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Post by woofhead on Jul 2, 2020 14:27:26 GMT -6
I bought my 441's used on german ebay for around 250 each on average. and had them shipped to my wife's parents who live in germany, and she would bring them back when visiting them.Some sellers will ship to the us and shipping has been reasonable for the items I had shipped directly here, comparable to shipping coast to coast.I would only pay with paypal and not bank transfer as I got burned once(only time out of more than a hundred german ebay transactions) and it twas on a 441 as I remember.Dont see many used 441's in the us recently but 10 15 years ago saw them for around 350.Maybe more will come up soon if I see any will post I'm all set for 441's.Good luck!
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Post by svart on Jul 2, 2020 16:06:32 GMT -6
Audix i5 Gives you more top and a beefier bottom (Which you usually want) However it still doesn’t always have that classic 57 tone that is hard to beat. 441 for a fat disco snare 421 can work too. Apparently hardcore/punk/indie producer Jay Maas uses a 421 on snare. His stuff sounds bonkers good in those genres so it's definitely worth a try! Dang. I think I tried one years ago but I don't remember how it sounded. I'll try it again.
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Post by svart on Jul 2, 2020 19:44:26 GMT -6
Audix i5 Gives you more top and a beefier bottom (Which you usually want) However it still doesn’t always have that classic 57 tone that is hard to beat. 441 for a fat disco snare 421 can work too. Apparently hardcore/punk/indie producer Jay Maas uses a 421 on snare. His stuff sounds bonkers good in those genres so it's definitely worth a try! I tried the 421 tonight. It's got that splat that's good for the genre, but it also had this hardcore 400-500hz honk that none of the other mics had and needed a big slice right there to sound good.
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Post by mulmany on Jul 2, 2020 20:33:42 GMT -6
svart has a good point... How many people pick the mics they do out of habit? They know how they need to carve it, compress it to sound the way it does. I doubt many engineers pick a mic solely on how it sounds without EQ or compression and that's what ends up on the record. I use an i5, MJ012, and a KM84 clone on snare. I don't own a 57...keep thinking I should just have one around.
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Post by schmalzy on Jul 3, 2020 0:30:32 GMT -6
Apparently hardcore/punk/indie producer Jay Maas uses a 421 on snare. His stuff sounds bonkers good in those genres so it's definitely worth a try! I tried the 421 tonight. It's got that splat that's good for the genre, but it also had this hardcore 400-500hz honk that none of the other mics had and needed a big slice right there to sound good. So the question is: was it usable or so honky it became detrimental? I'm probably going to be cutting some amount of 400-500hz out anyway so if I have to just continue to do that it doesn't bother me...unless it's unbearable! I actually boosted 600hz on a snare the other day for a "natural" sounding record. Or course, it was natural up to a point. Some snare and kick samples of the original drums taken just after the keeper take got blended in to even out some overly dynamic playing and lift the snare away from the hihat. Boosting that 600hz-ish gave a little scuzz and imperfection to the snare sound to make it feel a little less refined. So now I'm super curious about a 421 on snare in my next drum tracking sitch... How was the hihat bleed?
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Post by drumsound on Jul 3, 2020 0:42:36 GMT -6
I don't own a 57...keep thinking I should just have one around. DON'T DO IT!!!!
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Post by Ward on Jul 3, 2020 8:04:10 GMT -6
For those unfamiliar, South African player TUL is making some very interesting microphones. Their G12 is (by all accounts) quite the mic for guitar amps. I'm ordering one now, and will be testing it out on snare also. tulmicrophones.com/index.html
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Post by drsax on Jul 3, 2020 10:15:28 GMT -6
M201 on top and beta 57 underneath over here. Been very satisfied with that combo. Enough that I haven’t tried anything else in years
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Post by svart on Jul 3, 2020 11:26:54 GMT -6
sn t.mp3 (2.54 MB) Ok, the file above has 10 mics on snare top played similarly and edited so that they're essentially back to back with a few seconds pause between. I did this in about 10 minutes so don't expect a scientific thesis.. Mics in order are: Beta57A I5 Old 57 New 57 90 degree adapter ATM63HE Beta57 (original version with slatted guard) Lewitt MTP440DM Heil PR35 MD421 Heil PR22 There is no processing, snares are not normalized so they retain their relative loudness to each other. Snare is Tama Birch/Bubinga 14x6.5 with cast hoops and Remo Emperor CS top head and one moongel 1" in from the rim. Mics were positioned so that their noses were equal to the Remo badge and about 1.5" above the head pointing roughly center. Also, the preamp is Neve 1272 into a SSL alphalink at 24/88. Personal feelings on the mics are that most of them are just shades of each other with the I5, PR35 and MD421 sounding the most different and with some EQ most of them could sound the same in the mix.
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Post by tourtelot on Jul 3, 2020 14:53:49 GMT -6
+1 on the best snare top mic eva! But you know, I like a 57 on top sometimes as well. Just my old-school ways, I guess. D.
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Post by ragan on Jul 3, 2020 15:08:46 GMT -6
+1 on the best snare top mic eva! But you know, I like a 57 on top sometimes as well. Just my old-school ways, I guess. D. I like 57s too. They just work.
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Post by svart on Jul 3, 2020 20:14:39 GMT -6
Surprised nobody has commented on the file I left above. I thought for sure someone would have an opinion on the mic tones.
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Post by svart on Jul 3, 2020 20:20:43 GMT -6
How would you say it sounds compared to any of the others on the list? I've seen these mentioned before but they always seemed rather pricey, but now I see secondhand ones for reasonably cheap. I started using these over 10 years ago. I always felt I had to do some EQing to get 57s to sound right. They had a high mid bump that never worked for me. As soon as I used the Heil I noticed it sounded right to me right away no eq. Now I’m not saying I never use an eq with this but it’s less messing around. Of course I know that all the old timers will make fun of me and tell me the 57 is the perfect mic blah blah blah but the Heil works for me. I also had a mic question back then and they put me straight through to Bob and told me to try the PR30 on overheads and how they used them on a Slash record and everyone in the studio blind picked the Heil mics on the kit. I thought that was cool that the man himself would talk on the phone. I’ve been a fan ever since. I have PR30’s , PR20’s, and PR22’s. I used to have a PR35 but it walked. I got a PR22 and gave it a try. I also bought a broken PR35 and fixed it (just the switch) and gave that a try on snare and on overheads. The PR35 on overheads still sounds kind of "slow", but not in a ribbon sense. I guess I've just become too accustomed to condensers on overheads. On snare it was just "too much" for me. More sensitive like a condenser but with a more ragged frequency spectrum it seemed. An interesting mic, but I'm not sure it's for me. I might try it on vocals soon or flip it. As I mentioned in my post above, the PR22 was good, but I didn't find it too different from the rest of the usual suspects. I'd say it was less middy than a 57, but with slightly more top end. I'll have to play around with EQ and such before I pass more judgement on it. It'll surely find use in the harem of mics I have though.
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Post by drumsound on Jul 4, 2020 2:57:33 GMT -6
For those unfamiliar, South African player TUL is making some very interesting microphones. Their G12 is (by all accounts) quite the mic for guitar amps. I'm ordering one now, and will be testing it out on snare also. tulmicrophones.com/index.html What's the pricing like?
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Post by Ward on Jul 5, 2020 6:30:05 GMT -6
For those unfamiliar, South African player TUL is making some very interesting microphones. Their G12 is (by all accounts) quite the mic for guitar amps. I'm ordering one now, and will be testing it out on snare also. tulmicrophones.com/index.html What's the pricing like? $329 and shipping for the G12
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Post by drumsound on Jul 5, 2020 12:41:07 GMT -6
$329 and shipping for the G12 We hope for a full report once you've got to do some work with it.
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Post by Mister Chase on Jul 10, 2020 18:37:59 GMT -6
Been digging the Soyuz 013 on jazzier stuff.
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Post by Ward on Jul 11, 2020 6:53:53 GMT -6
$329 and shipping for the G12 We hope for a full report once you've got to do some work with it. Last minute change of heart. Maybe in a few months time.
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Post by drumsound on Jul 11, 2020 12:45:53 GMT -6
We hope for a full report once you've got to do some work with it. Last minute change of heart. Maybe in a few months time. That happens. I dig the look of their mics. Pricing seems alright, if they are good...
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Post by delcampo on May 24, 2021 18:30:50 GMT -6
I usually use an AKG D19 strapped together with a 57 and blend them to suit the snare. An AKG D330 can sound good also. I've been interested in trying the Sennheiser E845. Anyone tried it? Curious if the D19 is at all repairable? Capsule not available as I understand.
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Post by rowmat on May 24, 2021 18:51:24 GMT -6
The worse thing about using a SM57 on a snare is not the sound of the snare through the 57. It’s the damn awful off axis high hat bleed. And that alone just about makes the case for using a KM84.
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Post by gravesnumber9 on May 24, 2021 19:06:49 GMT -6
The worse thing about using a SM57 on a snare is not the sound of the snare through the 57. It’s the damn awful off axis high hat bleed. And that alone just about makes the case for using a KM84. Let’s revive this thread fully. I agree. 57 sounds great on snare, terrible on off axis high hat. Those of us that are “natural” style drum people are suffering. 201 sounds appealing. Beyer seems to never miss.
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Post by svart on May 24, 2021 19:29:23 GMT -6
Still on new style beta 57. Nothing has beat it out so far.
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Post by Guitar on May 25, 2021 4:13:07 GMT -6
Still using my Crimson "Yellow" SM57. I find that changing the snare drum, tuning, heads, damping, is a bigger deal than this mic vs an SE V7X or something. Always tweaking those snare drums, hardly ever worrying about the microphone.
Another one that worked, with more of a fat tone, that I didn't mention earlier, is the EV N/D468. And the cool thing about that one is how tiny it is, so you can really maneuver it in a tight kit, like some people have. I wish I still had some of those around for this purpose. 🐱👤
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Post by askomiko on May 25, 2021 6:08:49 GMT -6
EV RE20 and Beyerdynamic m201.
EV is nice and fat and the hihat bleed doesn't remove my teeth.
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