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Post by Guitar on Dec 23, 2020 10:11:10 GMT -6
Buy a nice DAC, stick to the MOTU. That's what I would personally be more drawn to. Although I remember my Apollos fondly, nice stuff, just not for me.
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Post by Vincent R. on May 14, 2021 12:05:18 GMT -6
Drew @ UA, I have a questions about linking the Apollos. I have an old Apollo Quad Silverface and I'm debating adding n Apollo x16 to add to my rig. I'd like to keep the Quad around for the monitoring (headphones, etc), but use the x16 for my tracking inputs and AD/DA for outboard gear. Is there any detriment sonically to using the quad for monitoring vs the x16? Do I have to hook them up after in a particular order? I hope that makes sense.
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Post by Drew @ UA on May 14, 2021 12:18:28 GMT -6
Drew @ UA , I have a questions about linking the Apollos. I have an old Apollo Quad Silverface and I'm debating adding n Apollo x16 to add to my rig. I'd like to keep the Quad around for the monitoring (headphones, etc), but use the x16 for my tracking inputs and AD/DA for outboard gear. Is there any detriment sonically to using the quad for monitoring vs the x16? Do I have to hook them up after in a particular order? I hope that makes sense. You'll want to use the x16 as your main interface for its superior D/A and clocking. It'll feed your Mons, Alt Mons, and Cues.
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Post by Vincent R. on May 14, 2021 13:37:35 GMT -6
Drew @ UA , I have a questions about linking the Apollos. I have an old Apollo Quad Silverface and I'm debating adding n Apollo x16 to add to my rig. I'd like to keep the Quad around for the monitoring (headphones, etc), but use the x16 for my tracking inputs and AD/DA for outboard gear. Is there any detriment sonically to using the quad for monitoring vs the x16? Do I have to hook them up after in a particular order? I hope that makes sense. You'll want to use the x16 as your main interface for its superior D/A and clocking. It'll feed your Mons, Alt Mons, and Cues. Will I still be able to use the headphone amps in the quad?
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Post by kcatthedog on May 14, 2021 13:42:59 GMT -6
As you are not running the SF as the master, I think it’s headphones would only hear its inputs.
But, you can mirror your 2 bus out in settings to say spdif and send that to the SF, so you’d hear it for tracking or a que mix for the SF.
Was that your concern ?
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Post by Drew @ UA on May 14, 2021 13:48:39 GMT -6
You'll want to use the x16 as your main interface for its superior D/A and clocking. It'll feed your Mons, Alt Mons, and Cues. Will I still be able to use the headphone amps in the quad? Sure. A SF with a TB card in it aggregates in the driver just like any Apollo and you can access its headphone amps. See below for an example. help.uaudio.com/hc/article_attachments/360094418032/4._multi_unit.png
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Post by Vincent R. on May 14, 2021 13:56:59 GMT -6
Will I still be able to use the headphone amps in the quad? Sure. A SF with a TB card in it aggregates in the driver just like any Apollo and you can access its headphone amps. See below for an example. Thanks Drew.
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Post by Drew @ UA on May 14, 2021 14:49:40 GMT -6
Sure. A SF with a TB card in it aggregates in the driver just like any Apollo and you can access its headphone amps. See below for an example. Thanks Drew. You got it!! Let me know if you have any other questions.
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Post by indiehouse on May 14, 2021 18:44:42 GMT -6
Man, I’ve been thinking hard of switching from my Motu 16a/828ES combo to either an Apollo X6/X16 combo (both of which I can get for a KILLER price). I just don’t see myself using unisum pre’s or printing with plugins because I have so much HW. I would love to monitor with fx though.
Or go all in with Lynx (n).
Or stay with my Motu 828es/16a combo. I presently monitor through a Dangerous Convert-2.
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Post by indiehouse on May 14, 2021 18:45:24 GMT -6
Help me off the ledge! Or help me take the plunge!
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Post by kcatthedog on May 14, 2021 18:59:03 GMT -6
If will not use unison on front end for tracking then as stated above , you are paying for features with Apollo you will not use: why ?
If Luna is the draw, then you must have an Apollo for Luna to work , but remember then every mix is tethered to having an Apollo for ever: is that what you want ?
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Post by forgotteng on Jun 2, 2021 20:02:58 GMT -6
Help me off the ledge! Or help me take the plunge! Well let me know if you take the plunge. I need a 16A
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Post by Guitar on Jun 3, 2021 16:51:12 GMT -6
I got that MOTU fever! Apollo gave me chicken pocks! Think slowly and take a nap before you jump.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2021 17:03:23 GMT -6
I got that MOTU fever! Apollo gave me chicken pocks! Think slowly and take a nap before you jump. I will say, the X series ain't the BF, Twin or SF Apollo's.. Out of several converters the MOTU / Apollo X are the closest sounding units and it's a tossup IMO which one I'd take. After some recent listening tests (unscientific), I slightly prefer the Apollo when used with monitor outs and MOTU when using headphones. It really just comes down to this, if you're invested in the UA ecosystem go Apollo. If not save yourself a boatload of money and either get a 1248 or a 16A.. I will point out though that UA's drivers are rock solid and their updates constant, although if you're on MAC and not in the UA dominion I'd skip both of these and go Metric Halo personally.
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Post by Guitar on Jun 3, 2021 17:05:18 GMT -6
I will say, the X series ain't the BF, Twin or SF Apollo's.. Out of several converters the MOTU / Apollo X are the closest sounding units and it's a tossup IMO which one I'd take. After some recent listening tests (unscientific), I slightly prefer the Apollo when used with monitor outs and MOTU when using headphones. It really just comes down to this, if you're invested in the UA ecosystem go Apollo. If not save yourself a boatload of money and either get a 1248 or a 16A.. I will point out though that UA's drivers are rock solid and their updates constant, although if you're on MAC and not in the UA dominion I'd skip both of these and go Metric Halo personally. Perfect response, that should answer the OP perfectly. If I had to guess, if there were a poll, MOTU and APOLLO would be the top two most common RGO interfaces, from what I've gathered. Kind of interesting.
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Post by phantom on Jun 3, 2021 17:14:31 GMT -6
To me they are equally good on sound quality, build quality, drivers, support, features.
With the Apollo you'll pay a lot more solely for entering the UAD ecosystem - basically dsp plugins and luna now. If you want that, go for it.
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Post by indiehouse on Jun 3, 2021 20:29:40 GMT -6
I got that MOTU fever! Apollo gave me chicken pocks! Think slowly and take a nap before you jump. I will say, the X series ain't the BF, Twin or SF Apollo's.. Out of several converters the MOTU / Apollo X are the closest sounding units and it's a tossup IMO which one I'd take. After some recent listening tests (unscientific), I slightly prefer the Apollo when used with monitor outs and MOTU when using headphones. It really just comes down to this, if you're invested in the UA ecosystem go Apollo. If not save yourself a boatload of money and either get a 1248 or a 16A.. I will point out though that UA's drivers are rock solid and their updates constant, although if you're on MAC and not in the UA dominion I'd skip both of these and go Metric Halo personally. When you say ‘invested in the UA ecosystem’, do you mean own a lot of UAD plugins? I “own” a lot of UAD plugins (that I can’t sell), running on a TB satellite. That was one of the draws for me to an Apollo. So, I guess I’m invested. BUT, I wouldn’t use unison preamps. I already have some really GREAT preamps. AND I wouldn’t track through plugins. I don’t see the point, aside from saving DSP. I already have GREAT HW and GREAT native plugins, and a ton of CPU on a new iMac. So I don’t need the extra processing power. So then what’s left? Luna? Meh. I feel like that’s another money pit with all the extra in-app purchases they want you to buy. Don’t get me wrong. They sound great and I’d probably buy them. I also feel Apollo’s are headed for a closed ecosystem. Wasn’t their an issue in the last UAD update that caused errors in latency reporting to Pro Tools? I feel like the response was “well, Pro Tools doesn’t accurately calculate ADC with non-Avid interfaces, so not our problem. But it works with our DAW!” But even after all of that, I’m still drawn to the X. Seems everywhere I look, people have Apollo’s in their racks.
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Post by indiehouse on Jun 3, 2021 20:30:22 GMT -6
I will say, the X series ain't the BF, Twin or SF Apollo's.. Out of several converters the MOTU / Apollo X are the closest sounding units and it's a tossup IMO which one I'd take. After some recent listening tests (unscientific), I slightly prefer the Apollo when used with monitor outs and MOTU when using headphones. It really just comes down to this, if you're invested in the UA ecosystem go Apollo. If not save yourself a boatload of money and either get a 1248 or a 16A.. I will point out though that UA's drivers are rock solid and their updates constant, although if you're on MAC and not in the UA dominion I'd skip both of these and go Metric Halo personally. Perfect response, that should answer the OP perfectly. If I had to guess, if there were a poll, MOTU and APOLLO would be the top two most common RGO interfaces, from what I've gathered. Kind of interesting. I’d probably say Apollo’s top Motu in popularity.
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Post by indiehouse on Jun 3, 2021 20:44:27 GMT -6
To me they are equally good on sound quality, build quality, drivers, support, features. With the Apollo you'll pay a lot more solely for entering the UAD ecosystem - basically dsp plugins and luna now. If you want that, go for it. I have both here right now, and I’d agree with that, more or less. I’d say Apollo has the nicer build quality. It’s one of the things I’m drawn to about it. The switches are chunky, the knobs are solid, the metal work has got heft. The Motu just feels cheaper in comparison and I hate that. But, Apollo’s are more expensive, so I’d expect that. As for sound quality, after blind A/B’ing the loop back recordings, they are really close. I mean, the difference in all of these converters is subtle. But it could also be that my ears aren’t trained enough to appreciate the differences. One persons subtle is another’s huge. I could reliably and consistently pick out the Apollo, though. It is a little more forward sounding in the upper midrange. It makes vocals seem more forward. I could see how some might find that fatiguing, or how some might consider that as more detailed. I didn’t find the sense of depth or separation noticeably different. I actually like the sound of the Apollo. It sounds exciting to me. There’s energy in that mid push. And I would LOVE the ability to monitor UAD reverb while vocal tracking. Or a bass amp sim while tracking bass. In the end, the move to an Apollo, especially an X6 only, would only make sense if I were to shed HW and commit to working mainly ITB. And I have to admit, the idea sounds rather enticing to not have to deal with patch bays, troubleshooting, HW maintenance, etc.
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Post by indiehouse on Jun 3, 2021 21:01:41 GMT -6
As far as features, I’ve got to admit that I really appreciate all of the connectivity options on the 828es/16a combo. And I use them. I wish it had AES, but I’ve found a workaround. The 828es gives you a pretty fleshed out monitor controller as well. And the routing matrix that I once despised? I have to admit that I’d miss it. I’ve used its flexibility many times to come up with solutions to different routing needs that have come up (once I fully understood it). I monitor through the mixer app, so latency is never an issue. This is more or less the UAD Console workflow. Motu does have some DSP to run basic channel strip and reverb stuff while tracking, but obvious points go to Apollo on that one.
And price? $1k for the 828es vs $2200 for the X6. Obvious value goes to Motu.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2021 21:17:42 GMT -6
I will say, the X series ain't the BF, Twin or SF Apollo's.. Out of several converters the MOTU / Apollo X are the closest sounding units and it's a tossup IMO which one I'd take. After some recent listening tests (unscientific), I slightly prefer the Apollo when used with monitor outs and MOTU when using headphones. It really just comes down to this, if you're invested in the UA ecosystem go Apollo. If not save yourself a boatload of money and either get a 1248 or a 16A.. I will point out though that UA's drivers are rock solid and their updates constant, although if you're on MAC and not in the UA dominion I'd skip both of these and go Metric Halo personally. So then what’s left? Luna? Meh. I feel like that’s another money pit with all the extra in-app purchases they want you to buy. Don’t get me wrong. They sound great and I’d probably buy them. I also feel Apollo’s are headed for a closed ecosystem. Wasn’t their an issue in the last UAD update that caused errors in latency reporting to Pro Tools? I feel like the response was “well, Pro Tools doesn’t accurately calculate ADC with non-Avid interfaces, so not our problem. But it works with our DAW!” What you mean like pro tools HDX with AAX / DSP? At least the barrier to entry is far less, I mean you can use it like every other DAW so? Issue with Luna is primarily the early stage of development AFAIK. If they want to have their pro tools share and give it out for free (as opposed to a sub on top of buying everything else) let them. I'd happily buy a summing plug once in a blue moon just to avoid the sub.. Having a true integrated alternative is an interesting concept and not unwelcome. As for the interfaces, well pretty much none of my interfaces correctly worked with Pro Tools native (in terms of latency) besides the Mbox Pro. It's one of the reasons I don't use it anymore. I think it comes down to how much UA listen to their customers regarding development, I'm not the early adopter type though so I'll stick with Logic until next year or something. Although, summing plugs / channel strips are fine but if they start feature walling core components that the front running DAW's contain then I'd give it a hard pass. Also, yes plugs are definitely another entry into the UAD ecosystem especially as it's DSP that can only be run on their platform.
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Post by ragan on Jun 3, 2021 22:52:33 GMT -6
I want more I/O and will be investing in it soon. I've been happily using a Symphony MKII for a few years now and the easiest/smoothest thing would be for me to just buy another card for it and get more channels. It's so damn expensive though, just for a card. Leads me to be forever eyeing things like the Apollo or MOTU or whatever. I liked both my Apollos. But I'm not really interested in re-tethering myself to UAD DSP.
It's always a shock to my system when I read the UAD threads where people are contemplating spending several hundred dollars on a couple of plugins. I'd just so, so much rather buy hardware with that kind of money. I think UAD are still on par with the best plugin devs out there, but being "on par" and costing 2-4x as much is a losing proposition in my book.
I've never used anything MOTU. It has an attraction though. Or maybe I'll just bite the bullet and get more Symphony I/O. I definitely like it.
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Post by jcoutu1 on Jun 4, 2021 0:13:14 GMT -6
Help me off the ledge! Or help me take the plunge! Well let me know if you take the plunge. I need a 16A Did you grab the one on reverb the other day for 750? I should have jumped quicker, but missed my chance.
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Post by indiehouse on Jun 4, 2021 2:55:12 GMT -6
Well let me know if you take the plunge. I need a 16A Did you grab the one on reverb the other day for 750? I should have jumped quicker, but missed my chance. I just looked it up, one sold two days ago for 850. “Priced to sell because it’s a little dirty.” That might be the laziest thing I’ve heard of in a while.
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Post by kcatthedog on Jun 4, 2021 3:08:21 GMT -6
Indie, the X6 also includes 6 sharc chips. So, your price differential falls a fair bit.
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