|
|
Post by mcirish on Apr 24, 2018 13:14:57 GMT -6
I've used MD421's for micing up toms for years. I've got the original ones. After some judicious EQing, I usually wind up with a good sound. Recently, I needed another tom mic and didn't want to buy another 421. After doing a lot of reading, I ended up buying some ATM230 mics. I got three for the price I'd have to pay for one MD421. I did some shootouts this past weekend and found the ATM230's to sound better than the MD421's, at least on this particular drum kit. The cymbal bleed was less and the bleed that was there sounded better; less odd harshness. Honestly, I typically gate the tom mics for that reason. The ATM230 also has a bit bigger bottom end to it than the MD421 and a bit less mids. Almost pre-EQed in the way a Beta 52A is on kick. I know the ATM230 is intended as a live mic, but for now, I think I will do a few more sessions with them as the only tom mics. Which leaves me with some MD421's. Anyone try them on the following?
1) Kick? (I usually use a Beta 52A and AT4047)
2) Guitar amp? (usually a 57 or i5)
3) Bass amp? (usually a CM7 or Beta 52A)
4) Vocals? (usually a CM7 or modified CV4 or AT4060)
5) what else???
|
|
|
|
Post by jeremygillespie on Apr 24, 2018 13:21:48 GMT -6
It’s a good inside kick mic for the punch.
It can work pretty well as a snare mic, but again, the hat bleed can be ugly.
Works great for bass amp.
Works really well on gtr amp if you pair it with something else. Just a little blended in can add some nice snarl.
|
|
|
|
Post by svart on Apr 24, 2018 13:29:55 GMT -6
421 on bass amp is a common usage in rock and metal.
|
|
|
|
Post by pope on Apr 24, 2018 13:57:26 GMT -6
Brass!
I never liked the 421's on toms or anywhere near a drumkit for that matter. The amount of bleed is unacceptable.
|
|
|
|
Post by johneppstein on Apr 24, 2018 14:07:50 GMT -6
IIRC The Grateful Dead used them as vocal mics live for some time, for whatever that's worth.
I find that they make excellent paperweights, as they don't roll.
|
|
|
|
Post by adamjbrass on Apr 24, 2018 14:39:58 GMT -6
I once put one on the handle of a metal trash can, turned upside down, used for Percussion. The client wanted it more "trashy" so it was nearly the perfect mic to capture the handle wiggling around.
|
|
|
|
Post by mcirish on Apr 24, 2018 14:52:38 GMT -6
Just read somewhere that it works on banjo too. No... that isn't a joke, though it could be. I do a lot of recording with traditional bluegrass instruments in a non-bluegrass setting, kind of like Punch Brothers with a drum kit. Fiddle and banjo are always tough to get mic'd right. I figured the MD421 would bite too much on banjo, but I guess it might be worth a try. I will definitely give it a shot on a bass amp.
|
|
|
|
Post by mcirish on Apr 24, 2018 14:53:55 GMT -6
Brass! I never liked the 421's on toms or anywhere near a drumkit for that matter. The amount of bleed is unacceptable. Brass? I would normally try a ribbon on brass but I should at least give this a shot. |
|
|
|
Post by matt@IAA on Apr 24, 2018 14:56:02 GMT -6
421 with a 57 is a great way to mic a heavy rock guitar sound. Two amps, two cabs, two mics per cab, summed into one track, then double-tracked in stereo = huge.
Also they work great on bass cabs.
|
|
|
|
Post by pope on Apr 24, 2018 15:32:46 GMT -6
Brass! I never liked the 421's on toms or anywhere near a drumkit for that matter. The amount of bleed is unacceptable. Brass? I would normally try a ribbon on brass but I should at least give this a shot. Well, I also prefer ribbons on brass but sometimes a 421 works better. Especially on sax (althought technically is a wind instrument)  |
|
|
|
Post by guitfiddler on Apr 24, 2018 15:51:15 GMT -6
Kick drum! Guitar Cab! I like it on floor Tom too, but you have to have a drummer that can control himself and not bash the hell out of the ride!
|
|
|
|
Post by spindrift on Apr 24, 2018 15:51:19 GMT -6
Brass! I never liked the 421's on toms or anywhere near a drumkit for that matter. The amount of bleed is unacceptable. For me, it's the quality of the bleed that is at issue....harsh city.  I'm using them for inside the kick and sometimes EGtr cabs. |
|
|
|
Post by iamasound on Apr 24, 2018 16:15:01 GMT -6
You can use them on vocals, to mic an amp, a drum kit and a guitar, sitars and...anyway, these fine folk did one fine evening, they used them everywhere.
The first song, Wha Wha, after Ravi Shankar, is utterly amazing, like they all had been playing the song for ages...incredibly tight and uplifting. It was the first album that I ever bought.
|
|
|
|
Post by drbill on Apr 24, 2018 22:10:22 GMT -6
I use em as a cowbell beater when I don't have a drumstick. That's the best use of em I've found so far. The last place I let them near is toms.... Hate em on toms. |
|
|
|
Post by EmRR on Apr 25, 2018 7:11:39 GMT -6
I've had a few people sound best on them for lead vocals.
|
|
|
|
Post by mcirish on Apr 25, 2018 9:13:04 GMT -6
Thank you for all the suggestions. It's always good to have options, so I will hang on to my MD421's and give them a chance on different sources. just not toms anymore. Those ATM230's sound great.
|
|
ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
Posts: 14,934 
Member is Online
|
Post by ericn on Apr 25, 2018 11:46:25 GMT -6
The 421 like most utility dynamics can work on just about anything, but it is a flavor many hate, kind of like the SM57.
The interesting thing is close micing was the last thing Dr Sennhiser was thinking of when he designed the 421, the original purpose was distant micing of orchestras, so you might find it more pleasing if you back it off some. For the life of me I can’t remember what EQ setting it is but one of them is for compensating for distant micing, see Jon Lipp I was listening 😎
|
|
|
|
Post by johneppstein on Apr 25, 2018 13:31:19 GMT -6
Kick drum! Guitar Cab! I like it on floor Tom too, but you have to have a drummer that can control himself and not bash the hell out of the ride! I've used them on kick - there was something of a fad for them in the early '80s - but I never really liked tham, although they definitely beat a 57 <cough, cough>. They don't have the bottom I look for in a kick mic. I've used them on floor tom quite a bit for live punk shows. I don't use them for recording at all, anymore. Maybe on a sax if I didn't have an alternate, but I'd be more likely to try one of the small EV Variable D mics if I didn't have an RE-20 free. Problem with using them on sax is that nasty off-axis tone - half the sound of a sax actually comes from the holes, not the bell. |
|
|
|
Post by nomatic on Apr 25, 2018 13:47:39 GMT -6
Best mic for Home defense......
And thats it....
|
|
|
|
Post by EmRR on Apr 25, 2018 13:54:45 GMT -6
Best mic for Home defense...... And thats it.... Nah, you want a Buchanan hammer for that. 421 body breaks too easily. : ) |
|
|
|
Post by matt@IAA on Apr 25, 2018 14:38:05 GMT -6
All you guys sayin' how much you hate 'em and use 'em as doorstops and whanot....I'll gladly send you an actual paperweight or doorstop or whatever to trade. I'll pay shipping both ways. |
|
|
|
Post by drbill on Apr 25, 2018 15:05:51 GMT -6
Why would we give em away when there's so many suckers (oops, er, believers) out there who will pay good money for them? And there ARE believers who have no ears lining up to sing the 421's praises on toms. I have one client who asked for 421's on toms THREE times. I told him no all 3 times, and he still pleaded. So I put up 421's and my fav tom mics. All three times, he chose my favorites, but every time he came back he AGAIN asked for the 421's. I fully expect on visit #4 he will ask for them again. Haha!
I hate having to put up 2 pairs of mics on toms just to prove an already proven point.
I ended up selling two so I wouldn't have to use them on toms again. Kept 1 or 2 just for alternates on Cab's.
|
|
|
|
Post by jeremygillespie on Apr 25, 2018 17:16:51 GMT -6
Why would we give em away when there's so many suckers (oops, er, believers) out there who will pay good money for them? And there ARE believers who have no ears lining up to sing the 421's praises on toms. I have one client who asked for 421's on toms THREE times. I told him no all 3 times, and he still pleaded. So I put up 421's and my fav tom mics. All three times, he chose my favorites, but every time he came back he AGAIN asked for the 421's. I fully expect on visit #4 he will ask for them again. Haha! I hate having to put up 2 pairs of mics on toms just to prove an already proven point. I ended up selling two so I wouldn't have to use them on toms again. Kept 1 or 2 just for alternates on Cab's. What’s your Tom mic? I moved away from 421’s to M88’s years ago for toms. |
|
|
|
Post by drbill on Apr 25, 2018 21:43:32 GMT -6
What? ? ? You want me to make my secret weapons public?? A guy's gotta have SOME secrets.... |
|
|
|
Post by happychap on Apr 25, 2018 22:44:50 GMT -6
|
|
