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Post by jcoutu1 on Aug 4, 2020 9:28:07 GMT -6
What would you guys recommend as the studio workhorse pair? Basically a pair of mics that I can have up and ready for whatever I have going that day. Fiddle, accordion, acoustic guitar, Mando, oud, melodica, bgvs etc.
Fairly often I have sessions where we're recording a bunch of different things in a short amount of time and I just want a pair that will be decent on everything, but won't break the bank.
I'm thinking a pair of 414s. Sure, I'd love a pair of 87s, but they're out of reach. What would you guys suggest?
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Post by stormymondays on Aug 4, 2020 9:40:01 GMT -6
I don't have direct experience with them but if you are considering 414s maybe you could consider Austrian Audio. They've gotten great reviews. austrian.audio/oc818/Also, not what you're looking for, but for all those instruments except acoustic guitar, I'd break out my pair of Stager SR-2N. Drums too.
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Aug 4, 2020 9:40:18 GMT -6
Gefell UMT70’s would be my first choice, because I’m different Sony C48’s second choice. 414’s can be had cheap though and won’t disappoint.
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Post by drbill on Aug 4, 2020 10:09:34 GMT -6
Personally, I hate 414's. OK, hate is a strong word. Dislike.
87's or UM70's would both make a great option. If you can't afford either....there are probably other cheaper options that would work well, but I haven't had enough coffee yet....
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Aug 4, 2020 10:33:20 GMT -6
Personally, I hate 414's. OK, hate is a strong word. Dislike. 87's or UM70's would both make a great option. If you can't afford either....there are probably other cheaper options that would work well, but I haven't had enough coffee yet.... 414’s well ok great 414’s are quite rare, in general I do agree but Damn that JW modded 414 with a brass capsule I lost in IKE was the exception! As for cheaper, yeah there are options but all the usual suspects leave me feeling like I’m missing something. Now I can think of some interesting stuff in the esoteric world, but my hunch is they would be that in a for hire room they would be a hard sell. The other option would be a nice pair of 84’s and say a Heiserman tube or Upton. You could get some of the other 80 series capsules and pretty much cover everything. Plus you would have an impressive tube LDC.
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Post by drbill on Aug 4, 2020 11:19:55 GMT -6
Personally, I hate 414's. OK, hate is a strong word. Dislike. 87's or UM70's would both make a great option. If you can't afford either....there are probably other cheaper options that would work well, but I haven't had enough coffee yet.... 414’s well ok great 414’s are quite rare, in general I do agree but Damn that JW modded 414 with a brass capsule I lost in IKE was the exception!As for cheaper, yeah there are options but all the usual suspects leave me feeling like I’m missing something. Now I can think of some interesting stuff in the esoteric world, but my hunch is they would be that in a for hire room they would be a hard sell. The other option would be a nice pair of 84’s and say a Heiserman tube or Upton. You could get some of the other 80 series capsules and pretty much cover everything. Plus you would have an impressive tube LDC. yeah, no doubt!! But I'm not sure you can really call that a 414 can you? Maybe.... Rarer than hens teeth though. 86's would be a nice setup and more flex than 84's, but I'm afraid the budget might dwarf the 87 budget. Personally, I think 4-5 mics out on stands in J's situation would give more flexibility.
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Post by jcoutu1 on Aug 4, 2020 11:36:51 GMT -6
Personally, I hate 414's. OK, hate is a strong word. Dislike. 87's or UM70's would both make a great option. If you can't afford either....there are probably other cheaper options that would work well, but I haven't had enough coffee yet.... 414’s well ok great 414’s are quite rare, in general I do agree but Damn that JW modded 414 with a brass capsule I lost in IKE was the exception! As for cheaper, yeah there are options but all the usual suspects leave me feeling like I’m missing something. Now I can think of some interesting stuff in the esoteric world, but my hunch is they would be that in a for hire room they would be a hard sell. The other option would be a nice pair of 84’s and say a Heiserman tube or Upton. You could get some of the other 80 series capsules and pretty much cover everything. Plus you would have an impressive tube LDC. I've got a Flea47 and custom BeesNeez 49ish mic for the big tube mics. Basically I keep my drums, an electric guitar cab, and a bass cab set up and mic'd at all times. I'm strictly looking for a pair to do the random stuff. I was thinking about those gefells. Any other thoughts?
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Post by sean on Aug 4, 2020 12:04:46 GMT -6
414’s (I have a pair of Jim Williams modified ULS models), Neumann U89 or TLM170,Gefell UM70, Milab VIP50 (pretty rare though), Beyer MC740 (some people find them too sibilant)...
I think a pair of 414’s (I personally like the EB and ULS models, brass capsules are out of my budget) or U89’s or TLM170’s are good throw it on anything it’ll sound good. Maybe not EXCEPTIONAL, but good.
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Post by michaelcleary on Aug 4, 2020 12:07:38 GMT -6
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Post by svart on Aug 4, 2020 12:08:42 GMT -6
414’s well ok great 414’s are quite rare, in general I do agree but Damn that JW modded 414 with a brass capsule I lost in IKE was the exception! As for cheaper, yeah there are options but all the usual suspects leave me feeling like I’m missing something. Now I can think of some interesting stuff in the esoteric world, but my hunch is they would be that in a for hire room they would be a hard sell. The other option would be a nice pair of 84’s and say a Heiserman tube or Upton. You could get some of the other 80 series capsules and pretty much cover everything. Plus you would have an impressive tube LDC. I've got a Flea47 and custom BeesNeez 49ish mic for the big tube mics. Basically I keep my drums, an electric guitar cab, and a bass cab set up and mic'd at all times. I'm strictly looking for a pair to do the random stuff. I was thinking about those gefells. Any other thoughts? I wouldn't go with the UM70's as utilitarian mics. After having one for years, it was a great mic on some things, but other things not so much. My Gefell M930's are great on everything, but not multipattern, but I find multiple patterns overrated anyway. I'd look at the mid-level Lewitt mics for good, clean workhorses. I have the 540 and it's been a great mic on pretty much everything that I don't use the M930's on.
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Post by Guitar on Aug 4, 2020 12:09:41 GMT -6
The usual places to look would be Shure KSM32, KSM44, AT4050, AT4040, AT4033A, things like that but I haven't tried all of them. One question would be, do you need patterns or is cardioid only OK.
This is a microphone style that is severely lacking in my collection also.
I was also looking at Aston, SE Electronics, and Lewitt. Those have gained some prominence in the last few years also. All of these brands have options of these types of mics, different features and price points. It's kind of tough to buy something blind.
I was thinking of starting cheap with an AT4033, maybe AT4040, and an SE SE X1S. That's an easier punt than the more expensive ones. And I already know that AT mic from having one in the past. I know the AT4033 gets a good acoustic guitar sound.
My gut instinct would be to go with the Shure mics, for a little more money. Since I know the KSM137 and KSM141. Audio Technica doesn't always blow me away, but they do work.
The SE, Lewitt, Aston are unexplored for me.
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Post by Omicron9 on Aug 4, 2020 12:30:08 GMT -6
The Shure KSM44 is a wonderful thing. SS, multi-pattern, very low self-noise. I use it on so many things and always sounds great. I sold my 414 pair a few years ago. They worked in various applications, but it was never stellar or the exact fit on much of anything. The KSM32 is also wonderful, but is cardioid-only. The KSM141 is, IME and opinion, rather awesome, but is only two patterns and also SDC.
-09
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Post by jcoutu1 on Aug 4, 2020 12:44:11 GMT -6
The Shure KSM44 is a wonderful thing. SS, multi-pattern, very low self-noise. I use it on so many things and always sounds great. I sold my 414 pair a few years ago. They worked in various applications, but it was never stellar or the exact fit on much of anything. The KSM32 is also wonderful, but is cardioid-only. The KSM141 is, IME and opinion, rather awesome, but is only two patterns and also SDC. -09 I've been using lowly KSM27's that I grabbed 15-20 years ago.
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Post by jeremygillespie on Aug 4, 2020 13:04:45 GMT -6
I know it’s a sort of Love/Hate mic, but the Chandler TG mic I picked up a few months ago has sounded frigin GREAT on everything I put it in front of. Before that I was using 414’s and.... yeah they are “meh”
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Post by marylin on Aug 4, 2020 13:12:25 GMT -6
Austrian Audio oc818 would be my choice...great mic.
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Post by EmRR on Aug 4, 2020 13:23:43 GMT -6
With the list in your first sentence, I lean hard towards a modern voiced ribbon. That's the only thing I've got that's been used on 99% of tracks on a couple of records. After that I would lean SDC omni.
I don't think there's a multi pattern LDC I would call an all around workhorse, they're all so finicky and specific sounding. Great when they are, 'eh' on lots of stuff, bad on some stuff.
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Post by mcirish on Aug 4, 2020 14:39:29 GMT -6
I use a pair of AT4050 mics when I need a pair of LDC. Not great on anything but never bad. For acoustic instruments I tend to go for a SDC, like the Beyer 930 or Oktava 012. I think the AT4050 and the KSM44 are kind of similar. Good bang for the buck and they can work well on a number of sources providing you are not looking for mojo. They are both clean and pretty generic (in a good way).
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Post by stormymondays on Aug 4, 2020 17:03:59 GMT -6
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Post by jcoutu1 on Aug 4, 2020 17:31:35 GMT -6
I've already got the v44s, so looking for something different.
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Post by thirdeye on Aug 4, 2020 17:43:23 GMT -6
In my own similar search, I've been eyeballing a pair of Mojave MA301fets. I have not tried them yet, but they are pretty high on my list to replace or augment my 414s. I love my pair of Mojave MA200s.
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Post by chessparov on Aug 4, 2020 18:41:25 GMT -6
IMHO before anyone pulls the trigger on a Multi-Pattern "Workhorse"... It'd be smart to contact Heiserman, regarding status of the Type 19. Honestly, I preferred the voicing, over the brighter/competing Austrian Audio's and Lewitt's.
FWIW the only Lewitt's that work well, with my sibilant voice, are the 840 Tube-and 940 (cause it's both SS/Tube). Chris
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Post by tourtelot on Aug 4, 2020 19:33:00 GMT -6
Another vote for some Gefell UM70S mics.
D.
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Post by ragan on Aug 4, 2020 19:57:28 GMT -6
I liked my pair of 414b-ULS’s until the Warblers kicked them out of my mic locker.
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Post by jeremygillespie on Aug 4, 2020 21:33:34 GMT -6
IMHO before anyone pulls the trigger on a Multi-Pattern "Workhorse"... It'd be smart to contact Heiserman, regarding status of the Type 19. Honestly, I preferred the voicing, over the brighter/competing Austrian Audio's and Lewitt's. FWIW the only Lewitt's that work well, with my sibilant voice, are the 840 Tube-and 940 (cause it's both SS/Tube). Chris What’s this type 19? I must have missed something.
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Post by thirdeye on Aug 4, 2020 21:52:52 GMT -6
IMHO before anyone pulls the trigger on a Multi-Pattern "Workhorse"... It'd be smart to contact Heiserman, regarding status of the Type 19. Honestly, I preferred the voicing, over the brighter/competing Austrian Audio's and Lewitt's. FWIW the only Lewitt's that work well, with my sibilant voice, are the 840 Tube-and 940 (cause it's both SS/Tube). Chris What’s this type 19? I must have missed something. realgearonline.com/thread/10823/new-heiserman-microphone-type-19
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