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Post by Martin John Butler on Aug 7, 2017 14:07:17 GMT -6
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Aug 7, 2017 14:23:53 GMT -6
The one you linked to sounds like somebody more concerned with bling than sonics , I'd pass buy a virgin send it to JW.
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Post by Martin John Butler on Aug 7, 2017 14:28:26 GMT -6
I just might do that, but first I'll check with him on suggestions and prices. The upgrades the guy made do seem like something I wouldn't mind having though, and maybe they're the kind that Jim might do anyway?
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Aug 7, 2017 14:45:22 GMT -6
I just might do that, but first I'll check with him on suggestions and prices. The upgrades the guy made do seem like something I wouldn't mind having though, and maybe they're the kind that Jim might do anyway? There are a bunch of Adcom modders out there of the 1/2 dozen or so I have heard Jim's always rises to the top, many simply put in designer label parts, some have gutted everything but the chassis, many make it sound like the II can sound like the original.
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Post by johneppstein on Aug 7, 2017 21:32:03 GMT -6
Chase, I can't help it with the NS-10's ;-) I used them every day for a decade, and that was only because they were a standard I needed for work then. To me, they were nasty sounding little things. I know them so well though, I'd be OK with them again for a while. You have the Barefoot's now right? I'm going to guess that once you get used to them, most of the under $1,600 monitors will fall into the "kind of sucks" category for you as well :-). People raved about the Adam A7X, I bought them, since they were better than most others in their class, but they were smeared in the highs and difficult to mix accurately with. I think I'll be grateful my friend will give me his scratched up NS-10's and leave the Event's alone. Thanks for your thoughts and suggestions guys. The guy selling the amp to me lives around an hour and a half drive away. He started to drive in today but turned around because the weekend traffic was too heavy. I'll probably hook up with him tomorrow or the next day. He's selling an Alesis RA 500 Amplifier for $150. It should do what I want without my having to invest much. Back when I used power amps I liked Adcom and was very happy with them. The Alesis looks nice because it should be quiet enough and stay cool enough to be in the rack underneath my desk. I dunno, maybe things have changed since I left The City a year ago, but that price seems maybe a bit high. Class AB power amps were/are going pretty cheap around here, dunno about where you are. And Alesis isn't a brand I'd look at for power amps. Last time I was at Audio Images Corp. they had a bunch of used power amps...
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Post by Martin John Butler on Aug 7, 2017 21:51:30 GMT -6
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Post by winetree on Aug 7, 2017 22:38:20 GMT -6
Martin, Both of the above links are the same.
As for the NS10 recap, I don't remember the values, I can't take them down and take them apart to find out. The procedure is to remove the 4 screws, and lift out the woofer. Mark and remove the 2 wires connected to the woofer and set it aside. Remove the batting and look inside to see the values of the 2 caps on the crossover. After finding replacements, just remove the caps, solder in the new ones and reassemble. Be aware there is some down time what with finding the values and obtaining the new ones. I might be able to find a schematic. I'll a post a site for the new Caps as I'm going to recap the x-overs on my Monoprice Jim Williams recommended Air speakers.
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Post by Martin John Butler on Aug 7, 2017 22:49:29 GMT -6
I amended the links to include the new one, thanks winetree.
One thing I'm curious about, the modded one changed the outputs from 4 to 2. The other one still has the original speaker switching capability. Would changing the four to two actually improve sound quality?
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Post by winetree on Aug 7, 2017 23:03:29 GMT -6
I don't think so. Power isn't going to both speaker outputs at the same. It's switched.
The 4 outs allow switching the power from one set of speakers to the other. You might want to be able to switch between 2 sets of speakers for mix comparisons. You lose that ability with the 2 post conversion.
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Post by Martin John Butler on Aug 8, 2017 8:07:03 GMT -6
I've been thinking on that before buying one of those two. I haven't done the two speaker thing for a long time, but it might be fun to get some mix cubes and easily A-B them. That's the only issue that's stopping me from just getting the upgraded one. I've sent them an email asking for any more details they may have regarding the power supply upgrade.
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Post by jimwilliams on Aug 8, 2017 9:21:02 GMT -6
The speaker switch is convenient. You can select both the same time as well, be aware of parallel loading. I bought my 535 new back in 1991. I recently replaced the mains caps to 10,000 uf Nichicon, The originals were 6800 uf. It now takes about 30 seconds to go dark after shutdown.
I'm also offering a deluxe mod for these amps that brings them up to the best quality level. I'm using Mills wirewound emitter resistors and Vishay naked foil VAR resistors, best available, but very expensive. I'm also using 4% RoHS silver solder.
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Post by Martin John Butler on Aug 8, 2017 9:33:21 GMT -6
Thanks Jim, good to hear from you. I have to test my friend's NS-10's today before I make a final decision on which 535 to get. The whole idea was for me to get something half decent cheap, because I had some unexpected medical expenses this year and had to sell some gear. If his NS 10's are working, then this will only cost me for an amp. If not, I'd have to revisit and think on a cheap active pair of monitors, but I haven't heard any lower priced models I like at all yet.
I sent you an email yesterday. Can you please send me the information regarding cost for the mods to either that email address or in a PM. I also sent a PM to you here at RealGear.
* I'm curious if removing the speaker switching would make a noticeable difference in sound quality. I kinda like the idea of switching without an external box, but the one that's modded that eliminated the speaker switching is at a nearby store and would be easy to pick up. The upgraded RCA inputs and binding posts seem nice. I've sent the seller an email asking for more details on what was done to the power supply, but they haven't gotten back to me.
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Post by johneppstein on Aug 8, 2017 12:44:18 GMT -6
Martin, I'm sorry but I don't have enough experience with Adcom to feel qualified in venturing an opinion in this case. But I do appreciate your asking.
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Post by Martin John Butler on Aug 8, 2017 13:43:42 GMT -6
Well, the NS-10's are in da house! I'll decide tomorrow either way on the amp.
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Post by winetree on Aug 8, 2017 23:22:13 GMT -6
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Post by Martin John Butler on Aug 9, 2017 8:18:21 GMT -6
Big thanks for that link Winetree! That was great info, I'd forgotten there were different versions of NS-10's. The one I got is the Studio version. Hopefully that's good. I see they're made to lay horizontally. My desk isn't big enough for that. I was planning on getting a new desk anyway, so I'll either get a smaller desk and some speaker stands or a larger desk. The cabinet has lots of scratches, and I'm thinking of using some spray paint to touch them up. Nothing heavy, just a dusting. My guess is it's a satin finish and not semi-gloss. One of the cones has stains on it, the other a few lighter stain lines. I can't tell if it's from water or age, or maybe just moisture, but the speakers themselves have no dents at all, which is nice. Attachments:
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Post by Vincent R. on Aug 9, 2017 8:42:36 GMT -6
Out of curiousity do the NS-10s have a similar sound to the HS8s currently on the market? I have experience with the HS8s, but none with the NS-10s and am curious.
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Post by Martin John Butler on Aug 9, 2017 9:02:14 GMT -6
NS-10's are a curious phenomenon. They were hugely popular in studios in the 80's. I never loved them, but then I recorded and mixed at least 100 radio and TV commercials with them and never once had an issue with sound quality when I heard it on the radio, so it was doing something very right. In the article below, it explains how the time alignment quality contributed to extreme accuracy in the mids. I just found this story about the history of the NS-10, which was a good read. : www.soundonsound.com/reviews/yamaha-ns10-story
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Post by jeremygillespie on Aug 9, 2017 9:55:32 GMT -6
Out of curiousity do the NS-10s have a similar sound to the HS8s currently on the market? I have experience with the HS8s, but none with the NS-10s and am curious. They sound nothing alike IMO.
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Aug 9, 2017 10:12:04 GMT -6
NS-10's are a curious phenomenon. They were hugely popular in studios in the 80's. I never loved them, but then I recorded and mixed at least 100 radio and TV commercials with them and never once had an issue with sound quality when I heard it on the radio, so it was doing something very right. In the article below, it explains how the time alignment quality contributed to extreme accuracy in the mids. I just found this story about the history of the NS-10, which was a good read. : www.soundonsound.com/reviews/yamaha-ns10-storyThe History I was told from the designer and President of Yamaha is very different. That story misses the true origin was as part of a Cheap all in one system, before it became its own catalog number and had its own cut sheet. The NS1000 was an attempt to show they could design a great speaker, it has a mostly Japanese cult following, Yamaha 's Transducer engineers were both proud and embarrassed by the NS10, proud that a speaker they had spent so little time & effort on was the studio standard, embarrassed that such a piece of crap was what they were known for. You can tell the true original by the fact that seams push more air than the port of most ported boxes. Everybody I know who sold them never heard any studio say they were great or even good, they bought them because every picture in the magazine had them on the meterbridge and they were cheap! NS10's always made me sad because Yamaha has the talent and abilities to build drivers and speakers as good as anybody in the world, Even John Meyers of Meyers HD1 fame, will tell you Yamaha can build them as good as anybody.
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Aug 9, 2017 10:12:37 GMT -6
Out of curiousity do the NS-10s have a similar sound to the HS8s currently on the market? I have experience with the HS8s, but none with the NS-10s and am curious. They sound nothing alike IMO. Thank god!
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Post by Martin John Butler on Aug 9, 2017 21:13:24 GMT -6
I just accepted a counter offer of $170 for the modded Adcom 535. I figured the $20-$30 difference was worth the mods. It'll take a few days to get here because the store that was selling the amp is closed for a few more days for their summer vacation. I'm anxious to fire this up and see how it sounds. After my Avantone Abbeys, which were incredible, it might naturally be a let down and could take me some time to adjust, but I remember working well with NS-10's, though it's been a long time and my tastes have evolved. I have the NS-10M STUDIO version. I think I used to have the original model, which people put tissue on the tweeter to dampen the sharp edge a bit. I'm hoping the Studio version will sound a little better than the original. I read that the Studio was an improvement here: www.soundonsound.com/reviews/yamaha-ns10-story
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Post by johneppstein on Aug 10, 2017 1:22:26 GMT -6
NS10's always made me sad because Yamaha has the talent and abilities to build drivers and speakers as good as anybody in the world, Even John Meyers of Meyers HD1 fame, will tell you Yamaha can build them as good as anybody. I don't think I'd be violating my NDA at this late date, but when I was doing some assembly work for Meyers on the MSL3s, he was actually importing the Yamaha 2" throat drivers by the packing flat, testing them, and applying mods that I'm not at liberty to discuss to the ones that passed - but yeah, before Meyer was making their own drivers (which I assume they are now, it's been a long time since I worked for them), their 2" throat, 4" VC HF dtivers were modded Yammies. Really good drivers, too, right up there with the JBL 2441 and Gauss HF4000. And yeah, NS10s are overpriced, overhyped junk, albeit junk that does definitely serve a specific purpose.
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Aug 10, 2017 7:22:29 GMT -6
NS10's always made me sad because Yamaha has the talent and abilities to build drivers and speakers as good as anybody in the world, Even John Meyers of Meyers HD1 fame, will tell you Yamaha can build them as good as anybody. I don't think I'd be violating my NDA at this late date, but when I was doing some assembly work for Meyers on the MSL3s, he was actually importing the Yamaha 2" throat drivers by the packing flat, testing them, and applying mods that I'm not at liberty to discuss to the ones that passed - but yeah, before Meyer was making their own drivers (which I assume they are now, it's been a long time since I worked for them), their 2" throat, 4" VC HF dtivers were modded Yammies. Really good drivers, too, right up there with the JBL 2441 and Gauss HF4000. And yeah, NS10s are overpriced, overhyped junk, albeit junk that does definitely serve a specific purpose. I couldn't remember what Box John used Yamaha in .
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Post by Martin John Butler on Aug 10, 2017 8:12:30 GMT -6
I agreed to the offer from the store that was selling the modded Adcom GFA-435 yesterday, but their store is closed until next Wednesday. They apologized and offered to rescind the offer, freeing me to buy something else. I'm torn between waiting and just buying from someone else. Still, being Thursday, even if I bought one from someone else and the mailed it tomorrow, I probably wouldn't receive it before Tuesday next week or Wednesday, depending on location of the sender. I live less than an hour away from the store, so when they do ship it'll only take a day or two.
Ugh.. I just can't seem to catch a break this year. Every single thing I've done keeps hitting snags. Hopefully that energy will change as I near my birthday next month. I'm hoping to have a birthday/album release party. I need some speakers to finish two mixes and master.. clocks are ticking..
I guess I'll take a quick look at eBay in case something else popped up since I last looked. Since I made my offer, I'm kinda stuck on getting this one that's already modded. Even if its not a top of the line Jim Williams mod, it should be an improvement over the stock piece.
I wish it had 1/4" inputs or XLR inputs.
I'll either use a standard 1/4' cable with an RCA adapter, or buy new cables with 1/4" > RCA terminations already. How would you guys hook up an amp like this with an interface like my UAD Apollo?
I also still have the Mogami 1/4" to XLR cables I used when I had my active speakers. Since they're good cables, is there such a thing as an XLR > RCA adapter, and is that any worse or better than the other types on connections I mentioned?
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