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Post by doqmemory on Dec 7, 2020 16:32:14 GMT -6
I got mine in Friday and really like it so far. I have about ten other tube microphones (all either modded or completely rebuilt) and this is easily my favorite. I have not yet put a new tube in, since the stock tube is very quiet and sounds great. I am almost finished with a Dany D67 clone, so I'll soon see how it compares. Will update after I finish the burn-in and do some comparison recordings.
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Post by Quint on Dec 7, 2020 17:56:33 GMT -6
I got mine in Friday and really like it so far. I have about ten other tube microphones (all either modded or completely rebuilt) and this is easily my favorite. I have not yet put a new tube in, since the stock tube is very quiet and sounds great. I am almost finished with a Dany D67 clone, so I'll soon see how it compares. Will update after I finish the burn-in and do some comparison recordings. The regular WA67 or the mod with the K67 capsule?
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Post by doqmemory on Dec 7, 2020 19:02:23 GMT -6
Regular WA-67. I have a Heiserman HK67 ordered for my D-67 build.
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Post by Guitar on Dec 8, 2020 12:43:11 GMT -6
doqmemory if you get chance to post those comparison recordings, RGO would love you for it.
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Post by drumsound on Dec 8, 2020 12:56:53 GMT -6
just watched the video. The Vintage is so much better to me. Just so smooth and uniform sounding. The warm has too much sizzle and the low mids aren't as nice. Probably doesn't suck though. That's the same things I noticed. The U67 just had this inviting, finished sound. The WA67 is kind of zippy and not as pillowy in the bottom. Not bad sounding, and I'm sure I could make use of it. Did anybody see that Zen Pro is now offering the WA67 modded with a Neumann K67? $1759. I wonder how close the WA67 circuit is to the original? With a real K67, that makes it an interesting proposition. That is interesting.
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
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Post by ericn on Dec 8, 2020 14:26:07 GMT -6
just watched the video. The Vintage is so much better to me. Just so smooth and uniform sounding. The warm has too much sizzle and the low mids aren't as nice. Probably doesn't suck though. That's the same things I noticed. The U67 just had this inviting, finished sound. The WA67 is kind of zippy and not as pillowy in the bottom. Not bad sounding, and I'm sure I could make use of it. Did anybody see that Zen Pro is now offering the WA67 modded with a Neumann K67? $1759. I wonder how close the WA67 circuit is to the original? With a real K67, that makes it an interesting proposition. That is interesting. It is, but then I’m going to want a better transformer and then I’ll want better Caps...
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Post by drumsound on Dec 8, 2020 14:34:59 GMT -6
That's the same things I noticed. The U67 just had this inviting, finished sound. The WA67 is kind of zippy and not as pillowy in the bottom. Not bad sounding, and I'm sure I could make use of it. That is interesting. It is, but then I’m going to want a better transformer and then I’ll want better Caps... Ah, the rabbit hole...
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
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Post by ericn on Dec 8, 2020 14:39:01 GMT -6
It is, but then I’m going to want a better transformer and then I’ll want better Caps... Ah, the rabbit hole... That’s the problem with cheap mics, they become an expensive never ending rabbit hole the second you start modding them, then you realize you should just buy a more accurate clone and that you are never going to get your money out of that rabbit hole.
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Post by doqmemory on Dec 8, 2020 15:12:00 GMT -6
doqmemory if you get chance to post those comparison recordings, RGO would love you for it. My D-67 has been burning in since last night, so I'll try some recording side-by-side with the WA-67 (4 days burned in) tonight or tomorrow. I might add a FET mic for comparison, as well.
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Post by Guitar on Dec 8, 2020 15:19:22 GMT -6
That’s the problem with cheap mics, they become an expensive never ending rabbit hole the second you start modding them, then you realize you should just buy a more accurate clone and that you are never going to get your money out of that rabbit hole. Specific capacitor upgrades can help some cheap but decent mics grow an inch taller. Ribbon mics are a really rewarding place to spend mod energy, a reribbon and a transformer will turn a cheap ribbon mic into something you want to use. Fiddly work though. Not that expensive. Rebuilding an Apex 460 is something else altogether, I'm almost not sure if it counts as a mod. It's sort of a design platform if you want it to be. But otherwise I agree with you. Some mics are best left as their grungy selves.
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Post by Quint on Dec 8, 2020 16:29:20 GMT -6
That's the same things I noticed. The U67 just had this inviting, finished sound. The WA67 is kind of zippy and not as pillowy in the bottom. Not bad sounding, and I'm sure I could make use of it. That is interesting. It is, but then I’m going to want a better transformer and then I’ll want better Caps... I could be wrong, but other than the capsule and transformer, I thought Warm was using all of the capacitors, transistors, etc that you would expect in the original mic they are cloning? In other words, provided that the circuit itself is the same (maybe it's not?), the only real upgrades to make on a mic like the WA67 would be the capsule and transformer. But I may be mistaken about what's inside these Warm clone mics.
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Post by Guitar on Dec 8, 2020 19:37:33 GMT -6
It is, but then I’m going to want a better transformer and then I’ll want better Caps... I could be wrong, but other than the capsule and transformer, I thought Warm was using all of the capacitors, transistors, etc that you would expect in the original mic they are cloning? In other words, provided that the circuit itself is the same (maybe it's not?), the only real upgrades to make on a mic like the WA67 would be the capsule and transformer. But I may be mistaken about what's inside these Warm clone mics. The schematics are similar, I believe, but the parts are going to be different. For example the original 251 used a wet tantalum capacitor, which is a $50 part now. The Warm uses an inexpensive film capacitor, which will sound noticeably different in the coupling position. With microphones the devil is sometimes in the details.
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Post by kcatthedog on Dec 8, 2020 19:50:47 GMT -6
I could be wrong, but other than the capsule and transformer, I thought Warm was using all of the capacitors, transistors, etc that you would expect in the original mic they are cloning? In other words, provided that the circuit itself is the same (maybe it's not?), the only real upgrades to make on a mic like the WA67 would be the capsule and transformer. But I may be mistaken about what's inside these Warm clone mics. The schematics are similar, I believe, but the parts are going to be different. For example the original 251 used a wet tantalum capacitor, which is a $50 part now. The Warm uses an inexpensive film capacitor, which will sound noticeably different in the coupling position. With microphones the devil is sometimes in the details. Where can one order the wet tantalum capacitor?
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Post by Guitar on Dec 8, 2020 19:59:46 GMT -6
The schematics are similar, I believe, but the parts are going to be different. For example the original 251 used a wet tantalum capacitor, which is a $50 part now. The Warm uses an inexpensive film capacitor, which will sound noticeably different in the coupling position. With microphones the devil is sometimes in the details. Where can one order the wet tantalum capacitor? I think Mouser has some. The Sprague TE-1501 is another good one, an electrolytic capacitor that I use that someone tipped me on, that's not nearly as expensive. Paper and oil is another good option if you can find one that fits. I didn't really like the polypropylene film sound in the mics I built, in that position. Too snappy and bright.
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Post by ChaseUTB on Dec 8, 2020 21:28:36 GMT -6
Re: the VK shootout: Real 67 is a refined finished sound. Butter smooth throughout the spectrum. On earbuds they sound way different. BF FP01 monitors they are more similar tone wise but still sound different frequency wise. The Wa67 sounds +3db up 5kHz to 10kHz, real 67 is just $$$$$
A vintage 67 is $10-12k, reissue is $7k & Wa67 is $8-900? Huge price difference. Does the real sound 10x better here? I could outfit a whole B room for 10k lol.
The Zen Pro Wa67 w/ real K67 is $1759 ( $1859 msrp) makes me think about those $1500-1700 custom M49s. $1800 can get you a lot of 67 from one of those builders!
Warm is providing good to very good quality at the price! 5 years ago to get the sound of the Wa67 it cost $1500 to $1800 via Miktek CV4 or TFunk CU29/ AK47 ( AR51 is trash the 3 I had always sounded broken to me, both capsules )
For the Wa67 price I would look into miktek c7e. IMO you need a bigger budget to get the tube 67 mic sound.
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Post by doqmemory on Dec 9, 2020 22:04:20 GMT -6
doqmemory if you get chance to post those comparison recordings, RGO would love you for it. Here is a sample verse of a classic John Prine song that I always use for mic comparisons. Recorded simultaneously WA-67, my DIY D-67 (AMI T67 transformer, Amperex EF86, cheap K-67 capsule from a donor mic, probably a Bad Aax GT-2B), and an AKG C414 XLII. WA-67D-67C414 XLIII have a nicer Amperex NOS Bugle Boy that I will put in the D-67 once the Heiserman HK-67 comes in.
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Post by doqmemory on Dec 9, 2020 22:07:49 GMT -6
I did no processing except slight manual level matching. The 67s are straight into the interface and the C414 is through an ART Pro MPA II with high plate voltage.
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Post by Guitar on Dec 9, 2020 22:46:39 GMT -6
Very interesting! What capsule do you currently have in the DIY 67?
I liked both of the 67's better than the 414 on this example. The D67 being brighter and louder, and the Warm being a little darker and softer, maybe it's lower in level I don't know, but they both have this nice sort of open quality that I think I like in K67 style mics, in the mids, "Neumann mids" I guess, originally.
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Post by doqmemory on Dec 9, 2020 23:04:02 GMT -6
The D-67 has one of my many K-67 style capsules stripped from donor mics. It is probably either from a GT-2B or an HT-11a, but it might be from an old Alctron. It was just the first double-sided capsule I grabbed off the stack.
I pretty much agree with your analysis. The C414 is not really a good mic for this kind of vocal, but it gives a good reference point. I only had room for two tube mics in this comparison (I need to hook up another power strip, since I only had two extra power slots in the power conditioner), anyway.
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Post by Ward on Dec 10, 2020 7:36:23 GMT -6
A vintage 67 is $10-12k, reissue is $7k & Wa67 is $8-900? Huge price difference. Does the real sound 10x better here? Yes, it does sound 10x better...and with a Telefunken 806s or the Ampherex 86? 100x better or more. Great deals at Radioshack! LOL
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Post by Guitar on Dec 10, 2020 8:12:57 GMT -6
The D-67 has one of my many K-67 style capsules stripped from donor mics. It is probably either from a GT-2B or an HT-11a, but it might be from an old Alctron. It was just the first double-sided capsule I grabbed off the stack. I pretty much agree with your analysis. The C414 is not really a good mic for this kind of vocal, but it gives a good reference point. I only had room for two tube mics in this comparison (I need to hook up another power strip, since I only had two extra power slots in the power conditioner), anyway. I'm surprised how decent those capsules can be with some HF de emphasis, like they're supposed to have. I have some 67-ish mics, a pair, with the Apex capsules that are very multi purpose. I was thinking about buying some Heiserman capsules to listen to but I haven't gone there yet. I guess the generic chinese k67 are probably going to be a little brighter, like in your test vs the Warm. I think they are usable though, I use mine anyway.
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Post by Vincent R. on Dec 10, 2020 9:36:41 GMT -6
A vintage 67 is $10-12k, reissue is $7k & Wa67 is $8-900? Huge price difference. Does the real sound 10x better here? Yes, it does sound 10x better...and with a Telefunken 806s or the Ampherex 86? 100x better or more. Great deals at Radioshack! LOL That Amperex 86.... It's freaking magic.
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Post by chessparov on Dec 10, 2020 18:12:45 GMT -6
It may not be quite the best for their business. But the quiet marketing understatement of Microtech Gefell, well it's kind of refreshing (in a way)...
Compared to the hyperbole of companies like Warm. Don't get me wrong, I think their microphones are excellent. Iconic "Great" is another story. Kinda like comparing a nice Kinkaid to a Michelangelo (not the TMNT who loves pizza!)
But like the Films of Yore, there's a place for the great "Character" microphone. Of which a WA-67 (or 47 etc.), may have a Supporting Role. Chris
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Post by Vincent R. on Dec 20, 2020 18:25:12 GMT -6
I gotta say, after playing with the WA47 for a few months and really being impressed by it, I could see a pair of these in my future... to accompany my MK U67... maybe another high end U67.
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Post by Johnkenn on Dec 20, 2020 18:53:10 GMT -6
Don’t wanna be that guy...but this guy has
Pair of BAE 1073s Pultecs 2254’s Gates Sta-Level CL-1B LA-2A 4-1176’s One Bluestripe Pair of 33102’s 33609 And several others...going into an SPL Crimson...
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