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Post by iamasound on Sept 21, 2018 13:55:45 GMT -6
There is one that came up for sale for cheap money, CHF 1,000.°° which is now about par, one to one with US$. It looks OK from the photos and seems as if it was never abused. The microphone on offer is a red badge. I have never used one, but what I have read about it is that it isn't a mojo piece but rather will capture the source rather untouched. Can anyone speak of their experience using one of these?
And then there is a KM 84i that is being asked CHF 800 for.
Lord have mercy on my wallet.
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Post by spindrift on Sept 21, 2018 14:33:24 GMT -6
Buy it! I've heard the TLM170i described as an LDC Schoeps which is a pretty accurate description. Super handy mic to have on a stand in the studio. As long as it's an i vs. an R model, the badge color doesn't matter. Insides are the same (FET80 amp). The later R models are FET100 updates and have a quieter amp, but some claim some of the mojo is lost with the FET100 amp. Not sure if that holds water as I only have the "i" models.
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Post by spindrift on Sept 21, 2018 14:51:05 GMT -6
Someday I'll meet someone with a 170R and we can put my 170i up against it and see if there is really a difference. Some of that is likely internet folklore....but then again, I've heard it from multiple sources......so I don't know.
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Post by drbill on Sept 21, 2018 15:11:14 GMT -6
I'm not even sure what a 170 "i" IS. All I've seen are 170's and 170R's. Maybe its a Euro thing? For sure the "R" stands for "remote" - and the polar pattern can be controlled remotely via the remote power supply - N48R2 I believe. Mine is a plain 170 - no i or R, but with a Red badge. Awesome mic. I wouldn't hesitate a second on an R for that price. Also, I believe the R's all have a red band around the mic vs. black. Oh, and yes, buy that KM84 too.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2018 16:50:23 GMT -6
I went for the U89I but the TLM-170 was a cracking mic as well, as far as the red badge hmmm. AFAIK the original release of the TLM-170 was a purple badge and later updated into the "FET 100" class with a red badge..
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Sept 21, 2018 18:57:08 GMT -6
I’m going to sound like a Nike commercial Just Do it!
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Post by aremos on Sept 21, 2018 19:14:23 GMT -6
Until the reissue (67) the 170 (& 89) were Neumann's best mics. Just about every source sounds natural & balance. Though a smaller than usual diaphragm, I liked the "LDC Schoeps" comment by spindrift.
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Sept 21, 2018 19:26:26 GMT -6
Until the reissue (67) the 170 (& 89) were Neumann's best mics. Just about every source sounds natural & balance. Though a smaller than usual diaphragm, I liked the "LDC Schoeps" comment by spindrift. Yeah that’s the thing with the 170 if you don’t bring tone to the party your not going to like it! If you do it’s going to come shunning through.
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Post by jeremygillespie on Sept 21, 2018 19:38:19 GMT -6
Until the reissue (67) the 170 (& 89) were Neumann's best mics. Just about every source sounds natural & balance. Though a smaller than usual diaphragm, I liked the "LDC Schoeps" comment by spindrift. Yeah that’s the thing with the 170 if you don’t bring tone to the party your not going to like it! If you do it’s going to come shunning through. My thoughts exactly. If you’re looking for the vibe of the usual suspect vintage neumann’s - you will be disappointed. Otherwise - it’s a spectacular mic.
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Post by spindrift on Sept 21, 2018 21:52:53 GMT -6
drbill , if you look closely, do you see a lone “i” on your label that wraps the mic? In Neumann speak, the “i” denotes an XLR connector. The first “i” FET80 amp 170s came with a purple badge. It was Neumann’s first transformerless mic. Then they changed to the red badge but kept the FET80 amp....adopting the red badge exclusively for their transformerless line. Also, the “i” models have an “R” on the pattern selection switch, but it is inop. It only works on the 170R, which has a red badge and has the updated quieter FET100 amp. I have purple badged and red badged 170i mics, they look identical down to the circuit revision inside. Again, lots of “internet chatter” about the 170i FET80 having more vibe....but I won’t believe that until I hear it with my own ears. The current 170R is an incredible mic along with it’s elder brother. Still here??? Grab a beer while I spout some more internet folklore RE: the 170! Can you tell I have a soft spot for them? —Tears for Fears Vocal mic for Everybody Wants To Rule The World (and likely others on the Songs From the Big Chair record) —Buena Vista Social Club (Ry Cooder production)?? 80% of the sound is from two 170i in widely spaced Omni —I suspect (but cannot confirm) Agnes Obel records her vocals and lots of things with a 170 and her stuff sounds incredible. She writes, records and mixes her stuff which I found amazing. I’m not for sure that her vocals are the 170, but there is a 170 in these pics and she talks about it in this article: www.soundonsound.com/people/agnes-obel@chase4u has a pair if I recall correctly? How are you getting on with them?
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Post by drbill on Sept 21, 2018 22:21:36 GMT -6
Thanks spindrift !!!!! Your suggest that I look at the mic again just saved me a couple thousand bucks and endless tears..... I looked at the mic earlier, didn't see an "i" and put it away. I just went back to the machine room / mic closet only to find about a QUART of water all over my mics. AAAAAHHhHHHHHHHHHHH!!! I quickly dried everything, and called my HVAC guy late on a friday nite. I'm in the middle of a TV show and can't NOT have my HVAC in the machine room working, and something has made the Fujitsu mini-split HVAC puke out a ton of water. First time that's ever happened!! Something went crazy in the system, so thanks - I wouldn't have checked in there without your question till tomorrow, and that could have been too late..... I owe you a cold one!!! (Not water though.... ) So...on point....I looked again, and low and behold, AWAY from the "170" is a lone, tiny, "i" out by itself in a slightly different color (light and almost undetectable) hidden right behind / underneath the yoke. Go figure. I've owned it for years and never seen it. Mine has a red badge, an "i" under the yoke, and the "R" on the pattern selector switch next to fig8 inside a cardiod type pattern graphic - not the version with the "R" out by itself. So I'm guessing I have a FET80 Amp? Either way, doesn't matter to me, it sounds very nice. Thanks for the serendipitous mic check, and for the fascinating history!! Cheers, bp
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Post by ragan on Sept 21, 2018 22:25:14 GMT -6
Damn. Nice save.
"i" was for "international" and (as stated) denoted XLR connecter, I think.
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Post by spindrift on Sept 21, 2018 22:26:29 GMT -6
drbill Haha, I’ll take you up on that beer someday! I’m glad you found the water....was there any damage or were the mics cased? Yes, to my knowledge, the red badged TLM170i mics are the same as the “purple badge”.
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Post by drbill on Sept 21, 2018 22:27:54 GMT -6
You got it!!! Most of the mics were cased, there were a few that I had been using that were out...... <gasp>>
BTW, mine appears to be a
TLM170 i model. LOL That's how far the "i" is from the 170. So weird....
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Post by spindrift on Sept 21, 2018 22:28:48 GMT -6
drbill, on a side note, I’m going to bet that the drain plug on the condenser unit inside the mini split head is plugged up and the water has no place to drain. Could be an easy cheap fix if you have a ladder, screwdriver, and a flashlight.
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Post by drbill on Sept 21, 2018 22:30:02 GMT -6
drbill , on a side note, I’m going to bet that the drain plug on the condenser unit inside the mini split head is plugged up and the water has no place to drain. Could be an easy cheap fix if you have a ladder, screwdriver, and a flashlight. Will check that! Thx!! Weird thing is it was just serviced 3 weeks ago.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2018 22:30:28 GMT -6
So...on point....I looked again, and low and behold, AWAY from the "170" is a lone, tiny, "i" out by itself in a slightly different color (light and almost undetectable) hidden right behind / underneath the yoke. Go figure. I've owned it for years and never seen it. Mine has a red badge, an "i" under the yoke, and the "R" on the pattern selector switch next to fig8 inside a cardiod type pattern graphic - not the version with the "R" out by itself. So I'm guessing I have a FET80 Amp? Either way, doesn't matter to me, it sounds very nice. Thanks for the serendipitous mic check, and for the fascinating history!! Cheers, bp Red badge is the FET 100, we need to merge these two threads.
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Post by spindrift on Sept 21, 2018 22:44:17 GMT -6
So...on point....I looked again, and low and behold, AWAY from the "170" is a lone, tiny, "i" out by itself in a slightly different color (light and almost undetectable) hidden right behind / underneath the yoke. Go figure. I've owned it for years and never seen it. Mine has a red badge, an "i" under the yoke, and the "R" on the pattern selector switch next to fig8 inside a cardiod type pattern graphic - not the version with the "R" out by itself. So I'm guessing I have a FET80 Amp? Either way, doesn't matter to me, it sounds very nice. Thanks for the serendipitous mic check, and for the fascinating history!! Cheers, bp Red badge is the FET 100, we need to merge these two threads. Not true to my knowledge...but I could be wrong. Please re-read my long thread with the Agnes Obel article and video link. I have 3 purple badges and one red badge, all TLM170i. They all look identical inside. The FET100 has to look different inside with different circuit revision stickers and all that.
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Post by spindrift on Sept 21, 2018 22:48:40 GMT -6
I’m A) a big nerd and B) bored so I’ll go open them up and double check....
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Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2018 22:50:09 GMT -6
Red badge is the FET 100, we need to merge these two threads. Not true to my knowledge...but I could be wrong. Please re-read my long thread with the Agnes Obel article and video link. I have 3 purple badges and one red badge, all TLM170i. They all look identical inside. The FET100 has to look different inside with different circuit revision stickers and all that. en-de.neumann.com/tlm-170-rThat took me 5 seconds to find, I quote: "The TLM 170 R was conceived with high resolution in mind. As early as 1983 it achieved an enormous dynamic range of 130 dB. It was the first microphone to use Neumann’s fet 100 technology with a transformerless output stage ensuring sonic transparency and powerful bass transmission, even at highest signal levels." It was Klaus that shared the wealth in terms of differences between the old and new models..
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Post by drbill on Sept 21, 2018 22:58:27 GMT -6
@shawdowamd - I don't think anyone is disputing what you quoted about the R model. But just to make things less transparent, there ARE 170i's with red badges though that are NOT "R"'s. Both Spindrift and I have them.
My 170i has a red BADGE, but not the red STRIPE that the R has.
This is almost as confusing as Gefell mics. Um...no, nothing is that confusing. LOL
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Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2018 23:07:50 GMT -6
@shawdowamd - I don't think anyone is disputing what you quoted about the R model. But just to make things less transparent, there ARE 170i's with red badges though that are NOT "R"'s. Both Spindrift and I have them. My 170i has a red BADGE, but not the red STRIPE that the R has. This is almost as confusing as Gefell mics. Um...no, nothing is that confusing. LOL Ok, read what Klaus said: repforums.prosoundweb.com/index.php?topic=31670.0Heh, you think that's bad.. You should of heard John Willet describe what happened between Neumann an Gefell . It could be the FET 80, but AFAIK anything after 2001 was FET 100..
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Post by drbill on Sept 21, 2018 23:20:30 GMT -6
I read that. I didn't see anywhere that there were "no red badged "i" models". I don't think anyone is disputing that the R models have the FET100 amp. Only that there are both purple and red badged "i" models with FET80 Amps. I'm looking forward to spindrift opening his up. <thumbsup>
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Post by spindrift on Sept 21, 2018 23:24:18 GMT -6
Assuming these two mics haven’t been messed with, they look identical under the hood with the exception of the different colored tantalum caps. Both have through-the-hole componentry and not the surface mount tech of the newer TLM170R. Maybe all TLM170i are FET80 and the switched to FET100 upon the release of the R?
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Post by spindrift on Sept 21, 2018 23:26:30 GMT -6
Oh I just had a devious thought.....my purple badged 170s have the coveted blue tantalums!!!
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