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Post by brewer on Feb 10, 2018 10:10:43 GMT -6
I initially bought a km84 for acoustic guitar exclusively. I 've been singing into a 3U gz251 and/or a violet design globe for vocals, often switching between the two depending on the song to see which sounded better. Mind you I'm still in the experimental phase of recording and searching for a sound. So far the gz251 sounds very good but I haven't gotten my vocals to sit with the AC very well with that mic. Same with the Violet design. They both sound bigger and more in your face than the AC. I'm singing about 12" to 18" away from the mics. I decided to sing through the km84 and it sounded "right" and sits in with the AC the best I've heard.
So my question would be, if I were to search for another LDC mic for vocals, which mic would you recommend that best matches a km84?
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Post by deehope on Feb 10, 2018 10:37:59 GMT -6
I initially bought a km84 for acoustic guitar exclusively. I 've been singing into a 3U gz251 and/or a violet design globe for vocals, often switching between the two depending on the song to see which sounded better. Mind you I'm still in the experimental phase of recording and searching for a sound. So far the gz251 sounds very good but I haven't gotten my vocals to sit with the AC very well with that mic. Same with the Violet design. They both sound bigger and more in your face than the AC. I'm singing about 12" to 18" away from the mics. I decided to sing through the km84 and it sounded "right" and sits in with the AC the best I've heard. So my question would be, if I were to search for another LDC mic for vocals, which mic would you recommend that best matches a km84? hilarious. This is like dejavu. I had a similar thread on here with the exact same feeling. It was Bob ohlsson who stated motown used km84 on there vocals, so I gave it a try and came to the same conclusion as you. I think the consensus was theres really no ldc that sounds like it. I did find a diy mic based off of its circuit, but cant find any comparisons.
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Post by ragan on Feb 10, 2018 10:48:05 GMT -6
Black Keys “Brothers” album used a KM84 on Dan Auerbach’s vocals. Pointed downward from like forehead height or higher.
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Post by drbill on Feb 10, 2018 10:52:38 GMT -6
Find yourself a KM86. Not a LDC, but essentially a more flexible KM84. And I think - if I am not mistaken - that Motown used the KM 86's not 84's for vox.
If you are insistent on an LDC (and I understand the concept), then try finding a vintage U87. Those two mics work very well together. Actually, on Ac Gtr in stereo they are phenominal - 84 at 12th fret, 87 over right shoulder pointing towards sound hole. That will mean you need a couple of 87's though. LOL
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Post by johneppstein on Feb 10, 2018 11:06:57 GMT -6
I initially bought a km84 for acoustic guitar exclusively. I 've been singing into a 3U gz251 and/or a violet design globe for vocals, often switching between the two depending on the song to see which sounded better. Mind you I'm still in the experimental phase of recording and searching for a sound. So far the gz251 sounds very good but I haven't gotten my vocals to sit with the AC very well with that mic. Same with the Violet design. They both sound bigger and more in your face than the AC. I'm singing about 12" to 18" away from the mics. I decided to sing through the km84 and it sounded "right" and sits in with the AC the best I've heard. So my question would be, if I were to search for another LDC mic for vocals, which mic would you recommend that best matches a km84? Why not just get another 84?
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Post by brewer on Feb 10, 2018 11:35:53 GMT -6
I initially bought a km84 for acoustic guitar exclusively. I 've been singing into a 3U gz251 and/or a violet design globe for vocals, often switching between the two depending on the song to see which sounded better. Mind you I'm still in the experimental phase of recording and searching for a sound. So far the gz251 sounds very good but I haven't gotten my vocals to sit with the AC very well with that mic. Same with the Violet design. They both sound bigger and more in your face than the AC. I'm singing about 12" to 18" away from the mics. I decided to sing through the km84 and it sounded "right" and sits in with the AC the best I've heard. So my question would be, if I were to search for another LDC mic for vocals, which mic would you recommend that best matches a km84? Why not just get another 84? That has crossed my mind. As silly as it sounds it's the psychological aspect of feeling the need to sing into a bigger mic, which I think is what dr.Bill was getting at.
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Post by nnajar on Feb 10, 2018 11:47:18 GMT -6
You should try the schoeps v4u
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Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2018 11:53:46 GMT -6
Why not just get another 84? That has crossed my mind. As silly as it sounds it's the psychological aspect of feeling the need to sing into a bigger mic, which I think is what dr.Bill was getting at. Can't you just sing with a blindfold on? I wish KM84s weren't so expensive these days. Be happy to pay $1k for one, but not more I think.
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Post by drbill on Feb 10, 2018 11:55:12 GMT -6
I think KM 84's may be the most bang for the buck bargain priced mic out there. $1k? Pfffft!! Cheap for such a magnificent mic. IMO.
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Post by johneppstein on Feb 10, 2018 12:16:18 GMT -6
Why not just get another 84? That has crossed my mind. As silly as it sounds it's the psychological aspect of feeling the need to sing into a bigger mic, which I think is what dr.Bill was getting at. If it's really a problem, put up a dummy.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2018 12:43:33 GMT -6
I think KM 84's may be the most bang for the buck bargain priced mic out there. $1k? Pfffft!! Cheap for such a magnificent mic. IMO. Exactly, $1k would be a good price. So can you point me in the direction of any going for that amount?
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Post by brewer on Feb 10, 2018 13:16:21 GMT -6
You should try the schoeps v4u I'll check that out thanks. The vintage u87 is also a mic I've been wanting to try. I'm going to GC today to pick up another pop filter, I'll see if they have any of these in the rental dept.
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Post by mjheck on Feb 10, 2018 13:44:45 GMT -6
I'll add that I hd previously thought the 84 a little spitty on vocals. Then one day I tried it pushed by the Silver Bullet and running into the Zulu. The result was awesome.
I now put up that chain and my U48 together for all vocals. One is sometimes better than the other but both are terrific.
MJH
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Post by drbill on Feb 10, 2018 15:02:34 GMT -6
I think KM 84's may be the most bang for the buck bargain priced mic out there. $1k? Pfffft!! Cheap for such a magnificent mic. IMO. Exactly, $1k would be a good price. So can you point me in the direction of any going for that amount? Since I last looked, the supply seems way down. There's one for $1250 on eBay. Definitely worth it if the mic and seller are good. But yeah, you're right. They seem to have gone up. I bought a pair of dead mint KM86's a year ago for $2500 with original boxes as well as pelican case and shock mounts. Keep your eyes open I guess. Good luck.
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Post by drbill on Feb 10, 2018 15:03:45 GMT -6
That has crossed my mind. As silly as it sounds it's the psychological aspect of feeling the need to sing into a bigger mic, which I think is what dr.Bill was getting at. If it's really a problem, put up a dummy.Yeah! I'm available for sessions....
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Post by mjheck on Feb 10, 2018 15:24:51 GMT -6
I initially bought a km84 for acoustic guitar exclusively. I 've been singing into a 3U gz251 and/or a violet design globe for vocals, often switching between the two depending on the song to see which sounded better. Mind you I'm still in the experimental phase of recording and searching for a sound. So far the gz251 sounds very good but I haven't gotten my vocals to sit with the AC very well with that mic. Same with the Violet design. They both sound bigger and more in your face than the AC. I'm singing about 12" to 18" away from the mics. I decided to sing through the km84 and it sounded "right" and sits in with the AC the best I've heard. So my question would be, if I were to search for another LDC mic for vocals, which mic would you recommend that best matches a km84? Oh, and to address the actual question - after purchasing a second KM84, I sold my vintage 87 and my Gefell UMT 70. I really, really liked the Gefell (the 87, not as much) but found the 84's just did more and sounded better. Now, I rarely have more than three or four mics up at any one time, so I can afford to be limited in my options to a degree. MJH
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Post by wiz on Feb 10, 2018 15:55:08 GMT -6
I often record backing vocals on a KM84. I own a 70s U87 and it sounds great... good combo. Not much you can't do with those.
Cheers
Wiz
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Post by rowmat on Feb 10, 2018 16:21:01 GMT -6
I've said this before but if you had nothing except KM84's to record everything you would have fantastic sounding tracks as long as you avoid over modulating the capsule with excessive low end.
Also anything picked up off axis won't sound like crap.
Mic a snare with a KM84 and the off axis high hats still sound focussed and clean. Off axis hats via a SM57 sound like nasal, harsh, fizzy shite.
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Post by drbill on Feb 10, 2018 17:34:22 GMT -6
I often record backing vocals on a KM84. I own a 70s U87 and it sounds great... good combo. Not much you can't do with those. Cheers Wiz Indeed. You can easily make a record with those two mics alone!!! <<thumbsup>>
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Post by johneppstein on Feb 10, 2018 17:55:31 GMT -6
I've said this before but if you had nothing except KM84's to record everything you would have fantastic sounding tracks as long as you avoid over modulating the capsule with excessive low end. Also anything picked up off axis won't sound like crap. Mic a snare with a KM84 and the off axis high hats still sound focussed and clean. Off axis hats via a SM57 sound like nasal, harsh, fizzy shite. That's the problem with 57s or <shudder> 421s on toms, too!
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Post by Martin John Butler on Feb 10, 2018 18:04:28 GMT -6
I tried the KM84 on vocals because Bob's post made me curious. It was surprisingly good. Then I compared the Soyuz 0-13 SDC to the KM84 on vocals, and the Soyuz was way better, really, not even close, even though not technically a vocal mic, it was much nicer than most of the under $1,000 mics I'd tried before.
One of my favorite combos is a KM84 on acoustic and a Neumann style LDC for vocal.
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Post by aremos on Feb 10, 2018 18:56:16 GMT -6
Has anyone compared the Schoeps equivalent (CMC 5 or 6 with an MK4 -or other- capsule) to the Neumann?
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Post by adamjbrass on Feb 10, 2018 19:48:41 GMT -6
i love when SDC sound great on Vocals. I often use the M-300 (with a pop filter or windsock) or Josephson E22S
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Post by Bob Olhsson on Feb 10, 2018 20:49:34 GMT -6
You guys should shut up about the 84! 🤔 Be sure to shock mount it.
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Post by johneppstein on Feb 10, 2018 21:17:37 GMT -6
You guys should shut up about the 84! 🤔 Be sure to shock mount it. YES, definitely! I need to find at least 3 more before the price goes up.
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