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Post by svart on Sept 30, 2020 7:27:01 GMT -6
Been experimenting with pulling a lot of my bussing and summing back ITB.
Besides having to find the sweet spots for everything once again, it really doesn't sound much different, although I'm probably getting a better overall mix from being forced to do these things.
I'm supposed to be doing a quick session soon and I might try going completely ITB for it.
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Post by Ward on Oct 1, 2020 8:16:12 GMT -6
My future studio plans always include an LFAC. But then it goes on the plan, and comes off the plan - several times a year. And a 7' grandpiano: Probably a Yamaha, mahogany, in high gloss black, with the MIDI options. Then I start pricing it . . . and it gets put on 'next year's list'
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Oct 1, 2020 8:21:31 GMT -6
My future studio plans always include an LFAC. But then it goes on the plan, and comes off the plan - several times a year. And a 7' grandpiano: Probably a Yamaha, mahogany, in high gloss black, with the MIDI options. Then I start pricing it . . . and it gets put on 'next year's list' I have to hook you up with piano guy.
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Oct 1, 2020 8:23:53 GMT -6
The more I look at where I want to go the more I think I need to convince Matt at Ironage to build the console module I want.
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Post by svart on Oct 7, 2020 16:41:04 GMT -6
So, I took a project and did a hybrid mix as usual.
I then saved it, copied it and then set it up as a pure ITB mix.
It only took about 10 minutes to set up a few plugs to emulate my master bus processing.
Sounds 98% similar. The difference is not in the fidelity, but in the way the dynamics react, which I bet is mostly just the calibration of my hardware compressor.
At this point I'm pretty sold at going mostly ITB in the near future with no worries of sonics.
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Post by Martin John Butler on Oct 7, 2020 16:43:48 GMT -6
Definitely go in with some sweet analogue gear. After that, no worries, stay ITB.
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Post by svart on Oct 7, 2020 17:19:13 GMT -6
Definitely go in with some sweet analogue gear. After that, no worries, stay ITB. I'd keep the racks of preamps and maybe an 1176 or two.
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Post by mrholmes on Oct 7, 2020 17:29:44 GMT -6
I unplugged everything in my 32 i/o hybrid rig and went in the box in April. Got rid of my desk too. Still coming to grips with the change but I already know I won't go back. Besides issues with hardware delay compensation and end of life gear (Symphony MK1), I started to feel boxed into one method because I became reluctant to twist knobs. I now have a healthy pile of gear to sell/trade, which I'm going to plow into Avid S1s and iPads. I already own a Dock and it's killer. I want to start using VCA spill as a core mixing technique, and the trio of Control/Dock/S1 will do it all night long: Honestly I used to be very anti-ITB but now that plugs are generally pretty good at emulating hardware these days, I'm feeling much less apprehensive. I've come to like certain aspects of ITB mixing, especially the absolute recall stuff so I can move between projects in seconds. I'd still need to keep 24 inputs since I do use most of them during main tracking, so I'd go with a MOTU 24ai on that. I've been looking at their other offerings and since I'd need 8x analog outputs for headphone sends and a pair of RCA SPDIF/AES I/O for mixdown and monitoring on the digital monitors and a pair of analog outputs for the analog monitors. I'd likely go with their 828es interface for this as well but that leaves nothing for looping out to hardware if I wanted to keep any rack gear, although they have two sets of ADAT optical I/O and I currently use ADAT-to-analog converters to create my headphone mixes. I had hoped to get rid of those, but I suppose I could keep them. And then the computer, a new desk, etc. Lots of cash to scratch the itch that really doesn't need scratching yet.
I just can speak for myself:
Using a console simulation or using my DELTA sounds different - and it's not subtle, or something I need to second guess. The console sounds wider, opener and the EQ ads something nice. I guess its phase shift.
We talk a DELTA, and not something wild expensive.
And yes I agree more and more plug ins pop up which do the trick. Just had one of those surprises yesterday with Softube TAPE - there was the glue and the subtle transient shaping, and a magic bigness of drums. For 30 bucks there was no way to say NO.
And, yet I still believe that great sounding plugs are not the rule they are the exception. It takes a lot of time to search for the good ones.
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Post by Omicron9 on Oct 8, 2020 9:29:43 GMT -6
Greetings.
I think this is a fine exercise/practice to do occasionally.
My most recent go at this was 3 or 4 years ago. My back end was a Tascam X-48 which I'd been running for years. It was developing issues that neither I nor Tascam could fix (after sending it back to them for servicing). I had 6 racks of gear, and a Mackie 16-channel board. I only do rough mixes here; the real mixing and mastering are done by others at their studios. I used the Mackie for rough mixes, so it was fine in that application. Essentially mine is a tracking studio.
When it was clearly time to replace the X-48 (sad; it had served me well and tracked many albums), I knew it was time to go DAW instead of another dedicated HD recorder. I'd not been doing rough mixes for a very long time and in fact had stopped. The workflow changed to shipping all the tracks right to the mix engineer, bypassing me doing the roughs. I started asking myself some hard questions about which hardware was really required.
I sold off about five racks' worth of gear. Patchbays, delays, reverbs. And the X-48 to someone who was aware of its issues but wanted it as a project. I bought a high-end laptop and Reaper. I now have everything in one rack. Granted it's a 3-foot tall rack, but still. It contains a rack drawer for the laptop, Millennia and Sytek mic pres, an RME UFX+, headphone amp, and I kept the M7. Pry the M7 from my cold dead hands...
It's a much cleaner setup. Easier/quicker to walk in and start tracking. Less maintenance. Not only was my workflow greatly improved, but the sonics are also improved over the X-48.
Streamlining the gear while simultaneously improving the sonics and workflow felt wonderful. It still does.
So, I'd always recommend re-thinking current setups and needs. It can't hurt! And in my case was quite beneficial.
Regards, -09
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Post by Ward on Oct 8, 2020 9:35:47 GMT -6
Definitely go in with some sweet analogue gear. After that, no worries, stay ITB. I'd keep the racks of preamps and maybe an 1176 or two. How soon before someone like Kemper comes out with a microphone preamp emulator? I mean a good one, not Focusrite's Liquid thingy. Say it's got 8 channels and you can have them each be either be a 312, 1073, 72, 76, BA2, BA7, Redd 47, Redd 53 etc etc ?
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Post by jcoutu1 on Oct 8, 2020 9:56:42 GMT -6
I'd keep the racks of preamps and maybe an 1176 or two. How soon before someone like Kemper comes out with a microphone preamp emulator? I mean a good one, not Focusrite's Liquid thingy. Say it's got 8 channels and you can have them each be either be a 312, 1073, 72, 76, BA2, BA7, Redd 47, Redd 53 etc etc ? ...that's the UAD Apollo.
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Post by Ward on Oct 8, 2020 10:06:47 GMT -6
How soon before someone like Kemper comes out with a microphone preamp emulator? I mean a good one, not Focusrite's Liquid thingy. Say it's got 8 channels and you can have them each be either be a 312, 1073, 72, 76, BA2, BA7, Redd 47, Redd 53 etc etc ? ...that's the UAD Apollo. Not good enough.
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Post by svart on Oct 8, 2020 10:44:51 GMT -6
...that's the UAD Apollo. Not good enough. And it's UA..
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Post by jcoutu1 on Oct 8, 2020 12:39:30 GMT -6
...that's the UAD Apollo. Not good enough. Seems plenty good for a lot of people. I haven't used it, but a lot of people are making good sounding records with them.
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Post by Martin John Butler on Oct 10, 2020 11:30:38 GMT -6
I think the 3rd gen Apollos are good enough. I would of course like a Dangerous Music 2 Bus +, and even a Convert 2, but the current Apollo doesn't bug me. That's a big thing, the first and second series always bothered me, even though I did some good work with them..
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Post by svart on Oct 10, 2020 12:48:49 GMT -6
I just don't like the UA sound, and I don't like their designs (nor their prices), so it's a moot point.
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Post by stormymondays on Oct 10, 2020 16:02:17 GMT -6
Kush Omega preamp and plug-ins are supposed to do that. The plugins are cool but I haven’t tried the pre.
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Post by Ward on Oct 10, 2020 17:11:39 GMT -6
I just don't like the UA sound, and I don't like their designs (nor their prices), so it's a moot point. I don't think I could possibly agree with you more.
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Post by svart on Oct 10, 2020 17:51:09 GMT -6
I just don't like the UA sound, and I don't like their designs (nor their prices), so it's a moot point. I don't think I could possibly agree with you more. It's that strange mid-range timbre they have. Even their newest designs have it, but the old ones were crazy bad. Even my motu m4 sounds better..
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Post by Ward on Oct 11, 2020 7:04:25 GMT -6
100% svart. And the old ones had the suyper high freq aliasing going on constantly. I guess they figured most 1/2-deaf musicians would never hear it, and that's who they were marketing to. It's disappointing because I really would like to give Luna a solid evaluation but you need to buy into the entire UA system for that,AFAIK.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 11, 2020 14:27:37 GMT -6
Third that. It has a sound like RME and Apogee. It's like RME but less dead inside. The original silverface apollos used a lot of the same parts as the Prism desktop units. The Prisms still beat the latest X series despite the newer chips.
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Post by svart on Oct 11, 2020 17:28:13 GMT -6
Well my future plans might be foundation repair. The basement/studio flooded last night due to the remnants of Delta dumping multiple inches of rain on me in a few hours.
I spent 3 hours last night running two shop vacs to keep up with the water squirting in through a crack in the wall. And still couldn't keep up.
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Post by ragan on Oct 11, 2020 17:34:43 GMT -6
Well my future plans might be foundation repair. The basement/studio flooded last night due to the remnants of Delta dumping multiple inches of rain on me in a few hours. I spent 3 hours last night running two shop vacs to keep up with the water squirting in through a crack in the wall. And still couldn't keep up. Ahh damn. That is no fun. Any chance some hydraulic cement would do it? It's obviously not the ultimate solution but when a leak is only showing up during severe weather, I've had good luck patching with it.
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Oct 11, 2020 18:17:25 GMT -6
Well my future plans might be foundation repair. The basement/studio flooded last night due to the remnants of Delta dumping multiple inches of rain on me in a few hours. I spent 3 hours last night running two shop vacs to keep up with the water squirting in through a crack in the wall. And still couldn't keep up. Sorry to hear that, foundation issues are never cheap.
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Post by svart on Oct 11, 2020 19:20:16 GMT -6
Well my future plans might be foundation repair. The basement/studio flooded last night due to the remnants of Delta dumping multiple inches of rain on me in a few hours. I spent 3 hours last night running two shop vacs to keep up with the water squirting in through a crack in the wall. And still couldn't keep up. Ahh damn. That is no fun. Any chance some hydraulic cement would do it? It's obviously not the ultimate solution but when a leak is only showing up during severe weather, I've had good luck patching with it. It's leaked before, but these last two hurricanes have made it literally spew water. I'll post a video of it tomorrow. Over the course of the night I vacuumed about 50 gallons up. The laminate flooring is ruined and some rugs have a permanent musk to them now. Right after it started, the water got about 2" deep in the studio along the wall and my stupid shop vac wouldn't start. I had to go dig out my grandfather's antique shop vac and repair the hose as it was dry rotted. It didn't work very well but I was able to keep up with the water for a few minutes while I took the other one apart. It still didn't work until I got so mad at it I hit it with a hammer and it started. I kept it running for about 3-4 hours while I carted full buckets of water out the back door. Once the rain stopped, the vac sputtered and died and I couldn't get it running again, so it's trashed now. I guess I got a good 20 years from it and it worked just long enough this one last time. Today I bought a new one and some sealers that might keep me dry until I can get a foundation assessment.
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