2021 9:33:08 GMT -6
I’m really excited about this but I’ll probably wait to demo it until it’s $79 or something in a couple of months. Hope they optimized the oversampling or, better yet, added an offline OS option. Speaking of that, did you see the latest DDMF Metaplugin has increased its IIR/FIR OS options - adding 16x and also offline OS up to 64x? Could be interesting/useful Does it have an ultrasonic filter like the old TDR plug VladG made?
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Post by jcoutu1 on Jan 12, 2021 9:33:08 GMT -6
I have the subscription and installed this morning. Should be using it soon.
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