miklo
Junior Member
Posts: 52
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Post by miklo on Mar 11, 2020 15:17:54 GMT -6
How do these mics compare?
What does the tele 251 do sonically different than the c800g?
I have a c800g and love it. I emailed a producer of my favorite vocals and they use a tele 251.
Not interested in how the clones(upton, bock, etc...) compare.
Thanks guys!
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Post by tkaitkai on Mar 11, 2020 15:42:35 GMT -6
Keep in mind that the Tele 251 is also technically a clone. The modern Telefunken USA (or Telefunken Elektroakustik) is not the same company as the original German Telefunken — they simply bought the rights to use the trade name/logo. Even then, AKG manufactured the original 251 (Telefunken Germany was just a distributor). The modern Telefunken USA has no ties to AKG.
It's still one of the best mics money can buy, but the other 251 copies from Bock, Upton, Pearlman, Lawson, etc. are just as worthy.
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Post by aremos on Mar 11, 2020 15:43:20 GMT -6
What does the C-800G do sonically different than the Ela-M 251 (or C-12)? 2 different mics. One will sound better on different sources than the other. If you love your Sony, take it with you & use it. And if you're curious about the AKG, put it up against your producer's 251 & tell us your impressions.
EDIT:
The TeleFunk USA is an imitation of the 251. It presently does not use an AKG CK-12 capsule. It's an in-house made capsule based on the CK-12. Tim Campbell & Haun (MBHO) also create great CK-12 capsules. A lot of the new 251's imitations (can't really be called "clone") are excellent: Upton, Bock, etc
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miklo
Junior Member
Posts: 52
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Post by miklo on Mar 11, 2020 15:46:14 GMT -6
What does the C-800G do sonically different than the Ela-M 251 (or C-12)? 2 different mics. One will sound better on different sources than the other. If you love your Sony, take it with you & use it. And if you're curious about the AKG, put it up against your producer's 251 & tell us your impressions. Not my producer. I just emailed him because the vocals on the reference track sounded so good. Not my track or anything. How's the tube life on the 251? |
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Post by aremos on Mar 11, 2020 15:54:03 GMT -6
The European (AC-701) or the American - E (6072)?
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miklo
Junior Member
Posts: 52
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Post by miklo on Mar 11, 2020 16:04:16 GMT -6
The European (AC-701) or the American - E (6072)? 251E |
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Post by aremos on Mar 11, 2020 16:20:16 GMT -6
The 6072, supposedly, you can still get. The GE 5* is supposed to be the best sonically. Per "life expectancy" it'd be better to ask "Bowie" or someone like that. The AC-701, like the VF-14, doesn't exist, I believe, hence no M49 or U47.
Per personal experience & owning a couple of C-800G's the 6AU6A on the Sony lasts for years!
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Post by drbill on Mar 11, 2020 17:08:21 GMT -6
The 6072, supposedly, you can still get. The GE 5* is supposed to be the best sonically. Per "life expectancy" it'd be better to ask "Bowie" or someone like that. The AC-701, like the VF-14, doesn't exist, I believe, hence no M49 or U47. Per personal experience & owning a couple of C-800G's the 6AU6A on the Sony lasts for years! Klaus told me last week that he can easily get AC701's and that as long as he installs them, they are guaranteed. I would say that 701's are scare on the common market, not that they don't exist. |
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Post by aremos on Mar 11, 2020 17:21:20 GMT -6
Wow! Wonder how many are left world-wide & if, realistically, there could possibly be the union of a KK-49 capsule (Neumann still makes it) & one of these tubes & have someone copy the transformer?
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Post by drbill on Mar 11, 2020 17:38:52 GMT -6
Wow! Wonder how many are left world-wide & if, realistically, there could possibly be the union of a KK-49 capsule (Neumann still makes it) & one of these tubes & have someone copy the transformer? I've heard unsubstantiated rumors that there are thousands, but I have no real idea. Klaus made it sound like it was not a big deal for him to put in a new AC701 into one of my mics that use them. |
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Post by chessparov on Mar 11, 2020 18:21:26 GMT -6
The C800G style is WAY better on my voice, versus a 251 style.
(just GAP version, but it sounded great
for me)
FWIW I've sang/tried out T-Funk/Bock/Warm 251's.
Bock were the best of that bunch IMHO.
The Upton 251, that John K. has,
sounds terrific for/on his voice BTW.
Chris
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Post by johneppstein on Mar 11, 2020 19:21:07 GMT -6
Keep in mind that the Tele 251 is also technically a clone. The modern Telefunken USA (or Telefunken Elektroakustik) is not the same company as the original German Telefunken — they simply bought the rights to use the trade name/logo. Even then, AKG manufactured the original 251 (Telefunken Germany was just a distributor). The modern Telefunken USA has no ties to AKG. It's still one of the best mics money can buy, but the other 251 copies from Bock, Upton, Pearlman, Lawson, etc. are just as worthy. Telefunken never manufactured a microphone. All the famous, vintage Telefunken mics were rebadged mics by either Neumann or AKG.
And yes, it's true that Telefunken USA has no ties to original Telefunken, AKG, or Neumann. They did, however, license the designs.
What does the 251 do that the C800G doesn't? What does a Dodge Charger do that a Chevy Camaro doesn't?
The answer, of course, is nothing. They just do it a bit differently.
Which is why I own over 80 microphones and am still looking for more.
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Post by tkaitkai on Mar 11, 2020 19:27:56 GMT -6
Keep in mind that the Tele 251 is also technically a clone. The modern Telefunken USA (or Telefunken Elektroakustik) is not the same company as the original German Telefunken — they simply bought the rights to use the trade name/logo. Even then, AKG manufactured the original 251 (Telefunken Germany was just a distributor). The modern Telefunken USA has no ties to AKG. It's still one of the best mics money can buy, but the other 251 copies from Bock, Upton, Pearlman, Lawson, etc. are just as worthy. Telefunken never manufactured a microphone. All the famous, vintage Telefunken mics were rebadged mics by either Neumann or AKG.
And yes, it's true that Telefunken USA has no ties to original Telefunken, AKG, or Neumann. They did, however, license the designs.
I might not have been clear enough in my post... I was basically saying the same thing! |
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Post by chessparov on Mar 11, 2020 20:00:33 GMT -6
I have to admit (that like the SM7), of being biased against the C800G "sound", due to its trendiness (or so I thought!). I actually really-very much-like the sound of it!  Chris |
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Post by hadaja on Mar 12, 2020 3:53:48 GMT -6
I sold my bock 251 but kept all my tubes for it that were from Bowie. Let me km ow if your interested and i will dig them up and Bowies description of each tube in the 251. I will sell them off as not to much use to me now
Cheers
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Post by timcampbell on Mar 12, 2020 6:28:19 GMT -6
Well I own a vintage Ela M 251 and I can tell you that there is such a greater breadth of tone coming out of a 251 compared to the Sony.I have never liked the C800G. It sounds so hyped and unnatural. I understand that in pop music with a lot of percussion they cut through but they remind me of the period where exciters were a thing and used on everything.The C800G is a very simple mic,a K67 capsule on Sony's 6au6 amplifier. They are very bright,sounding almost pre eq'ed. It is easy to copy that sound. It isn't as easy to come close to the sound of a 251 using eq.
There's a similar discussion on GS right now.
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
Posts: 14,919 
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Post by ericn on Mar 12, 2020 8:27:50 GMT -6
Well I own a vintage Ela M 251 and I can tell you that there is such a greater breadth of tone coming out of a 251 compared to the Sony.I have never liked the C800G. It sounds so hyped and unnatural. I understand that in pop music with a lot of percussion they cut through but they remind me of the period where exciters were a thing and used on everything.The C800G is a very simple mic,a K67 capsule on Sony's 6au6 amplifier. They are very bright,sounding almost pre eq'ed. It is easy to copy that sound. It isn't as easy to come close to the sound of a 251 using eq. There's a similar discussion on GS right now. I want to like this 400 times! |
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